"Hitler's First War" by Thomas Weber

[Jim S]

Has anyone read or heard of this new book - Hitler's First War - by Dr. Thomas Weber? It was discussed a little on BBC radio - it puts a different twist (spin?) on Hitler's duties in WW1 and what his fellow soldiers thought of him.

[Roderick]

Hitler's the biggest heartache was WW1 so he was never promoted...

on the other hand in WW2 he was a spanner in the works!

RodErick

[Max Williams]

Has anyone read or heard of this new book - Hitler's First War - by Dr. Thomas Weber? It was discussed a little on BBC radio - it puts a different twist (spin?) on Hitler's duties in WW1 and what his fellow soldiers thought of him.

I thought it was a prime example of a post-war attempt at anti-Hitler propaganda. So much for Hitler being a messenger behind the front lines and not seeing action in WW1. He was present at several major engagements, was awarded both classes of Iron Cross and the Black Wound Badge. He finished the war in hospital as a victim of a mustard gas attack. This book does its best to portray Hitler enjoying the "luxuries" of regimental headquarters and using the spare time to continue his interests in art. To suggest that the Iron Cross was awarded to regimental HQ runners as a matter of course, demeans an award for bravery and in my opinion is an insult to all who received the decoration. Hitler was promoted to Gefreiter, but did not receive further promotion because he displayed insufficient leadership skills. Whether we like it or not, Hitler saw active service, even whilst serving as a regimental runner. If we are to believe this book, Hitler was promoted, received two decorations for bravery, a further decoration for being wounded and inhaled mustard gas all while he was busy painting at regimental headquarters. :roll:
Max.

[Jim S]

Thanks Max - I think I won't bother trying to find the book. It seems like a lot of effort goes into trying to find a new angle or "spin" on history, just to get a book published.

[Max Williams]

Thanks Max - I think I won't bother trying to find the book. It seems like a lot of effort goes into trying to find a new angle or "spin" on history, just to get a book published.

In this case, I think you've hit the nail on the head. However, any new reliable information that comes to light should be published. History is an ongoing process, but substantiated facts are imperative.
Max.

[jeffhan373]

Opinions of this sort help a great deal when you're trying to decide about buying pricey new books. Thanks to all concerned!

In a similar vein, is anyone familiar with "Corporal Hitler and the Great War 1914-1918: the List Regiment" by John F. Williams? It's a mighty expensive paperback....

[J. Duncan]

The book is less about Hitler and more about "runners". Just another cheap attempt at smearing Hitler. Let's face it, according to the "powers that be" (the "established historical network") nothing, absolutely NOTHING good can be said about the man! He was a pervert, his breath was foul, he couldn't control his digestive gases, he chewed carpets when he got angry, he had women defecate on his head, he molested his niece, he was a coward because he killed himself, he was a bungler, a liar, an inhuman "monster" who deserves nothing but smear, hatred, and slime dumped on him. I'm rather amazed at how these so-called "historians" continue to project their own twisted fantasies onto his life, cranking out absurdities in books that continue to get published and devoured by a very gullible and ignorant public.

I'm not defending Hitler...he killed a lot of people and I wouldn't want to live under his ideological system...but I dislike falsehood, make-believe, and smear tactics.

[ThomasWeber]

Dear Max and Jim,
yes, Max is absolutely right that "substantiated facts are imperative". May I therefore suggest that you first look at the evidence I present in my book before you attack it. I have to say that I did not really detect my book and the claims I make in my book in your postings. Nowhere does my book say that Hitler was ‘enjoying the "luxuries" of regimental headquarters and using the spare time to continue his interests in art.’
I do not put 'spin' on anything just to get published. I am a scholar and all that I care about is if something is right or wrong. I would never claim anything that I cannot substantiate just to get published.

Dear J. Duncan,
I do not think that it is fair to accuse me of 'smear tactics' and for writing for an 'ignorant public'. What is your evidence for this accusation? Have you looked at my evidence and at what I actually say in my book?

[Max Williams]

Dear Max and Jim,
yes, Max is absolutely right that "substantiated facts are imperative". May I therefore suggest that you first look at the evidence I present in my book before you attack it. I have to say that I did not really detect my book and the claims I make in my book in your postings. Nowhere does my book say that Hitler was ‘enjoying the "luxuries" of regimental headquarters and using the spare time to continue his interests in art.’
I do not put 'spin' on anything just to get published. I am a scholar and all that I care about is if something is right or wrong. I would never claim anything that I cannot substantiate just to get published.

I have looked at the evidence and it does not detract from my assessment. Understandably, you have used evidence supposedly from Hitler's First World War colleagues, but you fail to indicate that such evidence can be tainted by historical events. For illustration only, personal evidence gained prior to the demise of the Hitler regime paints an entirely different picture to that gained post-WW2 when the world and his mother in Germany were queuing up to distance themselves from the Nazis and to join with the winning side in negating anything which appeared to show Hitler and his cronies in a favourable light. Just as facts were twisted for propaganda purposes during the Third Reich regime in order to illustrate positive features of Nazis. Why do you suppose the media jumped upon your book? If it had a new revelation that Hitler was a "brave gung-ho combatant" who deserved his bravery awards for "rescuing women and children from a burning barn" or "taking a bullet for his commander," my guess is it wouldn't have seen the light of day in the media. Hitler did not spend the entire war as a regimental runner.
Your book does give the impression that the award of the Iron Cross was commonly given to flat arses who did not participate in the fighting. Even messengers had to run the gauntlet and were shot at and blown up.
As for your quotes from my previous post, you appear to miss the fact that my use of such terms was to illustrate that your book infers the like and that they were facetiously inserted.
All authors have to accept criticism as well as praise and I am sorry if you cannot accept that I did not consider your book to be a credible historical study, particularly surrounding Hitler's war record. I am sure there will be others of a differing opinion.
Max.

[Igor Karpov]

In a similar vein, is anyone familiar with "Corporal Hitler and the Great War 1914-1918: the List Regiment" by John F. Williams? It's a mighty expensive paperback....

Well, let me quote just a few pages from this book:

"In his five months as a dispatch runner, Hitler had never experienced ‘such heavy fire’. His task was to bring messages from the regimental headquarters at Halpegarde through a ‘way that had literally been dug up by shells’ into the Bois du Biez. From there he had to find his way across the dangerously exposed country to the Bavarian assault battalions who were now mixed up with Prussians all the way to the British positions at Neuve Chapelle. Battlefield confusion was adding
an extra dimension to the dispatch runners’ load".

The confusion came into being because the different formations from our regiment, as they disembarked from their trains, were immediately marched to the Front and had gone into action, on their own account, between Prussian troops. The battle orderlies, Hitler, Lippert, Schmidt and Weiss had the task, in so far as possible, to re-establish the connection, which was made all the more difficult by the frightful fire and the soggy ground under-foot. Hitler said later in Fournes that he had to deliver reports by creeping forward from one shell-hole to another, and that sometimes the sulphur fumes only allowed him to see 10 metres to the Front. While waiting, Hitler paced ‘around like a restless tiger in the farm at Halpegarde . . . Even the colonel said: “I can scarcely believe that my orderlies can come through this fire.”’ By now, all contact between battalions had broken down and ‘the difficult task of re-establishing it’ was left to dispatch runners. Petz, sitting by the map in Halpegarde, was ‘striking the table in rage: “How shall I give orders then, when I don’t know where my people are?”’

Hitler seems to have thrived in this battle, going about his duties with ‘a spring in his step and unworried as always’. While he believed himself chosen by Fate for greater things, he was more than ready to give Fate a helping hand, never neglecting ‘to pick out on the map those points on the way that could be dangerous to him’. He was said to be ‘as cunning as a fox [who] knows exactly when to keep his head down. During a barrage on the position the day before yesterday . . . no one could have shown more care!’ Even so, the risks were considerable. ‘If anyone is sent out to the trenches today’, one orderly was quoted as saying, ‘he will be lucky to come back. The fire is fearsome. If I am caught today, I can only hope I do not have to suffer for too long.’ Hitler was unperturbed, strapping ‘his dispatch case on so tightly that it would take a day to get it off. He should get a decoration today. However, he has to be careful not to get his head blown off first.’ He did not win a decoration but did confirm his value. Petz stated that ‘when he needed a reliable man for an important report, [he] called for Hitler’: as well as bravery, a good dispatch runner needed ‘intelligence and sharp wits’. After Neuve Chapelle, Hitler’s virtues were ‘well known among the regimental staff’.

"Corporal Hitler and the Great War 1914-1918: the List Regiment", pp. 95-96.

Regards,
Igor

[Igor Karpov]

"[The] communication trenches leading to the positions furthest forward provided little protection; they were not deep enough and already, on the first crossings, caused many casualties. Adolf Hitler had to take these dangerous paths several times daily and, if he wanted to come through safe and sound, was obliged to crawl more so than march. Not even the slightest movement escaped English snipers.

At the end of April, the regiment went into rest. Dispatch runners now had little to do. Hitler spent much of his time pontificating ‘on his favourite topics, art and painting’. Officers like Wiedemann were patronizing about Hitler’s homespun Bayrisch monologues but among his peers, while some thought him a ‘know-all’, most ‘listened to him gladly. . . amazed how well informed he was’.

Towards midday Mend left Fromelles with the staff doctor. He was told that ‘during the fierce fighting, [Hitler] had delivered his messages under heavy machine-gun and artillery fire and by repeatedly risking his life had contributed greatly to the victory’."

Ibid., pp. 105 and 111.

Regards,
Igor

[Igor Karpov]

The video, where author himself explains the motives which prompted him to write a book.

http://www.meettheauthor.co.uk/bookbites/1927.html

Regards,
Igor

[Max Williams]

This illustrates my point perfectly. Where was the BBC interview when this book "Corporal Hitler and the Great War 1914-1918: the List Regiment" by John F. Williams was published?
Max.

[Max Williams]

There's also a DVD on the subject, by Ian Kershaw and the late Stuart Russell, which is also in direct contradiction to Mr. Weber's book.
Max.

[jeffhan373]

The Stuart Russell DVD is supplemented by his book, published by the Arndt Verlag in 2006, "Frontsoldat Hitler. Der Freiwillige des Ersten Weltkrieges". The book is 8-1/2" x 12" and contains many interesting period illustrations as well as some "After the Battle" Then and Now type comparisons. I don't believe this ever came out in an English translation, but it should be available via Amazon.de. It's well worth getting if you're interested in this part of Hitler's life.