Franz Ferdinand's car

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Vitesse
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Re: Franz Ferdinand's car

#31

Post by Vitesse » 17 Jul 2008, 23:15

Peter H wrote:I-635 was actually " a large Mercedes Benz,the second car in the convoy".It was driven by the German Otto Merz,later a famous racing car driver who died in an accident in 1933.
Point of order: given that the Mercedes Benz company wasn't formed until 1926, the car driven by Merz was a Mercedes, built by Daimler. Daimler and Benz were separate companies in 1914.

Otto Merz, incidentally, was the archetypal "gentle giant": his party piece was driving six-inch nails through table tops using nothing but his bare hand 8O

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Division
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Re: Franz Ferdinand's car

#32

Post by Division » 06 Jan 2009, 20:32

Some of pics about that case when terrorist serb Gavrilo Princip kill Ferdinand and his wife:

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Gavrilo pistol

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Terrorist Gavrilo foots in concrete and upon that serbian komunists write: ''from this place 28.jun, 1914 Gavrilo express folks protest againt AU''.
ps: Gavrilo is serbian cetnics hero, and allways was. In Sarajevo there was bridge name by Gavrilo Princip, or music group, or some folks assotiation, etc. When Bosniacs get independence they change all that, and for them Gavrilo is one more serbian terrorist.

Bosnians change that and wrote new tittle:
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Ferdinand automobile

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Bridge named by Princip Gavrilo, after bosnian independent 1992.g., they change name of this bridge.

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Franz and Sofia

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From trial from left to right: Trifko Grabež, Nedeljko Čabrinović, Gavrilo Princip, Danilo Ilić i Mirko Jovanović(all serbs).

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Vojvoda Brane Bogunovic,commandant of Korpusa names "Gavrilo Princip" with his cetnics.

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Serbian medal for bravery named by terrorist Gavrilo Princip

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Serbian folklore group ''Gavrilo Princip''.

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Tony Eaton
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Re: Franz Ferdinand's car

#33

Post by Tony Eaton » 15 May 2009, 16:34

I have read quite a bit about the Ferdinand's car and its number plate and I think it is genuine. I once studied a book on the assassination and took a magnifying glass to one of the photographs of the events that had been taken at the time and the number plate when enlarged read, A111 118. I believe that it is one of those astonishing coincendences that have appeared throughout history.

collector 49
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Re: Franz Ferdinand's car

#34

Post by collector 49 » 22 Jun 2009, 16:45

I knew I had saved a copy of the original Internet story - hope this helps.

It originally appeared on Friday, Novemeber 12, 2004 on the "This is southampton" / Welcome / Daily Echo website. It is entitled "Brian regiester an amazing discovery". The store contains a clear photo of the Arch Duke getting into his car, and the front license plate apparently reads "A111118".

Karl
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Re: Franz Ferdinand's car

#35

Post by Karl » 24 Jun 2009, 07:10

Thank you. It would be great if you could provide where the writer got his information from.

When will the government do the right thing and offer it back to Harrach heirs.

maiol7
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Re: Franz Ferdinand's car

#36

Post by maiol7 » 20 Aug 2009, 15:47

I received a note from Axis about following up on this forum, so by reading in i see that you haven't solved completely the discussion of the car's plate number! So the original is as you correctly said in the Museum in Vienna with the strange number plates and the other car in the Castle of Arstetten with the number I 635 is a perfekt copy of the original car and was prepared for a film on the subject in 1982-83. The motor of the car was made so it could actually be driven although very shortly. As for the trial, the case is closed and i don't think the Austrian Govt would ever freely "open" the discussion again! The heirs still have the owner papers. Maybe the next generation!
I don't think there is much more to say about this wonderful car. I had sent this link to a more informed person about Arstetten, but i see that he did not log in. I hope I was of some help!

maiol7
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Re: Franz Ferdinand's car

#37

Post by maiol7 » 20 Aug 2009, 15:53

You may also call the Museum below if you really want to know the exact plate number. I am not sure i want to go there myself.

Heeresgeschichtliches Museum
Arsenal, Objekt 18
A-1030 Wien
Tel: +43 (1) 79561-0
Fax: +43 (1) 79561-1017707

they will certainly be glad to give you the information! good luck!

history1
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Re: Franz Ferdinand's car

#38

Post by history1 » 23 Aug 2009, 18:18

Karl wrote:...When will the government do the right thing and offer it back to Harrach heirs.
Hopefully never 8-)
What does those sniffy heirs think to use the address "earl" even after more then 89 years when the prohibited it by law (http://www.verwaltung.steiermark.at/cms ... 347361/DE/)??

Karl
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Re: Franz Ferdinand's car

#39

Post by Karl » 15 Oct 2009, 11:03

wieder ein socialist!?!

oh östereich, oh östereich, kleine ostmark - vergangen, vergangen - est ist nuhr aber luft.

Karl
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Re: Franz Ferdinand's car

#40

Post by Karl » 16 Oct 2009, 07:17

The license plate is real...(new'ish hsitorical anomalousness; the newest USS NEW YORK partially made from steel from the towers has made to sea - there were maybe six previous incarnations: one whose keel was laid (1906 or 1914 or somewhere there abouts...somewhere...there...) on sept 11 - belief in coincidences is religion. chaos is an oxymoron!

mikedash
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Re: Franz Ferdinand's car

#41

Post by mikedash » 10 May 2010, 18:09

For anyone interested, I recently wrote up a reinvestigation of the various legends surrounding the Franz Ferdinand's car and posted the results here:

http://blogs.forteana.org/node/118

I'm grateful to various forum members for posting information that was useful in the writing of this article. A couple of conclusions are worth mentioning here:

- With regard to the "death car" legend, I was unable to trace this back further than Frank Edwards' notorious potboiler Stranger Than Science (1959), which is not a reputable source. All the secondary sources that allege various deaths were associated with the car imply it was in private hands till c.1926, so I have submitted an enquiry to the Military Museum in Vienna and requested a check of accession records to see if the car actually became part of the museum collections before that date, as is implied on this board occurred. If I get a response, I'll update my article.

- It is worth noting, however, that the vehicle still bears bullet holes dating to 28 June 1914, which would seem pretty implausible if the vehicle had been extensively repaired on at least three occasions, as required by the death car legend. I believe this in itself is really enough to demolish the myth.

- With regards to the number plate, the coincidence certainly is remarkable. Don't forget, though, that it's much more remarkable to a Brit than it would be to an Austrian, because the number plate's "A for Armistice" is meaningless to a German speaker (the German for 'armistice' is 'waffenstillstand'), and the date 11-11-18 occurred a week after the Austro-Hungarian army was knocked out of the war (armistice signed on 3 November, coming to effect on 4-11-18).

Cheers and thanks again for posting so much good-quality information.

Moorthorpe12
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Re: Franz Ferdinand's car

#42

Post by Moorthorpe12 » 09 Sep 2010, 21:35

Forgive me if anyone has already posted this, but the second picture down on this:

http://members.a1.net/oswag/wago38.html

web page seems to confirm AIII 118 as Franz Ferdinand's car.

filigranofil
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Re: Franz Ferdinand's car

#43

Post by filigranofil » 28 Nov 2017, 22:44

Hello,

I suppose, that this documents shows, who is the owner of the "Franz Ferdinand's car" :idea:

Count Harrach donation...

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Kaiser & Königs letter of thanks...

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which was signed by "Erster Oberhofmeister" Alfred, 2nd Prince of Montenuovo and Grandee of Spain:

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regards
Darko

history1
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Re: Franz Ferdinand's car

#44

Post by history1 » 29 Nov 2017, 22:36

Hi Darko,

you wrote " this documents shows, who is the owner of the "Franz Ferdinand's car" that´s incorrect because it should be "who the owner was" as Graf Harrach did donate the car in this letter.

"Kaiser & Königs letter of thank" is also wrong as the heading reads
" Seiner K & K Apostolischen Majestät
ERSTER OBERSTHOFMEISTER"

In the letter he states that his majesty did order to incorporate the car into the Museum of Military History in Vienna.
more about this enemy of Franz Ferdinand:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfred,_2 ... Montenuovo

Regards,
Roman

James A Pratt III
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Re: Franz Ferdinand's car

#45

Post by James A Pratt III » 29 Nov 2017, 22:39

There is a After the Battle Magazine issue that deals with FF assassination with their usual then and now photos.

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