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Most flown Nationalist ground attack aircraft

Discussions on all aspects of the Spanish Civil War including the Condor Legion, the Germans fighting for Franco in the Spanish Civil War.

Most flown Nationalist ground attack aircraft

Postby normski- on 08 Jun 2012 23:40

Hi... this is a general, slightly silly sounding question but I have a genuine reason for asking it.

Suppose you are a Republican soldier sitting in a trench. You serve for the duration of the war on the front line in most of the major battles. Which Nationalist aircraft are you most likely to be attacked by?

The reason: I want to select one ground attack aircraft out of all those flown by the Nationalists, to represent the entire combined Nationalist air forces throughout the war (for a game I've been working on).

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Re: Most flown Nationalist ground attack aircraft

Postby Orwell1984 on 09 Jun 2012 00:13

Looking at numbers served in Spain I think the He 51 might be a better bet.
Approx 23 Breda 65 served in the Spanish Civil War Forces. While they did many sorties, they weren't in as many combat areas as the He 51.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breda_Ba.65
The Heinkel He 51 has substantially more of the type in service with the Legion Condor and the Nationalist Air Force.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heinkel_He_51
79 of the C-1 ground attack version were sent to Spain and that's not counting the other versions there that switched over to ground attack after they became outclassed as fighters.
Of course the time you're looking at in the war is a factor but over all I'm going to stick with the He 51.

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Re: Most flown Nationalist ground attack aircraft

Postby Ironmachine on 09 Jun 2012 07:15

Yes, I agree, if you have to use only one aircraft then the He-51 will be the best option, just considering the numbers employed and that it remained the main ground attack aircraft of the Spanish Air Force after the war (not counting the newly-produced I-15s).

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Re: Most flown Nationalist ground attack aircraft

Postby normski- on 09 Jun 2012 08:03

Thanks.

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Re: Most flown Nationalist ground attack aircraft

Postby normski- on 10 Jun 2012 09:18

I'm looking at available pictures of the He51 in the SCW.

Viewed from above, each wing carries the following insignia:

a white cross, and either a single black roundel, or a black roundel pair in figure of 8 shape. Or in some instances, no roundel. Were these styles unique to distinct units?

Is it possible to say which was most common during the entire course of the war: the single black roundel, the black roundel pair, or no roundel?

I also notice a variety of camouflage schemes, falling into basically 2 types: what looks like a winter camo scheme of green, brown and grey, and a summer scheme of sand and green splodges.

Is it possible to say which of these types was most frequently used, again over the entire course of the war?

- Thanks for humouring me in this matter

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Re: Most flown Nationalist ground attack aircraft

Postby Ironmachine on 10 Jun 2012 13:03

There was "some freedom" regarding plane markings, but I would go with a single black roundel.
Regarding camouflage, there was even more freedom. See for example:
http://www.network54.com/Forum/394728/message/1155114067/Perfiles+del+He-51+en+la+GCE
http://www.network54.com/Forum/394728/message/1132065425/Para+Roberto+Prieto---Heinkel+51++%26quot%3BPERFILES%26quot%3B
When the planes were passed on to Spanish units, there was even more variation, and of course most modern representations are mostly guesses from b&w period pictures, so it is far from sure that they are correct.
IMHO, anyone of the two schemes you mention would be good enough; I would not be overly worried about perfect accuracy, considering that you are trying to represent what were basically three different air forces (Aviación Española, Luftwaffe's Kondor Legion, and Aviazione Legionaria) over a period of three years with just one aircraft type (that was not employed by one of them, also).
Regards.

P.S.: is your game a board game, or computer-based?

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Re: Most flown Nationalist ground attack aircraft

Postby normski- on 10 Jun 2012 20:53

Thanks.

The game is a PC based mod, an upgrade of my freeware GCE mod of the Microsoft game Close Combat 3 to a freeware mod of its successor, Close Combat Cross of Iron, the commercial game being sold by Matrix Games. Various other people have been involved in the project over the years and contribute invaluable help.

12 years in the making, it is an interpretation of the GCE which is deeply flawed and unrealistic, whilst trying to achieve the opposite. I will let you know when it is finished, so you can laugh at it

I should really get out more. ;)

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