Besal machine-gun
Besal machine-gun
Currently I am seeking any information about and of course pictures of the Besal machine-gun that was built in Britain before or in early period of the war. As I have heard it was to be a backup for the Bren, much simplier and cheaper than that.
I will be grateful for any information. Thanks in advance.
Piotr
I will be grateful for any information. Thanks in advance.
Piotr
Besal Mk2
lenght: 46.63"
weight: 21.5lb
caliber: .303"
rifling: 4 groove rh twist
feed: 30rnd box
cooling: air
cyclic rof: 600rmp
MV: 2440fps
sights: 300/500 yards
Designed by H. Falulkener of BSA, to make the maximum use of stampings, spot welding and simple turning in place of the Bren's more labourious milling and broaching. The action and layout remined simmilar to the Bren, with the majority of the changes being in detail design and manufacturing techniques. Basicly post Dunkirk, the Bren was being made in only one place in the UK, RASF Enfield, as such it was very vulnerable to being bombed, so the BESAl was designed as an alternative should that happen. Enfield was never bombed and the Besal sat on the shelf.
The difference between the MK1 and Mk 2 was in the method of cocking, the Mk.1 used a conventional cocking handle (in this case a knurled knob), while the Mk2 used a sliding pistolgrip like several other Czech weapons of the period, BSA and CZ/Bruno haveing a fairly close relationship pre war.
In short the Besal was to the Bren as the MG42 is to the MG38, with the exception that it never went into production.
Technically I think the problem was Falulkener went too far in dumbing down the Bren, making it just too much of an 'emergency' weapon to be anything but second best beside the real thing. This wasn't his fault, his job was to make it as cheap and quick as he could, but the result was just too much of a compromise, too crude.
IF a little more margin had been left for the details, that is if Falulkener had been told to make a replacement for the Bren, I believe it would have been a respectable weapon.
shane
lenght: 46.63"
weight: 21.5lb
caliber: .303"
rifling: 4 groove rh twist
feed: 30rnd box
cooling: air
cyclic rof: 600rmp
MV: 2440fps
sights: 300/500 yards
Designed by H. Falulkener of BSA, to make the maximum use of stampings, spot welding and simple turning in place of the Bren's more labourious milling and broaching. The action and layout remined simmilar to the Bren, with the majority of the changes being in detail design and manufacturing techniques. Basicly post Dunkirk, the Bren was being made in only one place in the UK, RASF Enfield, as such it was very vulnerable to being bombed, so the BESAl was designed as an alternative should that happen. Enfield was never bombed and the Besal sat on the shelf.
The difference between the MK1 and Mk 2 was in the method of cocking, the Mk.1 used a conventional cocking handle (in this case a knurled knob), while the Mk2 used a sliding pistolgrip like several other Czech weapons of the period, BSA and CZ/Bruno haveing a fairly close relationship pre war.
In short the Besal was to the Bren as the MG42 is to the MG38, with the exception that it never went into production.
Technically I think the problem was Falulkener went too far in dumbing down the Bren, making it just too much of an 'emergency' weapon to be anything but second best beside the real thing. This wasn't his fault, his job was to make it as cheap and quick as he could, but the result was just too much of a compromise, too crude.
IF a little more margin had been left for the details, that is if Falulkener had been told to make a replacement for the Bren, I believe it would have been a respectable weapon.
shane
Re: Besal machine-gun
Take a look at this picture:
Is the machine-gun in the middle not the Besal LMG? Definitely it is not a version of the Bren. But what actually is it?
Piotr
Is the machine-gun in the middle not the Besal LMG? Definitely it is not a version of the Bren. But what actually is it?
Piotr
Re: Besal machine-gun
I think the middle weapon, with the curved mag, is a Vickers-Berthier light machine gun. These were used by the Indian Army at the outset of the war, but it seems they were gradually replaced by the Bren gun. Similar characteristics to the Bren, but found to be nowhere near as reliable as the ZB in trials held pre-war (otherwise it might have been the standard British LMG!).
Re: Besal machine-gun
Yep top machine gun is a Bren, and judging by the straight magazine one of those post WWII guns recalibred for the nato 7.62 ammo
middle one is indeed a Vickers Berthier
bottom looks like a ZB26, the Bren's czech ancestor
these guns are much more sophisticated than tha Besal
I've seen a picture of a Besal once, and it looked extremely crude compared to these
middle one is indeed a Vickers Berthier
bottom looks like a ZB26, the Bren's czech ancestor
these guns are much more sophisticated than tha Besal
I've seen a picture of a Besal once, and it looked extremely crude compared to these
Re: Besal machine-gun
Hope this helps: (from the book “Modern Small Arms” by Major Frederick Myatt, Salamander Books, 1978)
http://img104.imagevenue.com/img.php?im ... _140lo.jpg
http://img104.imagevenue.com/img.php?im ... _140lo.jpg
Re: Besal machine-gun
It has helped indeed. Thanks a lot!
Piotr
Piotr
Re: Besal machine-gun
Is this the same as the BESA, which was a tank mounted weapon?
Re: Besal machine-gun
No - BESA was the belt-fed MMG (UK license-made Czech ZB-53) in 7.92x57mm caliber.Simon K wrote:Is this the same as the BESA, which was a tank mounted weapon?
Re: Besal machine-gun
Thanks.
Re: Besal machine-gun
Interesting, never heard of this gun before. Thanks for the info, everyone.
Re: Besal machine-gun
lmg Faulkner -erzatz Bren
http://images.google.pl/imgres?imgurl=h ... N%26um%3D1
http://images.google.pl/imgres?imgurl=h ... N%26um%3D1
Re: Besal machine-gun
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- Besal001.jpg (65.39 KiB) Viewed 5570 times
Re: Besal machine-gun
The Infantry and Small Arms School Corps
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