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American twin AA37mm halftrack

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American twin AA37mm halftrack

Postby Vegemite/jordan on 01 Nov 2005 09:17

Hello i just need some help with this vehicle. First of all i know at least one of these exists but i want to know if they were produced on a large scale and were any in normandy?

If u have any answers, please send as soon as possible! :D

Thanks
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Re: American twin AA37mm halftrack

Postby C.GILLONO on 01 Nov 2005 10:53

Vegemite/jordan wrote:Hello i just need some help with this vehicle. First of all i know at least one of these exists but i want to know if they were produced on a large scale and were any in normandy?
If u have any answers, please send as soon as possible! :D
Thanks

AFAIK, there were no twin 37mm AA halftrack used in operation.
For the ETO campaign, there were 16 M16s (or 16 M16 Specials) and 16 M15s or M15A1s in each SP AAAW battalions.
The M15 and M15A1 mounted one 37 and two .50 (aircooled) in different configurations. Previously, the T28E1s used water cooled .50 (not many were made, especially to meet the Stuka threat in North Africa- Torch Operation) and they soldiered to Sicily, Italy and France-Germany (a 7th Army outfit).
There was a M15 Special (37mm replaced by a 40mm Bofors) but the few conveted were only used in the Pacific (Philippines, and later in Korea IIRC).
There were many experimental AA vehicles but not fielded...
HTH
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thanks

Postby Vegemite/jordan on 02 Nov 2005 07:56

:roll: dam i was hoping they werent just prototypes. Ohwell thanks for that ill stop my search :D

Thanks alot

Jordan
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Re: American twin AA37mm halftrack

Postby RichTO90 on 02 Nov 2005 16:49

C.GILLONO wrote:For the ETO campaign, there were 16 M16s (or 16 M16 Specials) and 16 M15s or M15A1s in each SP AAAW battalions.


A minor correction, the Antiaircraft Artillery Battalion (SP) had four batteries, each with 8 M15A1 (AFAIK the M15 was only used in North Africa and Italy) and 8 M16 or M17 MGMC, for a total of 32 each in the battalion. I am unsure what an M16 "Special" was? Are you referring to the T10E1 with the twin 20mm? All of those except one were converted back to M16.
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Re: American twin AA37mm halftrack

Postby C.GILLONO on 02 Nov 2005 17:24

RichTO90 wrote:
C.GILLONO wrote:For the ETO campaign, there were 16 M16s (or 16 M16 Specials) and 16 M15s or M15A1s in each SP AAAW battalions.

A minor correction, the Antiaircraft Artillery Battalion (SP) had four batteries, each with 8 M15A1 (AFAIK the M15 was only used in North Africa and Italy) and 8 M16 or M17 MGMC, for a total of 32 each in the battalion. I am unsure what an M16 "Special" was? Are you referring to the T10E1 with the twin 20mm? All of those except one were converted back to M16.

Thanks for the additional information.
From what I read in books *, the M16 Specials were M2 haltracks turned into 'expedient M16s' to equip non Self-Propelled AAAW battalions with some SP mounts. There was an official program to make them before D-Day, the Maxson turret coming from the trailor mounted towed carriages of the receiving battalions.
I think Hunnicutt talks (well writes!) about these in his 'Halftrack' opus.
There are seen in several photos. The clue is the shorter rear body, the non folding body top and the often opened stowage bin door on the front side.

BTW I read most the M17s went to the USSR, the M14s previously sent to GB having been turned into additional troop carriers in the Armoured Divisions.

HTH

* and I do not have access to original archives as you do, but you are kind enough to make their content available through your posts in various DGs, thanks once more.
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Oooops!!!

Postby C.GILLONO on 02 Nov 2005 19:10

My bad.
The M16 Special was in fact called a 'M16B'.
The info is found page 190 of Hunnicutt's Half-Track (ISBN 0-89141-742-7).
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Re: Oooops!!!

Postby RichTO90 on 02 Nov 2005 20:33

C.GILLONO wrote:My bad.
The M16 Special was in fact called a 'M16B'.
The info is found page 190 of Hunnicutt's Half-Track (ISBN 0-89141-742-7).


I will double check, but there is some confusion here. Unsurprising really, as you will see. :D

From my ongoing work:

"Antiaircraft Artillery
M13 MGMC (T1E4 on M3 Halftrack, Standardized September 1942, re-designated Substitute Standard December 1942) and M14 MGMC (T1E4 on M5 Halftrack, designated Substitute Standard October 1942) were variations of twin .50-caliber machinegun antiaircraft mounts. Production of the M14 began December 1942 and the M13 in January 1943. A total of 1,731 M13 were built, with 628 later refitted with quad mounts as M16 (see below). A total of 1,605 M14 were built. Ten M13 and all but five of the M14 were shipped to Britain as Lend-Lease.

M16 MGMC (T58 on M3 Halftrack, Standardized December 1942) and M17 MGMC (T58 on M5 Halftrack, designated Substitute Standard December 1942) were variations of quad .50-caliber machinegun antiaircraft halftrack mounts. Production of M16 began May 1943 with 2,877 completed, plus 628 converted from M13. Another 110 were completed as T10E1 with twin 20mm guns, but all except one of those was later converted back to M16 standard. Production of M17 began December 1943 with 1,000 completed. Lend-Lease shipments were two M16 to Britain, 70 M16 to French forces and 1,000 M17 to the U.S.S.R.

Production of M13, M14, M16, and M17 MGMC ended in December 1944 with a grand total of 7,322 built. In addition, a total of 321 MGMC were converted by mounting M45 Quad .50-caliber Trailers on spare M5 Halftracks at the initiative of ETOUSA, all in the spring of 1944. They were known as M17A1.

M15 MGMC (T28 on M2 Halftrack, Standardized June 1942, re-designated Substitute Standard February 1943 and then Limited Standard June 1944) and M15A1 MGMC (T28E1 on M3 Halftrack, Standardized February 1943, re-designated Substitute Standard June 1944) were turreted 37mm and twin .50-caliber machinegun antiaircraft halftrack mounts. Production began in July and August 1942 with an initial run of 80, another 600 followed in February to April 1943, and then a final run of 1,652 from October 1943 to February 1944, for a total of 2,332 built. A total of 100 M15 and M15A1 were shipped to the U.S.S.R. as Lend-Lease.

M19 MGMC (T65E1, Standardized June 1944) mounted a twin 40mm antiaircraft gun, but unlike the other halftrack-based conversions used as self propelled antiaircraft artillery, it was purpose-built for the job, albeit was part of the “common chassis” concept employing the basic running gear of the M24 Light Tank. Production began in April 1945 and continued through August 1945, for a total of 300 built."

It is possible that the M13 converted to M16 standard were known as M16B, but they weren't the M5 Halftracks converted to M17 standard, those were M17A1.
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Re: Oooops!!!

Postby C.GILLONO on 02 Nov 2005 21:35

RichTO90 wrote:I will double check, but there is some confusion here. Unsurprising really, as you will see. :D
From my ongoing work:

Thanks!
Keep us posted on your book... 8)
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