Cromwell in Africa

Discussions on all aspects of the The United Kingdom & its Empire and Commonwealth during the Inter-War era and Second World War. Hosted by Andy H
Post Reply
User avatar
Kriegsmarine
Member
Posts: 6
Joined: 22 Jul 2004, 10:32
Location: Hamburg, Germany

Cromwell in Africa

#1

Post by Kriegsmarine » 24 Jul 2004, 16:44

Did the britisch ever used the Cromwell in Africa and which one was better Sherman or Cromwell?
thanx

domi
Member
Posts: 26
Joined: 24 Apr 2004, 18:34
Location: NE England

#2

Post by domi » 24 Jul 2004, 17:32

Im fairly sure the cromwell didnt go to africa (if it did I wouldnt mind seeing pictures)

well despite being a sort of cromwell fan Im afraid to say it was a bit of a duffer.

It was nice and fast with very good manouvrability on its excellant christie suspension, however its armour just wasnt up to the job of facing the german big cats of the time, and its main gun had already been proved insuficient even before the thing hit the battlefield.

If the cromwell had come out 2 years earlier about the same time as the sherman they would have been fairly comparable, but in truth it was no better despite being a newer design by nearly 2 years.

all simply my opinion of course.


Roger Griffiths
Member
Posts: 511
Joined: 30 Apr 2003, 00:50
Location: United Kingdom

#3

Post by Roger Griffiths » 24 Jul 2004, 23:19

No, the Cromwell was not ready until 1944. My mothers brother (7AD) came back in February 1944 from Italy for conversion. The crews were sent to the factory for familiarization. They were not impressed. Protection and gun power were inferior.

Roger

User avatar
R-Bob The Great!
Member
Posts: 549
Joined: 24 Jan 2003, 07:13
Location: Canada

#4

Post by R-Bob The Great! » 04 Aug 2004, 08:52

I doubt the Cromwell was used in Africa although it may have been used in the campaigns in Tunisia to a certain extent. I would think that an early Sherman model was marginally superior to a Cromwell.

Andreas
Member
Posts: 6938
Joined: 10 Nov 2002, 15:12
Location: Europe

#5

Post by Andreas » 04 Aug 2004, 12:38

R-Bob The Great! wrote:I doubt the Cromwell was used in Africa although it may have been used in the campaigns in Tunisia to a certain extent. I would think that an early Sherman model was marginally superior to a Cromwell.
Roger Griffith is right - there was no Cromwell in action in Africa, or AFAIK Italy, for that matter. Cromwell's were issued to 7 AD (wholly equipped except for some (36?) Sherman Fireflies in June 1944) for the invasion, 1st Polish AD by August 1944, and the Recce Regiments of Guards AD, and 11th AD for the invasion. The Recce regiment of 4th Canuckian AD (the South Albertas) was equipped with Shermans (Rams until early 1944 IIRC). Independent armoured brigades in North-West Europe (4, 8, 27, have I forgotten one?) were all equipped with Shermans (tank brigades (6 Guards, 31, 34) with Churchills).

In terms of comparison, the Cromwell apparently stood out for its engine. This was a Rolls Royce Meteor (stripped down version of the Merlin aero-engine?), which gave it an excellent power-to-weight ratio, much better then most Shermans (the engine was actually too powerful for the Christie suspension, so maximum speed had to be reduced). It also had an excellent permanent speed (despite the reduction), and apparently could outrun trucks. It probably also had better flotation/cross-country performance due to the suspension and weight/track ratio.

In terms of armour protection the slab-sided armour of the Cromwell was probably somewhat inferior to the Sherman, but OTOH it had a much lower silhouette. In terms of the first Shermans, before these were uparmoured, it probably was superior though.

The gun was identical between vanilla Shermans and Cromwells. A 17pdr version was produced in the Challenger, but this was not very successful. The Comet is essentially a Cromwell chassis with a stripped down 17pdr gun.

User avatar
PropCollector
In memoriam
Posts: 520
Joined: 22 May 2004, 11:42
Location: Netherlands
Contact:

#6

Post by PropCollector » 06 Aug 2004, 19:34

Maybe wrong from me to ask here, but what tank is this? I am no tank specialist and I just ask because I have this picture without knowing (and I did not ever try to find out so far :) )

Hans
Attachments
tank4.jpg
tank4
tank4.jpg (61.47 KiB) Viewed 1234 times

User avatar
redcoat
Member
Posts: 1361
Joined: 03 Mar 2003, 22:54
Location: Stockport, England

#7

Post by redcoat » 07 Aug 2004, 00:01

PropCollector wrote:Maybe wrong from me to ask here, but what tank is this? I am no tank specialist and I just ask because I have this picture without knowing (and I did not ever try to find out so far :) )

Hans
Both are Matilda Mk II's

User avatar
PropCollector
In memoriam
Posts: 520
Joined: 22 May 2004, 11:42
Location: Netherlands
Contact:

#8

Post by PropCollector » 07 Aug 2004, 10:25

redcoat wrote:
PropCollector wrote:Maybe wrong from me to ask here, but what tank is this? I am no tank specialist and I just ask because I have this picture without knowing (and I did not ever try to find out so far :) )

Hans
Both are Matilda Mk II's
Thank you...

I have this original german labeled photograph showing these tanks being shot at Bardia. The photo i showed is just a part of the total photograph. If someone is interested, i can post the total photo + label here. Just let me know.

Hans

Post Reply

Return to “The United Kingdom & its Empire and Commonwealth 1919-45”