Divisional daily supply requirements for various nations

[Delta Tank]

To all,

I hope this has not been posted and if so please forgive. I found this and I thought it was interesting and relevant to the discussion:http://books.google.com/books?id=evuk1L ... wjhk4MDBb0

The book is entitled: "How to Make War" by Jim Dugan. I tried to cut and past it to this site, but I could not do it.

Read page 502, he states this, that the German Army needed 28 pounds per day and the US Army needed 55 pounds per day. In the German Army, 40% of that 28 pounds was ammo, 38% was fuel/fodder, and the rest was food, spares, etc. In the American Army 50% was ammo and 36% was fuel.

Mike

[Delta Tank]

To all,

I found this on another thread:http://www.army.mil/cmh-pg/books/wwii/l ... -ch05.html

Although the supply lines from the beaches and coastal harbors would provide a daily average of 3,500 tons each to the First and Third Armies during the period of 16-22 September, this was not enough. Both of the American armies desired a daily supply tonnage double this figure; and the 12th Army Group, utilizing the logistical experiences since D Day, had arrived at the conclusion that in days of attack each division (plus its supporting corps and army troops) would require a minimum supply of 600 tons.4

If you divide that 600 ton figure by 40,000 men you get 30 pounds per man per day. The 40,000 figure comes from the division troops+corps troops+COMZ troops. Division plus its slice.

Mike

[Jon G.]

There are some interesting insights to be gleamed from this thread on the Panzerarchiv forum http://forum.panzer-archiv.de/viewtopic.php?t=89 specifically this post by stefan w: http://forum.panzer-archiv.de/viewtopic ... 670#123670

...in which the PAA Ib's plans for the forthcoming Gazala battles are spelled out. His calculations for Verbrauchssätze (that is, daily consumption units) per DAK unit are as follows:

21st PD..........120 m³ fuel...........32,850 liters of cold water (three liters per head)
15th PD..........105 m³ fuel...........20,700 ---"---
90th Lt.............50 m³ fuel...........12,000 ---"---

In addition, the following smaller units were specified for the following daily fuel consumption:

Verband Hohmeyer................................18 m³
KG Menton*..........................................15 m³
KSt PzAOK..........................................15 m³
Füh- + Kampfstaffel DAK.........................4 m³

*More commonly known as Sonderverband 288

Combined, that is 327 cubic meters of fuel per day, or about 240 metric tons needed per day for a corps-sized unit on offensive operations. Compare that to the monthly fuel deliveries which I posted here: http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic. ... 59#1025459 bearing in mind that the 327 m³ figure only covers what would be needed at the front.

Thirteen daily issues (that is, 4,251 cbm of fuel) would be stockpiled for the start of the offensive. Three VSs would be with the troops, the rest in corps dumps. The units specified above would need a combined total of 515 m³ fuel to reach their jump-off positions.

The Ib only calculates with three days' worth of ammunition - 2¼ in corps dumps and ¾ with the troops - but that was mainly because the shortage of truck tonnage precluded larger stocks being accumulated. It's implied that the Ib would have liked more ammunition stockpiled.

The Ib calculated that the following truck tonnage would be needed to move the ammunition about:

21st PD....336 tons (and 112 tons' worth of truck lift with frontline units cf. 3:1 rear:front relationship)
15th PD....300 plus 100
90th Lt......330 plus 110
2nd S.Art....57 plus 19

There were also ten days of food rations issued, all kept by the troops who might either have to stretch their rations to last longer, or supply with captured food stocks.

All data ruthlessly swiped from stefan w's post. I take consolation that the Panzerarchiv thread also links to AHF threads...

[Delta Tank]

To all,

A very interesting article on supply by air. Read it here:
http://www.airpower.maxwell.af.mil/airc ... ughan.html

Mike

[Davide Pastore]

I can add the expected supply requirements for Italian troops taking part in C3, as per Regio Esercito plans.

Caveat: it was a 99+% "leg" force.

Daily supply per man, on average, minimum & optimum (meaning: the absolute minimal requirement for surviving, and the optimal level of supplies):

3kg-10kg water (it was assumed there was none in the landing area)
6kg-6kg ammunition (meaning, it was the first priority)
2kg-3.5kg food (including firewood for field kitchens)
0.3kg-1.5kg gasoline and diesel oil (there were very few motorvehicles)
0.2kg-1kg others (medicals, engineerings, etc.)
11.5kg-22kg total

Expected daily average of landed supplies was 16kg per man.

[Andreas]

Interesting, grazie tante Davide.

Does that include artillery ammunition? I would think it does, since 6kg are very high per man.

So for a 10,000 man force, this would come to 160 tons/day, which appears about right given the theater distances involved.

All the best

Andreas

[Davide Pastore]

Does that include artillery ammunition?

Yes, although I have no breakdown by type.

So for a 10,000 man force, this would come to 160 tons/day, which appears about right given the theater distances involved.

Actual force is 50,000 men (grossly rounded) during the first 24 hours, plus 40,000 men more (grossly rounded) as second landing wave at some time between day 3 and day 5.

The first wave carries five days of supplies (80kg per man, on average) in the landing crafts, with the exception of the 15,000 or so paratroopers who jump with only one day of supplies and has to rely thereafter on about 12kg daily per man (180t global) of glider-borne and air-dropped cargo. If this value does not include the daily minimal 3kg of water (thereafter coming from the small tanker crafts moored along the coast, as per normal infantrymen) then it is about 12/13 of the normal infantryman load, otherwise it is 9/13.

The minimum supply level (11.5kg daily) is expected to be carried by air ferry alone (Hal Far airfield).

Before Hal Far is secured and ready to accept air traffic, the Axis can air-drop 280t [#1] daily (the paratroopers requirement plus 60% reserve, balancing the inevitable loads dropped in the wrong place). Any glider-borne load is to be to added to this value.

Once Hal Far works, the Axis can deliver a paper maximum of 1,285t [#2] daily, taking only into account the number of available aircrafts. However this means a sustained rate of one aircraft landing (and taking off) every 60 seconds, dawn to dusk, so the real number is going to be something less (possibly much less).

The minimum initial requirement is 575t daily (50,000 x 11.5kg) in the 'worst-case' scenario (no second landing wave due to RN control of the sea). If the second landing wave reaches Malta, carrying along some cargo ships, then the requirement lessens.

If the 'worst-case' happens, and Hal Far is not secured by day 5, then day 6 looks like a bad day

The "optimum" supply level needs a working port (Marsa Shlok).

[#1] [#2] my calculations

[Jon G.]

...Does that include artillery ammunition? I would think it does, since 6kg are very high per man...

Hmm, actually, 6 kg of ammunition per man per day comes out as a rather low figure if you compare it with the US figures given earlier on this thread, or if you compute backwards from the DAK figures given above. US and German figures come out at two to three times as much per man per day.

Perhaps the C3 plan assumed continuous artillery support from warships and aircraft, thereby reducing the per man ammunition requirement? Six kilos of ammunition per man per day does not seem unreasonably to me for an operation which would involve a lot of shooting - especially not if it also includes grenades, mortar ammunition and MG ammunition..

[Andreas]

Italian divisional artillery was much lighter than US or German artillery, with the heaviest guns being 100mm (and fewer of those), and the standard 75mm. This may account for lack of weight to some extent.

It is also not clear from what Davide has posted what kind of artillery was supposed to come along - my guess would be it would be lighter guns, predominantly.

Incidentally Davide - is the USMM book on C3 worth buying?

All the best

Andreas

[Davide Pastore]

Hmm, actually, 6 kg of ammunition per man per day comes out as a rather low figure

Yes, but these US & German figures are referred to a different kind of force (heavily motorised / mechanised, and heavily armed).

As a comparison, amongst the roughly 50,000 men of the first wave, the roughly 40,000 Italians carried just 64 75mm howitzers, and this was the largest Italian weapon around [#1]. This was just one-third of the already small normal Italian artillery asset.

[#1] German guns (both FJ field artillery and those carried on tanks) are to be added, however RE counted German troops as as many Italians for supply purposes. Any additional German supply requirement (including much more fuel, no doubt) would have been a German concern.

Six kilos of ammunition per man per day does not seem unreasonably to me for an operation which would involve a lot of shooting - especially not if it also includes grenades, mortar ammunition and MG ammunition..

Let's see:

64 'heavy' guns
About 1 per 625 men
10kg ? each shell
Each shell weights 16 grams per man

about 150 light guns (mainly 47mm)
About 1 per 270 men
4kg each shell (including carrying box)
Each shell weights 15 grams per man

about 200 81mm mortars
About 1 per 200 men
4.33kg each shell (including carrying box)
Each shell weights 22 grams per man

Total of 53 grams per man per each shell.

Assuming one-third of the ammo weight is reserved for Brixias, HMGs, LMGs and rifles, the remaining 4kg per men allow 76 daily rounds to every weapon. You are right, it is not exactly a luxurious supply: it is just one-third of the paper Italian allotment (250 daily rounds per gun, 200 per mortar).

Perhaps the C3 plan assumed continuous artillery support from warships and aircraft

Mainly aircrafts. A necessary prerequisite was total air superiority.

[Davide Pastore]

Incidentally Davide - is the USMM book on C3 worth buying?

If you can read Italian, yes.

(hopefully, one day I will able to recommend to you my book )

The major defect of Gabriele's book is the nearly-total absence of info about the other side of the hill. There is just something about the expected force, that is not the same thing.

There is zero as well about German involvement (including their plans about their operation, Herkules).

The book is also weak on the technicalities of the operation (who is to land where, with what, at what time) and this is the area I tried to research fully.

OTOH is excellenet on the 'grand strategy' level, and about the way the invasion plan developed through the years.

[Andreas]

Incidentally Davide - is the USMM book on C3 worth buying?

If you can read Italian, yes.

(hopefully, one day I will able to recommend to you my book )

Spero. Many thanks for the info!

A dopo

Andreas

[Davide Pastore]

Back to the original thread.

This is the daily paper requirement for a 1938 Italian infantry division (12,233 men) armed with:

12x 100/17 howitzers
24x 75/27 guns
24x 47/32 guns
8x 20/65 guns
24x 81mm mortars
171x 45mm mortars
82x HMG
288x LMG
11,233 (?) x rifles
2,000 (?) x men armed with hand grenades
1,000 (?) x pistols

Note: in Regio Esercito every soldier carried either:
- a rifle
- a pistol (officers, heavy weapons crew, etc.)
- a pistol plus a squad weapon (MG gunners)
The figure of 1,000 pistols is a very raw guess.

Note: the figure of 2,000 men is a very raw guess of the riflemen belonging to the infantry squads (the other 10,000+ men being there just to support them). I suppose only the former have any chance of throwing a grenade against something.

Daily expected consumption of ammunition was called unfoc (unità di fuoco, fire unit).

Pistol (Beretta mod.34)
Unfoc = 10 rounds
Consumption = 10 x 1,000 = 10,000 rounds
Box of 4,200 rounds weighs 66.5kg
10,000 / 4,200 = 2.38 boxes rounded to 3 x 66.5 = 200kg

Hand grenade (SRCM mod.35)
Unfoc = 4 rounds
Consumption = 4 x 2,000 = 8,000 rounds
Box of 72 rounds weighs 31kg
8,000 / 72 = 111 boxes x 31 = 3,441kg

Rifle (Carcano mod.91)
Unfoc = 60 rounds
Consumption = 11,233 x 60 = 673,980 rounds
Box of 1,620 rounds weighs 49kg
673,980 / 1,620 = 416 boxes x 49 = 20,384kg

LMG (Breda mod.30)
Unfoc = 1,300 rounds
Consumption = 288 x 1,300 = 374,400 rounds
Box of 1,200 rounds weighs 41.5kg
374,400 / 1,200 = 312 boxes x 41.5 = 12,948kg

HMG (Breda mod.37)
Unfoc = 2,000 rounds
Consumption = 82 x 2,000 = 164,000 rounds
Box of 1,200 rounds weighs 36kg
164,000 / 1,200 = 137 boxes x 36 = 4,932kg

45mm mortar (Brixia mod.35)
Unfoc = 200 rounds
Consumption = 171 x 200 = 34,200 rounds
- Shell:
Box of 45 rounds weighs 30kg
34,200 / 45 = 760 boxes x 30 = 22,800kg
- Cartridge:
Box of of 2,520 rounds weighs 36.5kg
34,200 / 2,250 = 14 boxes x 36.5 = 511kg

81mm mortar mod.35
Unfoc = 200 rounds
About 1/8 are "g.c." (grande capacità) shells, 7/8 are "g.a." (ghisa acciaiosa) shells
(precise figure was 10 vs. 64 ready boxes per company)
- g.c. shell:
Consumption = 24 x 200 x 1/8 = 600 rounds
Box of 3 rounds weighs 28kg
600 / 3 = 200 boxes x 28 = 5,600kg
- g.a. shell:
Consumption = 24 x 200 x 7/8 = 4,200 rounds
Box of 3 rounds weighs 13kg
4,200 / 3 = 1,400 boxes x 13 = 18,200kg
- Firing charge:
Consumption = 24 x 200 = 4,800 rounds
Box of 850 rounds weighs 37kg
4,800 / 850 = 5.65 rounded to 6 boxes x 37 = 222kg

Note: there was also the "additional firing charge" but I believe the picture is complicated enough already

20/65 mod.35
Unfoc = 1,000 rounds
Consumption = 8 x 1,000 = 8,000 rounds
Box of 48 rounds weighs 30.3kg
8,000 / 48 = 167 boxes x 30.3 = 5,060kg

47/32 mod.35
Unfoc = 250 rounds
2/3 are AT, 1/3 are HE (as per company ready rounds)
- AT shell:
Consumption = 24 x 250 x 2/3 = 4,000 rounds
Box of 4 rounds weighs 12,5kg
4,000 / 4 = 1,000 boxes x 12.5 = 12,500kg
- HE shell:
Consumption = 24 x 250 x 1/3 = 2,000 rounds
Box of 4 rounds weighs 16kg
2,000 / 4 = 500 boxes x 16 = 8,000kg

75/27 mod.11
Unfoc = 250 rounds
Consumption = 24 x 250 = 6,000 rounds
Each HE shell weighs 6.35kg
I assume a box housing a complete round (shell, firing charge, packing) weighs 1.6 times this value = 10kg
6,000 x 10 = 60,000kg

100/17 mod.14
Unfoc = 250 rounds
Consumption = 12 x 250 = 3,000 rounds
Each HE shell weighs 13.75kg
I assume a box housing a complete round (shell, firing charge, packing) weighs 1.6 times this value = 22kg
3,000 x 22 = 66,000kg

Recapitulation of a divisional unfoc
Pistol 200kg
Hand grenade 3,441kg
Rifle 20,384kg
LMG 12,948kg
HMG 4,932kg
45mm mortar 22,800 + 511 = 23,311kg
81mm mortar 5,600 + 18,200 + 222 = 24.022kg
20/65 5,060kg
47/32 12,500 + 8,000 = 20,500kg
75/27 60,000kg
100/17 66,000kg
Total 241.758kg

Average per man = 241.758 / 12.233 = 19.8kg

[Andreas]

I think that does look about right for a division in combat. Together with the other stuff (rations/POL/water/fodder/etc) you end up at the 350 to 400 tons then, which is what we got to earlier in the thread, IIRC.

Many thanks for this Davide!

All the best

Andreas

[JonS]

Going off on a wee tangent here for a moment, it occurs to me that part of the reason for the low German daily supply requirement was the order in ?1943? that units outside Germany were to obtain _all_ their subsistance locally (and at the expense of the local population). That eased the strain on food production back in Germany, but it would also have eased the strain of the log chain, and depressed the divisional daily tonnage requirements.

The Western Allies, OTOH, not only sourced the entirety of their own subsistence from their logistic base areas (ie, their home nations), but also provided very considerable additional amounts of subsistence for the civilian population of liberated areas.

OTOOH, food is a relatively modest contribution by weight to the daily supply tonnage compared to fuel and especially ammunition, so maybe it makes little difference?