104th Regiment RHA

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David W
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104th Regiment RHA

Postby David W » 30 May 2010 15:04

Gentlemen.


Some questions regarding 104RHA.


When did they arrive in North Africa? (It was before Dec '40).

Was 339th Bty armed with 18/25Pdrs at this time?

Was 414th Bty armed with 4.5" Howitzers at this time?

When were the above upgraded to 25Pdrs?

414th Bty was withdrawn to go to Burma, when?

Were any other batteries so withdrawn?

The whole Regiment appears on O.o.B for 23/10/42, so when did it re-appear in N.A?

Ta muchly :)

Alanmccoubrey
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Re: 104th Regiment RHA

Postby Alanmccoubrey » 30 May 2010 17:48

David, October 1940 to NA from Palistine.

http://www.ra39-45.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/rha/page10.html
Alan

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David W
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Re: 104th Regiment RHA

Postby David W » 30 May 2010 19:07

Thanks Alan.
That's a good start!

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Re: 104th Regiment RHA

Postby Dili » 31 May 2010 19:45

I have it came from 1 Cav. So it maybe should have some cavalry guns?

I have also this notes:
29/10/40 when gets independent, 25 Pdr 1941, Stuart OP tanks in SEP42 when in 8,10 Armored Div.

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Re: 104th Regiment RHA

Postby JonS » 02 Jun 2010 11:07

From Farndale's Years of Defeat

Page 119: 20 Feb 1940, 104th (Essex Yeomanry) Regt RHA, under LtCol E.J. Todhunter, arrives in Haifa having travelled via Cherbourg and Marseilles. Consists of 339th and 414th Btys. Initially "horsed but soon began to mechanise." Remained in Palestine until Sept 1940 when it (along with 106 and 107 Regts RHA) moved via Ismailia to the Western Desert to prep posns in the Baggush Box (just east of Maarten Baggush)

Page 126: By then (Sept 1940) it was mechanised and equipped with 8 x 18-pr and 8 x 4.5-in how. [no note on which bty had which wpn]

Page 129: Oct 1940 at Beni Yusuf camp re-equipping. [not clear whether this is motorising, or equipping with 25-pr? Actually, in conjunction with previous comment about it already being mechanised, it probably means re-equipping with 25-pr.]

Page 211: Nov 1941, still in Tobruk garrison [and possibly, therefore, still with their old weapons?]

Page 232: ~Jan 1942, 414th Bty sent to Far East with 8 x 25-pr. [It appears, from the context, that 104 Regt - or at least 414 Bty - was in Egypt at that time refitting along with 7th Armd Bde, which of course was also sent East. According to the books index the 104th seems to have changed from being an RHA Regt to a Fd Regt at about this time. Edit: actually, this last bit looks like a typo on Farndale's part - I'm pretty sure the 104th stayed RHA throughout WWII.]

Outline listing of Regtl movements here:
http://nigelef.tripod.com/regtsumm.htm#RHA

Edit: on reflection, it seems like the 104th got their 25-pr either in Oct 1940, just prior to Op COMPASS and then used them throughout the siege of Tobruk, or in Jan 1942 just after Op CRUSADER and therefore had 18-pr and 4.5-in throughout the siege. I've had a look in various places (principally the NZ OHs and Pitt) to no avail. I expect, though, you'd be able to figure it out with a detailed book on either Tobruk and the siege, or one on Crusader - perhaps the relevant Playfair and Molony?

My guess would be it arrived in Palestine with horses and wooden-wheeled 18-pr, motorised and obtained pneumatically tyred 18-pr and 4.5-in during 1940, then in Oct 1940 it got 25-pr and all the paraphenalia of a 25-pr regt such as quads, limbers, etc.

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Re: 104th Regiment RHA

Postby JonS » 05 Jun 2010 23:57

Follow up - I had a quick look in a Tobruk-focussed book yesterday (whose name now escapes me :roll: ) which had the 104th using 25-pr during COMPASS. So Oct 1940 seems like the conversion date.

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Re: 104th Regiment RHA

Postby David W » 06 Jun 2010 00:21

Thanks Jon

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Re: 104th Regiment RHA

Postby DavidSmith » 14 Jun 2011 18:22

Hello

Further to this thread, I wonder does anyone have any information about 42 The Essex Yeomanry Provost Battery, RHA?
This unit was part of 104th (Essex Yeomanry) Regt RHA (O/C Lt Col E.J Todhunter) and fought, i believe, throughout the North Africa campaign. I would like to know what guns did they have, was it the 25 pounder mentioned above? Were they at Alamein? And why were they called a "Provost Battery"? Any information would be appreciated, especially about the location of their War Diary

DavidSmith

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Urmel
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Re: 104th Regiment RHA

Postby Urmel » 14 Jun 2011 20:25

On 15 Feb I have a 'Bty 104 R.H.A.' with 8x25pdr allocated to Tobfort, with the note 'not yet arrived'.
The excellence of [German] forward repair and recovery organisation gives us a salutary lesson in this respect. 7 Armoured Division report, Sept. 1941

The CRUSADER Project - The Winter Battle in the Desert 1941/42

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Re: 104th Regiment RHA

Postby Clive Mortimore » 11 Jul 2011 00:12

DavidSmith wrote:Hello

Further to this thread, I wonder does anyone have any information about 42 The Essex Yeomanry Provost Battery, RHA?
This unit was part of 104th (Essex Yeomanry) Regt RHA (O/C Lt Col E.J Todhunter) and fought, i believe, throughout the North Africa campaign. I would like to know what guns did they have, was it the 25 pounder mentioned above? Were they at Alamein? And why were they called a "Provost Battery"? Any information would be appreciated, especially about the location of their War Diary

DavidSmith


Hi David

42 Battery was not an ex-Yeomanry battery. 42 Field Battery served with 2 Field Regiment RA.

When first formed as an artillery regiment the 104 RHA (Essex Yeomanry) Regiment had two batteries 413 and 414. In 1932 339 Essex Battery Royal Horse Artillery , re-joined the regiment (it had been formed from the Yeomanry during the first world war).
With the expansion/duplication of the TA in 1938 the batteries with the Essex Yeomanry were 339 and 414 with 104 RHA Regiment and 413 and 431, with 147 RHA Regiment. 511 Battery was also with 147 regt and was formed when the change from 2 x 12 gun batteries to 3 x 8 gun batteries in 1941.
414 Battery formed the cadre for the 14 Regiment RHA, 524 and 525 were the other batteries in the regiment.

I cannot find out which other batteries formed 104 regt after 414 left and the change to 3 x 8 gun batteries.

JonS wrote:
My guess would be it arrived in Palestine with horses and wooden-wheeled 18-pr, motorised and obtained pneumatically tyred 18-pr and 4.5-in during 1940, then in Oct 1940 it got 25-pr and all the paraphenalia of a 25-pr regt such as quads, limbers, etc.


Hi Jon

The Essex Yeomanry history http://www.essex-yeomanry.org.uk/ey-history/57-short-history.html states "413 Battery pioneered tractor draught for artillery at Okehampton and by 1933 the regiment was fully mechanised". I hope this helps with its WW2 history.

Clive
Clive


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