Use of Whalers by French Navy 1939-1940
- PT Dockyard
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Use of Whalers by French Navy 1939-1940
I know the British and Germans used converted whalers but did the Marine Nationale use these "Balénier" as auxiliary patrol vessels or minesweepers?
Dave G
Dave G
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Re: Use of Whalers by French Navy 1939-1940
Hi PTD,
I have had a look in The French Navy, Volume II by Henri Le Masson (MacDonald, London, 1969), which still seems to be the most comprehensive book on its subject in English, but I can find no separate reference to whalers. If they existed, they may be subsumed in the AD Series of armed trawlers.
However, I would first check that France had a whaling fleet in the first place. If it did not, then none would presumably have been available to take up from trade.
I have asked questions on several specialist forums regarding books about armed whalers, but there don't seem to be any specific to the type in any language. You can find books on armed yachts, or armed trawlers, but not, apparently, on whalers. Given that the Royal Navy and its Commonwealth siblings alone employed around 200 of them, and that they were influential in corvette design, this would appear to be a gap on the bookshelves worth filling.
Cheers,
A not very helpful Sid.
I have had a look in The French Navy, Volume II by Henri Le Masson (MacDonald, London, 1969), which still seems to be the most comprehensive book on its subject in English, but I can find no separate reference to whalers. If they existed, they may be subsumed in the AD Series of armed trawlers.
However, I would first check that France had a whaling fleet in the first place. If it did not, then none would presumably have been available to take up from trade.
I have asked questions on several specialist forums regarding books about armed whalers, but there don't seem to be any specific to the type in any language. You can find books on armed yachts, or armed trawlers, but not, apparently, on whalers. Given that the Royal Navy and its Commonwealth siblings alone employed around 200 of them, and that they were influential in corvette design, this would appear to be a gap on the bookshelves worth filling.
Cheers,
A not very helpful Sid.
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Re: Use of Whalers by French Navy 1939-1940
Thanks Sid! I agree it is a subject that could use a book. I vaguely remember one about 15 years ago but have been unable to drag up the title.
Do you know of any specifically on armed yachts? That is another passion of mine!
Thanks,
Dave
Do you know of any specifically on armed yachts? That is another passion of mine!
Thanks,
Dave
- Steen Ammentorp
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Re: Use of Whalers by French Navy 1939-1940
Hi,
I actually think that part 6 of the series "Warships of World War 2", published by Ian Allen in 1963 were titled "Trawlers, drifters and whalers", though often just refered to as "Trawlers", Authors: H.T. Lenton and J.J. Colledge
I actually think that part 6 of the series "Warships of World War 2", published by Ian Allen in 1963 were titled "Trawlers, drifters and whalers", though often just refered to as "Trawlers", Authors: H.T. Lenton and J.J. Colledge
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Re: Use of Whalers by French Navy 1939-1940
Hi PTD,
I have a book entitled The Armed Yachts of Canada, which I got through Amazon some years ago. It has a narrative history of them in both world wars. There are two copies going very cheaply on Amazon.
The best I have for the US Navy is in:
American Gunboats and Minesweepers (World War 2 Fact File)
Author: Lenton, H. T.
Hardcover: 64 pages
Publisher: Macdonald and Jane's; 1st edition (1974)
Language: English
ISBN-10: 0356080633
ISBN-13: 978-0356080635
It contains armed yachts as well.
For the Royal Navy I have the book Warships of World War II, which Steen Ammentorp mentions above.
American Gunboats and Minesweepers and Warships of World War II are essentially ship lists with basic specifations and statistics and the occasional photos. However, The Armed Yachts of Canada gives a much more comprehensive tale of how they were acquired, what modifications were made and their operational careers and has multiple photographs.
I am not a naval historian, so my knowledge is far from comprehensive, so there might well be more books out there on armed yachts.
Anyway, I hope this is of some use.
Cheers,
Sid.
I have a book entitled The Armed Yachts of Canada, which I got through Amazon some years ago. It has a narrative history of them in both world wars. There are two copies going very cheaply on Amazon.
The best I have for the US Navy is in:
American Gunboats and Minesweepers (World War 2 Fact File)
Author: Lenton, H. T.
Hardcover: 64 pages
Publisher: Macdonald and Jane's; 1st edition (1974)
Language: English
ISBN-10: 0356080633
ISBN-13: 978-0356080635
It contains armed yachts as well.
For the Royal Navy I have the book Warships of World War II, which Steen Ammentorp mentions above.
American Gunboats and Minesweepers and Warships of World War II are essentially ship lists with basic specifations and statistics and the occasional photos. However, The Armed Yachts of Canada gives a much more comprehensive tale of how they were acquired, what modifications were made and their operational careers and has multiple photographs.
I am not a naval historian, so my knowledge is far from comprehensive, so there might well be more books out there on armed yachts.
Anyway, I hope this is of some use.
Cheers,
Sid.
Re: Use of Whalers by French Navy 1939-1940
Dave, to answer your first question:
there was no French whaling fleet before WW II, so no conversion of whalers for the war.
But there were some former whalers in the French merchant fleet, mostly Norwegian ships which were acquired as patrol craft during WW I. While most of them were sold foreign after the war (or lost or scrapped), five were still in service under French flag in 1939:
"Bouvreuil" ex "Funding", 1939 in service as tug, 1942 refitted as trawler
"Chimère" ex "Larsen", 1939 in service as trawler/drifter
"Pélican" ex "Dove", 1939 in service as tug
"Scarabée" ex "Carmen", 1939 in service as pilot vessel "Pilote Nivière"
"Serpent" ex "G.D.I.", 1939 in service as passenger vessel "Jean d'Agrève", requisitioned in 1939 as "VP. 51". later "AD. 222"
So one former whaler served with the French navy during WW II. Some more details about this vessel (and a picture from my collection) here:
http://pages14-18.mesdiscussions.net/pa ... 3158_1.htm
Regards
Klaus Günther
there was no French whaling fleet before WW II, so no conversion of whalers for the war.
But there were some former whalers in the French merchant fleet, mostly Norwegian ships which were acquired as patrol craft during WW I. While most of them were sold foreign after the war (or lost or scrapped), five were still in service under French flag in 1939:
"Bouvreuil" ex "Funding", 1939 in service as tug, 1942 refitted as trawler
"Chimère" ex "Larsen", 1939 in service as trawler/drifter
"Pélican" ex "Dove", 1939 in service as tug
"Scarabée" ex "Carmen", 1939 in service as pilot vessel "Pilote Nivière"
"Serpent" ex "G.D.I.", 1939 in service as passenger vessel "Jean d'Agrève", requisitioned in 1939 as "VP. 51". later "AD. 222"
So one former whaler served with the French navy during WW II. Some more details about this vessel (and a picture from my collection) here:
http://pages14-18.mesdiscussions.net/pa ... 3158_1.htm
Regards
Klaus Günther
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Re: Use of Whalers by French Navy 1939-1940
Thank you Klaus! This is great information!
Dave G
Dave G
Re: Use of Whalers by French Navy 1939-1940
http://pages14-18.mesdiscussions.net/pa ... 2700_1.htmToutefois en 1940 la marine française racheta aux USA les anciens Austerlitz qui devint la Sablaise; Valmy devint l'Algéroise; Hondschoote devint la Quimperoise; Lonato, la Cherbourgeoise; Poitiers, l'Oranaise; un autre la Servannaise
http://www.warshipsww2.eu/lode.php?lang ... trida=1490
It seems the fast debacle of French army prevented their use.