Enfield No4 MK1?

Delta Tank · #1

To all,

I recently became the proud owner of a No4 MK1 F (FTR) 48, serial number AS 9547 (I believe that is the serial number). What does all of this mean. I looked it up on the web and found this:

"A windy way of describing a Savage manufactured No.4 MKI lend/lease rifle that later got arsonal converted to a MKII. When I got it, it looked about new with all matching parts and a bright shiney bore."

Is this explanation correct or at least close?

I also noticed that the magazine has the same serial number as the rifle. So my second and third question is, did British Infantrymen carry one magazine and reloaded that one with stripper clips or did they carry more than one magazine. And if they did carry more than one magazine was it numbered to match the rifle's serial number?

Mike
PS The rifle has the orginal stock but of course it has been chopped and the top of the stock (hand guard) is missing. Does any one know where I can buy an original stock for this rifle?

edward_n_kelly · #2

FTR indicates Full Total rebuild AFIK done in 1948 (48).

Try Ian Sketterton's Lee Enfield Story (I have a copy but packed away).

Edward

phylo_roadking · #3

Mike, coming late to this, but in case you haven't got the answer in the meantime - they were meant to be loaded in situ from a pair of stripper clips, as the mag was a pretty tight precision fit in the breech mechanism, the option to remove only ideally being for cleaning! It was frowned upon severly to reload the "easy" way by magazine, and when peace allowed, woe betide the squaddy found with a spare during a locker inspection....but I'm sure at the front a smart p.b.i. would have dogrobbed a second one and had it charged and tucked somewhere handy!

Habu · #4

Phylo has it right; loading was done from stripper clips. Properly set up, this is about as fast as changing magazines in the No4 MK1, and really isn't as much of a handicap as some might think.

edward_n_kelly · #5

Even better explanation - "stripper clip" was never used in the British or Commonwealth Army. What you call a "stripper clip" was known as a "charger" - each containing five rounds , loaded in a particular manner (the complete rim of each alternate round was above the rounds on either side of it else the rounds did not enter the magazine with the round above in front of that below it).

CES ("Complete Equipment Schedule" - a later day term for the list of equipment that constituted a "system" be it a weapon or wireless/telegraphy set or a tank - came in 2 parts Basic (enough to use) and Extended (all the accessories that were "nice") for the Rifle Lee Enfield No1 or No 4 included only one magazine so only one was issued.

Early versions of the Mk III included a magazine cut-off, that allowed the 10 rounds of the magazine to be held in reserve and firing was done by single rounds. When a "mad minute" was needed (or rapid fire was ordered) the round in the chamber was used, the cut-off withdrawn and the 10 rounds expended, and the magazine replenished from chargers. This was one of the reasons for the "Old Contemptibles" having such a high rate of fire when needed - upto to 20 rounds per minute or more - and capable of giving the Germans the impression that the BEF had more machine guns than the 2 per battalion (and not all had them all) they actually had.

First Class Shot (not marksman) standard at the time for the BEF (and something like 50%+ were FCS or better) was the 20 rounds, in one minute, all bull or inner at 300 yards.

As a comparison - the Australian Army standard rate of fire with the L1A1 was 20 rounds
per minute, no accuracy specified.

Magazine cutoffs were eliminated with the Mk III onward from 1915 (though many were made with the slot still in the receiver after that date).

Edward

phylo_roadking · #6

Part of the reason for "staggering" the rounds in the charger as Edward describes is that the Enfiled, taking two chargers of five to load the ten round magazine - as your thumb pressed the cartridges down into the magazine through the open breech they stacked "right" and "left" alternately, and if you didn't pay attention to how you positioned the rounds in the charger you could have then hang up and jam as they didn't "split" properly. That jam would take more than a precious few seconds to clear....!

walther43 · #7

edward_n_kelly wrote:FTR indicates Full Total rebuild AFIK done in 1948 (48).

Try Ian Sketterton's Lee Enfield Story (I have a copy but packed away).

Edward

Were all FTR rifles reworked in 48? I have a 1917 FTR MKIII and was just wondering.

Habu · #8

Edward has given a very nice description, far better than mine from the perspective of military history! I tend to view the Lee Enfields from the perspective of a shooter.

To address Mike's other question, it seems that many of the Savages underwent such butchery. Original stocks and handguards can be hard to find, and locating them seems to be a matter of luck. Many years ago, Springfield Sporters had a few, but that was 20 years or more ago . . . Good luck finding one now! I'm not sure if the rifle could be properly set-up with wood from another maker. One of the aftermarket stockmakers has been making repro stocks for some of the WWI and WWII rifles; that might be a possibility.