W-SS in Spain

[K.Kocjancic]

I know, that no W-SS units were in Spain, but where there any German soldiers, who then (after Spain) transfered to W-SS?

Kocjo

[Paddy Keating]

The Waffen-SS didn't exist at the time of the Spanish Civil War. There were doubtless Allegemeine-SS members in the Legion Condor but not officially representing the SS, in the same way that there were without doubt NSDAP members. Many members of the Legion Condor air squadrons were, for example, members of the NSFK and had been members of the DLV, which were NSDAP organisations.

Prosper Keating

[harry palmer]

Oskar Dirlewanger served with the Condor Legion in Spain…..

[K.Kocjancic]

Oskar Dirlewanger served with the Condor Legion in Spain…..

Sorry for late reply.

Are you sure about Dirlewanger? Did he get any medal for this?

Regards,
Kocjo

[harry palmer]

Positive, Kocjo, I’ll look up the details for you.
In the meantime, Could you kindly translate this for me?

“Zive naj vsi narodi,
ki hrepene docakat dan,
de koder sonce hodi,
prepir iz sveta
bo pregnan”

[K.Kocjancic]

Let live all the nations,
which yearns for to live to see the day,
where the sun walks,
quarrel from the world
will be banish.

OK, this is not a best translation of »Zdravljica« (Toast, drinking song) poem from France Preseren, Slovene greatest poet (these are my professor's words, not mine! ), I'm not a poet like he was. He is famous for his »drinking problems« .

BTW. Why are you interested in Slovene national hymn?

Regards,
Kocjo

[Panzerpionier]

Could anybody prove that Dirlewanger served in the Legion Condor? I have read it several times in doubtful sources, but I never saw any factual evidence of it.

Best regards

[harry palmer]

It’s in the “Cruel Hunters” by French MacLean. Someone has a loan of my copy, when I get it back I’ll give you the details.

BTW Kocjo, that quote comes from an inscription in a book given to me by a friend from Slovenia who left Ireland without giving me a translation. Thanks for the details about France Preseren, poets with “drinking problems” are well known in this country too….

[harry palmer]

“Released from prison on October 11th 1936, Dirlewanger then attempted to get his case reopened and apparently raised the wrath of the Gauleiter as he was placed in protective custody in Welzheim from February 14th to March 19, 1937. Soon after his released from Welzheim, Dirlewanger went to Spain with the Condor Legion on the Advice of Gottleib Berger.”

“Dirlewanger initially served in Spain from April 1937 until November 1937. Then, the long arm of Gauleiter Murr learned of Dirlewanger’s military acitivities in Spain with the Condor Legion, and apparently arranged for him to be taken prisoner in Toledo for “political unreliability” and for his transport back to Germany under the escort of a Gestapo officer. But Dirlewanger now had some allies of his own- powerful allies. The commander of panzer troops in Spain, Colonel Ritter von Thoma, worked hard for Dirlewanger’s return to Spain. SS-Standartenfuhrer Viktor Brack of the Chancellory of the Fuhrer also helped. It is likely that Gottleib Berger, now in the SS and an SS-Oberfuhrer, may also have assisted his old friend. Shortly thereafter, Dirlewanger returned to Spain.
Dirlewanger apparently performed well in Spain. On November 20, 1939 Colonel Ritter von Thoma wrote a statement describing Dirlewanger’s performance while serving with the Condor Legion:
Dr Oskar Dirlewanger served with me from April to October 1937 and
from July 1938 to may 1939 in the training camp as company
commander, and during these seventeen months was outstanding
working in training.”
Dirlewanger received three decorations for his service in Spain. From Spain he received the Spanish Campaign Medal, as did all members of the Condor Legion, and the Spanish Military Service Cross. From Germany, he received the Spanish Cross in Silver.”

THE CRUEL HUNTERS, French L. MacLean

[K.Kocjancic]

“Released from prison on October 11th 1936, Dirlewanger then attempted to get his case reopened and apparently raised the wrath of the Gauleiter as he was placed in protective custody in Welzheim from February 14th to March 19, 1937. Soon after his released from Welzheim, Dirlewanger went to Spain with the Condor Legion on the Advice of Gottleib Berger.”

“Dirlewanger initially served in Spain from April 1937 until November 1937. Then, the long arm of Gauleiter Murr learned of Dirlewanger’s military acitivities in Spain with the Condor Legion, and apparently arranged for him to be taken prisoner in Toledo for “political unreliability” and for his transport back to Germany under the escort of a Gestapo officer. But Dirlewanger now had some allies of his own- powerful allies. The commander of panzer troops in Spain, Colonel Ritter von Thoma, worked hard for Dirlewanger’s return to Spain. SS-Standartenfuhrer Viktor Brack of the Chancellory of the Fuhrer also helped. It is likely that Gottleib Berger, now in the SS and an SS-Oberfuhrer, may also have assisted his old friend. Shortly thereafter, Dirlewanger returned to Spain.
Dirlewanger apparently performed well in Spain. On November 20, 1939 Colonel Ritter von Thoma wrote a statement describing Dirlewanger’s performance while serving with the Condor Legion:
Dr Oskar Dirlewanger served with me from April to October 1937 and
from July 1938 to may 1939 in the training camp as company
commander, and during these seventeen months was outstanding
working in training.”
Dirlewanger received three decorations for his service in Spain. From Spain he received the Spanish Campaign Medal, as did all members of the Condor Legion, and the Spanish Military Service Cross. From Germany, he received the Spanish Cross in Silver.”

THE CRUEL HUNTERS, French L. MacLean

Thanks for the info.
What was a official name of Colonel Ritter von Thoma's unit?

Regards,
Kocjo

[Andres]

Hi Kocjo,

Von Thoma's unit was Abteilung 88, also known as Abteilung Drohne, that were the armoured units of the German ground units (Group Imker) of the Legion Condor.

[K.Kocjancic]

Thanks goes to you too, Andres!

[Ostuf Charlemagne]

It is known that 50 members of the SS served in Spain during the civil war,some of them in police intelligence service....for instance the franquist police ''brigada politica y social'' was formed by the Gestapo.At the same time the Gestapo helped to train and form the Salazar's Portugal political police,the dreaded PIDE,who existed until 1974.

[K.Kocjancic]

According to "Fallen sparrows: the international brigades in the Spanish Civil War" (p. 99) where were several members of International Brigades, that have then joined W-SS. Anyone heard anything on this?

Regards,
KK

[Semenov]

One sweden waffen-SS volunteer served in Interbrigade.
Finnish SS officer Y.P.I. Kaila served in Spanish Foreign Legion.
Few french and norsk waffen-SS volunteers served in Franco army