Why do people overlook this when believing Hitler escaped?

[hairyballs]

Dr Goebbels, his wife and children were killed. Hitler loved the children dearly. Goebbels was Hitlers right hand man during that time and stayed with Hitler to the very end. Don't you think that if Hitler had escaped, he would have taken Goebbels family with him?

[wenty]

Hi Hairyball,

Firstly, great name.

Second, there's been lengthy discussions about Hitler's escape on these forums before, including a particular topic which I was part of for a very long time with that same name. I'd recommend having a read through them if you want to gain a greater insight into some of the reasons why some of us believe there is a distinct possibility that Hitler might have escaped.

Regarding Goebbels, this is true but Hitler turned against many of his top men (or they turned against him) in the final days of the war - Himmler and Goering to name two. He was not in a mental or physical state to be making decisions based on emotion - or decisions full stop, one could argue. Besides, it was difficult enough for one person to attempt to escape the encircled Berlin bu that stage, never mind trying to find an escape path for Joseph, Magda and all of the young children. There would be a very real risk that they, particularly the children, would have been captured by the Soviets and it's horrible to think of what they might have been subjected to. It was a risk that wouldn't be taken - Hitler even killed his dog and her pups!

Cheers,
Adam.

[Sid Guttridge]

Hi Wenty,

Do you know something about the thread initiator that the rest of us don't?

I thought it was Hitler that only had one b@//?

Is this AHF's greatest coup?

An intrigued Sid.

[Sid Guttridge]

Hi HB,

Good point.

Sid.

[john2]

In his Hitler's last will and testament Goebbels was supposed to be the new chancellor and Doenitz the new president. Problem was Berlin was about to be captured by the Soviets while Doenitz was in an area not yet occupied. A little known fact is that Goebbels called for a cease fire which lasted a few hours. The Soviets accepted because it gave them time to strengthen their positions. Goebbels tried to convince Zhukov to let him leave Berlin and form his new government. The Soviets of course saw no advantage in this and demanded the unconditional surrender of the city as well as everyone in the bunker. Goebbels refused and so the fighting continued. It was then that he decided for him and his family to die.

[wenty]

Sid,

(Or should i call you "id" ?)....sorry I can't help you there, i've got no inclination to know the genital make up of either Hitler or this thread's initiator.

John,

Where did you get this information about a ceasefire? I know Krebs talked to Chuikov on May 1 but there was no agreement. The Germans were particularly proud of the fact that they had not allowed Berlin to fall on May 1 - May Day. The Russians were never going to accept anything less than an unconditional surrender and any diversions outside of this would surely have been futile efforts to prolong the war a little longer.

In any case, this is all besides the point of how it relates to a potential escape of Hitler.

Cheers,
Adam.

[john2]

I said Zhukov my mistake. I got my info from the book "The Fall of Berlin" written by Chuikov - one of the other generals who helped take Berlin. The cease fire is mentioned in his book but I have not found references to it anywhere else.

Where did you get this information about a ceasefire? I know Krebs talked to Chuikov on May 1 but there was no agreement. The Germans were particularly proud of the fact that they had not allowed Berlin to fall on May 1 - May Day. The Russians were never going to accept anything less than an unconditional surrender and any diversions outside of this would surely have been futile efforts to prolong the war a little longer.

Well what I got from the book was that there was a ceasefire to allow the Germans to negotiate. Goebbels offered the city's surrender in exchange for allowing him to leave Berlin and join Doenitz in the new government. I can't remember offhand if any other terms were asked for. Chuikov rejected the offer and demanded unconditional surrender. Anyhow I brought it up as a reason Goebbels would stay behind.

[wenty]

Hi John,

I wouldn't necessarily believe everything that was written in a book which was no doubt published in the Soviet era. It is possible that Chuikov had some information to that effect but i've got "Berlin: The Downfall 1945" by Antony Beevor on my bookshelf, which is quite a complete account of the battle. I'll check it out and see if he mentions anything about a ceasefire.

Again though, I can only re-iterate that i've never heard of it, and it must have been pretty brief if it was the case as Goebbels killed himself and his family on May 1, just a day after Hitler.

Cheers,
Adam.

[David1819]

Look at the big picture when it comes to this theory instead of the details. Hitler's profile and notoriety would have made it impossible for him to escape and avoid capture. If he did attempt to escape people would have had to be involved and someone sooner or later someone would spill the beans as people cannot keep their mouths shut

[wenty]

Hi David,

I agree with you that it would have been difficult but perhaps not as difficult as some believe. The main problem, I think, is that there's so many ridiculous theories about Hitler's escape that it takes away from some of the more genuine theories. I won't go into details here as it's been done to death on other threads before, but there actually is some pretty compelling evidence that Hitler managed a last minute escape.

We must remember here that this is a man who had dodged close calls all of his life, and who still had allies who were loyal in other countries. Those who helped him escape need be only a handful of people who were fiercely loyal, and who had plenty of skeletons in the closet themselves without blabbing to everyone about their having helped him escape. Given his condition in 1945, it's unlikely that he would have lived for more than a few years afterward anyway.

Of course this is all purely hypothetical, but I would encourage people to approach the subject and the evidence with an open mind. Again, there's ample discussion on this subject elsewhere - the thread "Hitler's escape" (now locked) would be a good start.

Cheers,
Adam.