Rudolf Höss' Grandson Rainer Höss
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Re: Rudolf Höss' Grandson Rainer Höss
Hi Max,
Peter Longerich is one of the Himmler Biographer. He gave the IFZ the Information, that it is Himmler in his youth time. I agree with you about USHMM and other Archives. maybe you had a chance with your contacts to get a information about that picture. I pay for a proffesional idendification if we need. When i compare the Pictures Duncan had posted, it could be. And believe me the left one is deffently my grandfather, that was confirmed by one of my aunts few hours ago. I ask them about the Picture. they also told me that Himmler was more than a Boss, he was a friend of the Family. I'm torn at the moment who may have it back and forth. Bormann, we definitely excluded. not fit in nothing, neither size nor stature.
Let me know what kind of options we have to find out...
Regards
Rainer
Peter Longerich is one of the Himmler Biographer. He gave the IFZ the Information, that it is Himmler in his youth time. I agree with you about USHMM and other Archives. maybe you had a chance with your contacts to get a information about that picture. I pay for a proffesional idendification if we need. When i compare the Pictures Duncan had posted, it could be. And believe me the left one is deffently my grandfather, that was confirmed by one of my aunts few hours ago. I ask them about the Picture. they also told me that Himmler was more than a Boss, he was a friend of the Family. I'm torn at the moment who may have it back and forth. Bormann, we definitely excluded. not fit in nothing, neither size nor stature.
Let me know what kind of options we have to find out...
Regards
Rainer
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Re: Rudolf Höss' Grandson Rainer Höss
i think there are no doubts between the Pictures. It looks like the same Person for me on booth Picture.I am sure it is Himmler...Did anyone had other aspects for that task?
- cheekbones
- head shape
- mouth shape
- hair cut
- mustache
- Height: 1,74 m
- cheekbones
- head shape
- mouth shape
- hair cut
- mustache
- Height: 1,74 m
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- Himmler very young 1928
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Last edited by Rainer Höß on 19 Sep 2013, 21:02, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Rudolf Höss' Grandson Rainer Höss
Rainer Höß wrote:i think there are no doubts between the Pictures. I looks like the same Person on my Picture.I am sure it is Himmler...Did anyone had other aspects for that task?
Re: Rudolf Höss' Grandson Rainer Höss
Sorry Rainer....I do not want to disappoint you, but I am almost sure that person on the right is not Himmler.
Michal
Michal
Re: Rudolf Höss' Grandson Rainer Höss
How tall was Himmler?
Re: Rudolf Höss' Grandson Rainer Höss
Interestin thread i've not seen this topic before. The most interesting are the pictures from Auschwitz. Thanks for sharing them Rainer. I liked your comparison shot from the garden with the pool and how it looked in 2010. The pool was not there anymore.
About the Himmler picture, i'm pretty sure its not himmler. if you look at the nose it's a diffent nose than himmlers nose and also the haircut doesn't resemble himmler.
About the Himmler picture, i'm pretty sure its not himmler. if you look at the nose it's a diffent nose than himmlers nose and also the haircut doesn't resemble himmler.
Re: Rudolf Höss' Grandson Rainer Höss
Did an internet search and found he was 1.74 m = 5' 7" tall.
Actually I thought he was shorter than that....this person in the photo looks taller than 1.74 m.
Everyone has had photos taken of themselves in unflattering way and that you may not even
look like yourself. Perhaps this is one of them?
Actually I thought he was shorter than that....this person in the photo looks taller than 1.74 m.
Everyone has had photos taken of themselves in unflattering way and that you may not even
look like yourself. Perhaps this is one of them?
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Re: Rudolf Höss' Grandson Rainer Höss
Peter Longerich's book contains a few mistakes and in some places is not very thorough.
I am satisfied that the man on the right is not Himmler....different features, different haircut, different build, etc. As for his height, we cannot use that as a comparison as the entire body length is not in the photo. For all we know, one of them might be standing in a trench! However, if you assume they are both on level ground, the man on the right is far taller than the man on the left. Although Himmler was taller than Höss, if the guy on the left is Höss as you say (I'm still not convinced) then the man on the right is far too tall for Himmler.
Unfortunately, there will be no resolution to this, but in my mind I am convinced he is not Himmler.
Regards,
Max.
I am satisfied that the man on the right is not Himmler....different features, different haircut, different build, etc. As for his height, we cannot use that as a comparison as the entire body length is not in the photo. For all we know, one of them might be standing in a trench! However, if you assume they are both on level ground, the man on the right is far taller than the man on the left. Although Himmler was taller than Höss, if the guy on the left is Höss as you say (I'm still not convinced) then the man on the right is far too tall for Himmler.
Unfortunately, there will be no resolution to this, but in my mind I am convinced he is not Himmler.
Regards,
Max.
Re: Rudolf Höss' Grandson Rainer Höss
Max,
Your most probably correct that there is no resolution to this question of the photo.
However it got me looking through my books of Himmler one particularly Himmler's
Secret War. I had forgotten all the intrigue in the beginning of the book.
No harm in searching though.
thanks
Your most probably correct that there is no resolution to this question of the photo.
However it got me looking through my books of Himmler one particularly Himmler's
Secret War. I had forgotten all the intrigue in the beginning of the book.
No harm in searching though.
thanks
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Re: Rudolf Höss' Grandson Rainer Höss
You are aware that questions have arisen over the validity of this book I hope? Some of the documents used as a basis for Allen's claims were allegedly planted in the National Archives at Kew and are alleged forgeries.Annelie wrote:Max,
Your most probably correct that there is no resolution to this question of the photo.
However it got me looking through my books of Himmler one particularly Himmler's
Secret War. I had forgotten all the intrigue in the beginning of the book.
No harm in searching though.
thanks
Max.
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Re: Rudolf Höss' Grandson Rainer Höss
Thanks Max for your open request. I/we (maybe) will find out. You woke up the research fighter in me. But if you had any ideas to come to a result, let me know. When i was at the area where the picture where taken arround the fountain, there was a small masonry with stones, handmade. I ask the historian there if it was later on build, but he told me only the house was new repaired and painted, at the ground it would be never worked on. His family buyed the Ground until 1947. I know my Grandfather was maximum 1,70 m. But i agree with you, without the whole lenghts of the Persons at the Photo we get no result. Lets work on it togehter, if anybody wants.Max Williams wrote:Peter Longerich's book contains a few mistakes and in some places is not very thorough.
I am satisfied that the man on the right is not Himmler....different features, different haircut, different build, etc. As for his height, we cannot use that as a comparison as the entire body length is not in the photo. For all we know, one of them might be standing in a trench! However, if you assume they are both on level ground, the man on the right is far taller than the man on the left. Although Himmler was taller than Höss, if the guy on the left is Höss as you say (I'm still not convinced) then the man on the right is far too tall for Himmler.
Unfortunately, there will be no resolution to this, but in my mind I am convinced he is not Himmler.
Regards,
Max.
Regards
Rainer
Re: Rudolf Höss' Grandson Rainer Höss
A person's relaxed posture is a good identifier. In photo below (with Mengele and Kramer from the Hoecker Album), Höss leans back slightly when "at ease". Man on left in Rainer's photo seems to have similar posture. I am convinced that man on left is Höss - similar head shape, brow line, and right ear. I think Rainer said the researchers used forensics to compare?
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Re: Rudolf Höss' Grandson Rainer Höss
Rainer - I'm confused about something in the previous posts - Theodor Gender was the Lord Mayor of which town? Muhle or Buberow? Where exactly was the photo (with Höss and the pseudo "Himmler") taken? What is the gabled building in the background? I am trying to find a contemporary photo of the place. Thanks.
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Re: Rudolf Höss' Grandson Rainer Höss
Hi Duncan,
Theodore Gender was the richest Man in that Town. He was the Land Lord and the mayor of Buberow. The gables you see at the Photo it is a part of his mansion, fontaine shows a part of the hugh Garden. The town is located near the border with Poland, and 31,5 km far away fromn Oranienburg / Sachsenhausen. By Car a 30 Minute ride. The Town called under Historians "Rundlingsdorf", why it was build like a circle. The population had not grown up in all the years, max population 147 People right now. In the time around 1938-1945 150-170 inhabitants. Theodore Gender committed suicide in 1945 by hanging, because of the lost war. Before that, he still burned the city archive in Buberow and the entire record of the Nazi regime.
"Mühle" it is not a town, means Mill. The Town called Buberow where Gender was Mayor, in German language called "Bürgermeister".
Information: Buberow Rundling is a village that is mentioned in documents for the first time 1325. The place name is derived from the old Slavic word "bobr" = beaver.
The location of the catfish trench lowlands is characteristic of both: for the former presence of beavers and the system logs, as these were often applied on spur-like projections on lowland terrain edges (Born 1977). Here, the inadequacy of Luchlandschaften served as protection from enemies. Furthermore originally existed as in other villages round only access to the open space of the place, which could be closed by a gate (Ruppin district calendar of 1928/29). This shows that the investment of round shapes and the thought of a better valor than for roads and villages Anger played a role.
Rainer
Theodore Gender was the richest Man in that Town. He was the Land Lord and the mayor of Buberow. The gables you see at the Photo it is a part of his mansion, fontaine shows a part of the hugh Garden. The town is located near the border with Poland, and 31,5 km far away fromn Oranienburg / Sachsenhausen. By Car a 30 Minute ride. The Town called under Historians "Rundlingsdorf", why it was build like a circle. The population had not grown up in all the years, max population 147 People right now. In the time around 1938-1945 150-170 inhabitants. Theodore Gender committed suicide in 1945 by hanging, because of the lost war. Before that, he still burned the city archive in Buberow and the entire record of the Nazi regime.
"Mühle" it is not a town, means Mill. The Town called Buberow where Gender was Mayor, in German language called "Bürgermeister".
Information: Buberow Rundling is a village that is mentioned in documents for the first time 1325. The place name is derived from the old Slavic word "bobr" = beaver.
The location of the catfish trench lowlands is characteristic of both: for the former presence of beavers and the system logs, as these were often applied on spur-like projections on lowland terrain edges (Born 1977). Here, the inadequacy of Luchlandschaften served as protection from enemies. Furthermore originally existed as in other villages round only access to the open space of the place, which could be closed by a gate (Ruppin district calendar of 1928/29). This shows that the investment of round shapes and the thought of a better valor than for roads and villages Anger played a role.
Rainer
Re: Rudolf Höss' Grandson Rainer Höss
Thanks Rainer for clearing that up for me. Alas, I could not find a contemporary photo of the place in question, although I see what you mean by certain elements acting like they are still practicing "Artamanish" ways in the area...campers and "hippie" types of all stripes..I saw photos of people dressed in medievalist clothes as well....in America we call them "renaissance festivals". I guess it's fun for people to play and dress up, and many probably do not know the philosophy or ideology of the Artaman groups or the history of the area.
Artaman was a proto-Nazi farming association of "frontiersmen" who fight for farmer's rights against city Jews and Poles on the borderlands. Many who were soldiers and wandervögel were attracted to it....a lot of Aryan race and eugenical indoctrination. I think Wilibald Henschel, a devotee of Ernst Haeckel, inspired the movement. Artaman was influential to Walther Darre's "Blood and Soil" philosophy and in turn Himmler / Höss. These were "quiet' years for the young Höss as not much is known about his life during this period, but not so quiet when you discovered that he was still engaged in radical political activity. Himmler and Bormann kept an eye out for him. The late 1920's were lean years for the NSDAP, and Höss probably had to stay out of the limelight as part of his amnesty release from prison. This was a time of marriage, family, and personal issues but nevertheless a key point in his development.
Artaman was a proto-Nazi farming association of "frontiersmen" who fight for farmer's rights against city Jews and Poles on the borderlands. Many who were soldiers and wandervögel were attracted to it....a lot of Aryan race and eugenical indoctrination. I think Wilibald Henschel, a devotee of Ernst Haeckel, inspired the movement. Artaman was influential to Walther Darre's "Blood and Soil" philosophy and in turn Himmler / Höss. These were "quiet' years for the young Höss as not much is known about his life during this period, but not so quiet when you discovered that he was still engaged in radical political activity. Himmler and Bormann kept an eye out for him. The late 1920's were lean years for the NSDAP, and Höss probably had to stay out of the limelight as part of his amnesty release from prison. This was a time of marriage, family, and personal issues but nevertheless a key point in his development.