Terry Duncan waxes passionate about Chancellor Bethmann's alleged "lies."
Not at all, I simply pointed them out. You seem to be getting somewhat passionate about denying the obvious.
Stop the presses! Bethmann lied! Or did he simply make a [very small] mistake? After all, Bethmann submitted the proposal on the evening of the 28th. A few hours later it would be the 29th.
The proposal was submitted to the Austrians in the evening of the 28th, it had been sent by Bethmann earlier in the day, indeed just after Austria declared war.
Apparently Mr. Duncan is wondering why the plan was not submitted on that date. The reason is that the Kaiser had not made his proposal until 10:00 A.M.
This was all covered once before by Jon when you made the same 'mistake' previously. The written proposal was submitted at 10.00 on the 28th, the original suggestion came on the Kaisers return the previous day.
As to the othe lie, it was mistakenly not in the sction I copied over, though it was in the original reply if you had bothered, but I will post it once again;
He had summoned the Ministers of State to today’s meeting to give them a survey of the present political situation, as far as this was possible. The situation varied from hour to hour and was still doubtful in view of the uncertain factors in developments. His Majesty had tried to get an understanding between the Vienna and St. Petersburg Governments. The Vienna Government, after the Serbian rejection of its terms, had made a declaration at St. Petersburg that it had no territorial aims and did not wish to infringe the integrity of the Serbian State [a statement which had never been made by Berchtold.]
So, Bethmann is deliberately telling lies here and inventing promises and diplomatic actions Berchtold never undertook. Why is Bethmann deceiving his own ministers?
Meanwhile, the real-life lie told by Grey on August 3d is deleted because it is off topic.
Just thought you ought to know
Peter, you can post anything about Grey and British diplomatic and military commitment in the thread YOU started on that topic, it does not belong in one YOU started on Russian mobilization. Rambling threads that wander off onto any topic that occurs to you are not the purpose of this forum, and you have been asked not to do it many times. If you do not like this simple request, feel free to post on other sites that allow such practices.