please help with k98 bayonet

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Reibert-Austria
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#16

Post by Reibert-Austria » 29 Oct 2007, 19:21

Hi, Andy !

The mark looks like: K 13

Reibert
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AndyB
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#17

Post by AndyB » 30 Oct 2007, 09:46

Thanks Reibert for the detailed picture, very nice , K13 is correct i believe. best regards,Andy


Henckles
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Re: please help with k98 bayonet

#18

Post by Henckles » 01 Oct 2010, 01:07

Hey, you guys seem to know bayonets well and I've just started to collect them and I think I may have gotten ripped off buying a Kar98K bayonet which has no markings on it and it says classic innovation under the hand grip. I tried to post pictures but I can't get them small enough to post. Thanks in advance

scruffy
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Re: please help with k98 bayonet

#19

Post by scruffy » 01 Oct 2010, 02:56

classic innovation ? lol ,....
the so called yugo ' rework ' ......... it looks like the pack fonts are totaly fake ,.... i think some one is messing with us ,... & testing the so called 'experts' -- some one added the markings to a m48 bayo - ground down the muzzle ring ,...and replaced the grips - and latch stud ,....and then reblued it - very clever ---

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Frederick Prinz
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Re: please help with k98 bayonet

#20

Post by Frederick Prinz » 07 Oct 2010, 07:47

While leftover German arms from the war were used, and many times reworked in the various countries that had them available. They are not the same as the earlier period reworking of bayonets by the Germans themselves (which was ultimately discontinued - presumably because of other demands on limited resources as combat escalated).

And while it's always nice to find an original, there is nothing wrong (IMO) with period reworked 98K bayonets - and especially with the very early bayonets. As they can be very difficult (and sometimes almost impossible) to find in orignal/OEM condition.

With this example starting out life as a Weimar era (1927 dated) WuK. Being rebuilt more than once, it now has an "S" coded 1934 dated Coppel scabbard. A later TR era Waffenamted frog stud button, black Bakelite grips, and parts from other bayonets. All armory re-numbered to match - before being reissued and serving once again circa 1939 or later. FP
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Colonel666
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Re:

#21

Post by Colonel666 » 18 Mar 2014, 04:52

Seitengewehr98 wrote:Now, the scabbard you have doesn't appear to have been reworked, as the Yugo's placed another serial number on the frogstud, which Germany NEVER did. There are plenty of less than honest dealers out there who know full well that these are Yugo reworks, but offer them as German bayonets to unsuspecting new collectors. I think pretty much everyone gets fooled on these at one point in the beginning of their collecting.
My question in this quote above refers to the three German scabbards in my photo below. The top is a Coppel standard issued k98, the two scabbards below I acquired from sellers as long dress bayonet scabbards. The frog studs on the two lower scabbards have numbers on them (#39937 & #7737) and throats that have lips like other dress bayonets do.
The two with the frog stud numbers are too tight to fit any German maker long dress bayonets?
What is this? Something to do with Yugo re-issue German dress bayonet scabbards? I thought dress bayonets were only for vets at fancy parades and not issued to be used in combat.
Please give me some help.
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John G.
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Re: please help with k98 bayonet

#22

Post by John G. » 21 Mar 2014, 16:58

I'm not sure if these "were" German dress sheaths (or earlier) or one of the foreign Mauser sheath types that could have been collected/reissued by the Yugos...they would have seperated all the various parts and used whatever "fit properly" when reworking them- they wouldn't have cared if it was the "correct" sheath as long as it fit...... the numbers on the frog studs are a dead give-away that they were NOT German issue (anymore, at least!)....

As with anything....these would be alittle better than "no sheath" at all....(maybe).....but again, are "low end" items, that devalue an original bayonet if that was the intension ..... and would "be" a "REWORKED postwar reissue" of basic bayonet collector interest or for re-enactors who don't want to ruin the real thing.....as best.
John G.

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Colonel666
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Re: please help with k98 bayonet

#23

Post by Colonel666 » 22 Mar 2014, 02:11

What will fit in these then?

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John G.
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Re: please help with k98 bayonet

#24

Post by John G. » 22 Mar 2014, 13:44

These could be for nearly any "mauser" type bayonet.... sometimes they Ground down the thickness of the blades to fit, or enlarged the throat...to fit.....sometimes there was a 1/4" thick leather washer that changes the depth of the blade in the sheath.... sometimes the sheath may have been one of the WW 1 types that also were collected and reissued...

Point is they are NO longer German Dress bayonet (or whatever they were) sheaths.... they are "fillers" (at best), to be used for whatever will fit...(doesn't really matter anymore).
John G.

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Colonel666
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Re: Walking Out Bayonet fits Scabbard with the numbers on fr

#25

Post by Colonel666 » 25 Mar 2014, 05:02

A "fireman's" or called "walking-out" dress bayonet that fits the scabbards that nothing else would fit. I never had one of these kind before to know.
There are absolutely no markings on the bayonet itself.
Where is the connection between the numbers on the frog stud and "walking-out" bayonet?

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John G.
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Re: please help with k98 bayonet

#26

Post by John G. » 25 Mar 2014, 12:13

There's NO CONNECTION between the "walking out" (I've never heard "them" called that in 56 years of collecting....) Fire Service unslotted dress "sidearm" or "bayonet" and the numbers stamped on the sheaths.....the numbers on the frog studs are postwar Yugoslavian added.. (or other postwar nation that reworked captured German equipment/weapons)....

When they were in German service....in whatever capacity....they didn't have any numbers!....that's why now they are only "better than nothing" substitutes (also have had the enamel paint removed, have been blued, etc.)....

I doubt these were strictly "Fire Service" sheaths..... I'd more expect either makers variations, period of manurfacture differances (early/later), or modifications from being reworked.... but I've never made a study of "dress bayonet sheath variations and postwar alterations".... if they fit, I'd certianly save them for "replacement" use....(I've had several Fire Service "unsloted dress bayonets" that didn't have sheaths....and they are of little interest without a sheath to anyone! The numbers, however, would alert ANY KNOWLEDGIBLE collector that they are POSTWAR REISSUE and that would effect the collector value and interest significantly....(Dress bayonets and Fire Service "walkingout" types are still very common and only achieve real collector interest if 100% original, with dress frog and knot, with the felt plug if slotted...etc.).
John G.

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Colonel666
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Re: please help with k98 bayonet

#27

Post by Colonel666 » 28 Mar 2014, 22:01

Loading photo needs a redirect link to view on this site but there is a possibility that this "Fire Service" (walking out type is what seller put in the ad) is a post-war made because there is no lug slot or other markings.
I do know that annexed countries were adopted to German standards before Communist rule after WW2.
Not exactly sure if "parades" and such happened in these areas, but I do have a occupied area serial numbered German Mauser that is chromed and re-hilted to fit an Austrian Mauser rifle (chrome scabbard also).

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John G.
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Re: please help with k98 bayonet

#28

Post by John G. » 29 Mar 2014, 11:55

Many German Pre 1945 Dress bayonets and Fire Service edged weapons have no makers marks.... so whether it's marked or not is meaningless...

I have no idear what the rest of what you said is supposed to mean....???? :roll:
John G.

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