1 Air Landing LAA Battery RA weapons?

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Dili
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1 Air Landing LAA Battery RA weapons?

#1

Post by Dili » 25 Apr 2016, 04:16

This was an unit of 1st Airborne Division.

I have only found this blurb: In June 1942 283rd (COLY) AA Battery of 11th LAA Regt were re-roled and redesignated No.1 Air-Landing Light Anti-Aircraft Battery, RA (The Rough Riders, COLY) and were placed under command of The Airborne Division. This title was changed to "1st Air Landing Light Anti-Aircraft Battery, RA (The Rough Riders) in March 1943.

What kind of AA guns and how many it had? I don't believe it had Bofors since these were too heavy/big i think.

Gary Kennedy
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Re: 1 Air Landing LAA Battery RA weapons?

#2

Post by Gary Kennedy » 29 Apr 2016, 02:08

The Nov1942 establishment authorised the A/L Lt AA Bty 18x 40-mm guns (plus 3 with 1st Reinforcements) and 48x 20-mm guns (plus 6 with 1st Reinforcements). The Bty was organised with a HQ and three Tps, each with six Sub-sections. The WE doesn't actually show allocation of guns per Tp, but I'd go with one 40-mm per Sub-sec as the basic, and an alternative of sixteen 20-mm guns per Tp (allowing for say four with Tp HQ and two per Sub-sec). I think I have somewhere a Horsa load for a 40-mm gun.

1 Bty did send a small detachment to Normandy with 6 Abn Div HQ, with the Seaborne Tail I think.

Gary


Dili
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Re: 1 Air Landing LAA Battery RA weapons?

#3

Post by Dili » 29 Apr 2016, 02:58

Thanks. A very big battery with 18x40mm and 48x20mm

For the period i am looking for is more about at time of Husky(Sicily invasion July 1943). I suppose at this time the 20mm were Madsen or was it already Oerlikon? Polsten only appeared later i think.

There were 30(27 arrived) Horsa for Husky. All information i got was AT guns and Mountain artilley. But by no means a complete info about operation. Do you have anything?

Gary Kennedy
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Re: 1 Air Landing LAA Battery RA weapons?

#4

Post by Gary Kennedy » 29 Apr 2016, 16:05

The WE table doesn't specify types of weapon, just refers to 20-mm and 40-mm guns. This site on 6th Abn Div refers to 2 A/L LAA Bty receiving Hispano Suiza weapons initially, then moving onto the Polsten in early 1944.

http://www.gotoitgunners.co.uk/twoairlanding.html

I'm reasonably certain that the Bty would take either 40-mm or 20-mm guns (or a mix) as the situation permitted, but not all 66 pieces at once! Sub-secs consisted of an NCO and 11 gun numbers/drivers with just one Jeep; eight arty tractors were held by the Bty overall.

There was a Horsa loading table for the 40-mm Bofors so it could be airlifted. The Horsa could carry either two pilots, 4 gun numbers, a gun, light motorcycle and bicycle, or two pilots, 6 gun numbers and a gun + Jeep. I don't know what the Bty took on Husky I'm afraid. I had a look at the Pegasusarchive site and that doesn't have the war diary for them.

And I'll correct my 'deliberate' mistake above, it was of course 2 Air Landing LAA Bty that went to Normandy, not 1 Bty...

Gary

Dili
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Re: 1 Air Landing LAA Battery RA weapons?

#5

Post by Dili » 29 Apr 2016, 21:22

Ok. So do you think it is realistic that each sub sec will take 2x20mm or instead 1 40mm?

That would make 36 20mm or 18 40mm.

Alanmccoubrey
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Re: 1 Air Landing LAA Battery RA weapons?

#6

Post by Alanmccoubrey » 30 Apr 2016, 07:06

I have never heard of them airlanding a Bofors 40mm, it certainly wouldn't go in a Horsa and the Hamilcars were needed for more important loads. The Bofors if they joined the unit would have been in the "sea tail".
Alan

Gary Kennedy
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Re: 1 Air Landing LAA Battery RA weapons?

#7

Post by Gary Kennedy » 30 Apr 2016, 16:44

It's supposition on my part, but I'd certainly go with either one 40-mm or two 20-mm guns per Sub-sec. The Sub-sec was authorised 1 Serjeant, 1 driver-mechanic, 1 Jeep and 10 gun numbers, which was a similar strength to a standard 40-mm Sub-sec serving a single gun. If they switched to 20-mm weapons then the same strength could easily serve two guns. Tp HQ had two more Jeeps, giving the Bty 24 overall, and I just wonder if the idea was one Jeep could tow a pair of 20-mm guns, so Tp HQ had spare weapons? Also a correction, I said eight tractors in the Bty but the WE says 12 (four per Tp HQ), so not enough for each 40-mm gun.

I don't know whether the 40-mm was ever actually landed by Horsa, but I definitely have examples of how they could be loaded in documents I obtained from the Airborne Forces Museum a few years ago now. I'm not sure I got a full set as some of the page numbers are skipped, but they are titled 40M/M Gun Detachment on MkIII or MkIV platform. And if I'd have thought to turn a few more pages I'd have seen the 20-mm loading table, which does show a single Jeep towing two 20-mm Hispano MkII, the Horsa also carrying two pilots and four gun numbers.

2nd A/L LAA Bty did go on Market Garden, but was involved in defending 1st Abn Corps HQ (see above link). I don't know if they flew in or what weapons they took.

Gary

Dili
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Re: 1 Air Landing LAA Battery RA weapons?

#8

Post by Dili » 02 May 2016, 23:04

Thanks Gary.

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