Himmler murdered [?]

[Dan]

Are any of the rest of you following this story? I've only seen in on Irving's site, which we are asked not to link to here. It seems very credible at this point that the British ordered his murder to keep him from talking to the Americans, but I haven't seen anything in the main stream press yet.

[Just tacked a question mark to the subject, as the issue is still somewhat in doubt / Mike Miller, Moderator]

[Legionnaire]

Yes there was somthing in either the Daily Mail or Express on a saturday a couple of weeks ago in the UK possibly on May the 28th.
Apparently a memo has been uncovered stating that somone presumably a SOE/MI5 agent only known as "Mr. Thomas/Thompson"( ive forgotton exactly) apparently 'solved the Himmler problem once and for all' , he allegedly visted himmler while he was in captivity, presumably forcing him to take the cyanide pill.
The reason for this was throughout the later years of the war, Himmler was trying to negotiate a seperate peace with the allies(who then united could turn on the soviets), using jews as bargining chips etc. The offer was refused but if the british public found out they may have raised questions to why the war could not have ended sooner etc, causing less deaths.
I know this recollection is rather vague and garbled but I threw the newspaper out
Still at least you have the bare bones of the story.

[Max Williams]

You should obtain the book "Himmler's Secret War" by Martin Allen. Published 2005 by Robson Books London, ISBN 1 86105 889 6. Allen argues that Himmler was murdered to prevent him being interrogated by the Americans and revealing that Britain had been secretly negotiating with him since 1943.
Max.

[Achtung Panzer!]

apparently himmler had a series of incriminating letters from Churchill concerning the seperate peace stated. Himmler was later supposedly murdered to keep him from revealing the letters. If Churchill did indeed had made contact with Himmler, it would have been in direct contravention of the Allied policies.Morevoer, it is a well documented fact that Himmler did indeed had made peace oveture through Count Bernadotte during the later part of the war and had some successes in using concentration camps hostages as bargaining chips. The implication of it would mean that the fragile peace between the Western Allies and the Soviets would have been compromised, thus, the importance of Himmler's removal from post war Europe.
However, it would also be hard to forsee how Churchill could have want to make contact with a man who sent in a resume to Eisenhower for the post of Head of Police in post war Germany.

[Sam H.]

Of course the deniers are saying that Himmler was killed to silence the holocaust story the allies were inventing - which is complete bs.

[Sam H.]

another image

[WalterS]

This topic is totally silly. The Brits and Americans would have loved to have had Himmler on trial. There is no evidence that he died at anyone's hand but his own.

[Max Williams]

This topic is totally silly. The Brits and Americans would have loved to have had Himmler on trial. There is no evidence that he died at anyone's hand but his own.

You couldn't be more wrong. It is a well recorded fact that the British (Churchill) wanted the top Nazis executed without trial as soon as they fell into Allied hands. Numerous memos from Churchill are to be found in the British NA to confirm this fact. I would also pose the question "Why is the Himmler 'capture and suicide' file closed to public scrutiny"?
Max.

[Dan]

Walter, whatever you think about Irving, even his enemies admit that when it comes to things like spotting forged letters, etc.. he's about the best there is. If he says the documents are real, this could be very interesting, and bring up question about other leaders like Darlan who died suspiciously.

[Beppo Schmidt]

Does any historian support Irving's claim?

[Dan]

Irving has hinted and even suggested it for years. There seems to be a huge silence about this, and if Irving's right, it will mean brownie points, big time. If he's wrong, it could very well be the proverbial last nail in the coffin, as he's staked his (whatever's left of) his reputation on the authenticity of the documents.

Interesting times!

[Panzermahn]

This topic is totally silly. The Brits and Americans would have loved to have had Himmler on trial. There is no evidence that he died at anyone's hand but his own.

You couldn't be more wrong. It is a well recorded fact that the British (Churchill) wanted the top Nazis executed without trial as soon as they fell into Allied hands. Numerous memos from Churchill are to be found in the British NA to confirm this fact. I would also pose the question "Why is the Himmler 'capture and suicide' file closed to public scrutiny"?
Max.

I had to agree with Max. Which is why Otto Skorzeny was never brought to trial (he was held by the Americans and not by the British) because he was in posession of several letters and documents on Churchill-Mussolini correspondence.

It is also know that the British files on the correspondence between Churchill-Petain and British-Vichy remain closed until today

[Panzermahn]

Also, you should get the book My Father's Keeper: Children of Nazi Leaders by Stephan Lebart.

In the story about Gudrun Himmler, she alleged that her father was murdered by the British and was planning to write a book about her father but nothing comes out until today. She wanted to let the whole world know about what her father did and did not do and also the alleged murder of her father by the Brits.

[Achtung Panzer!]

I cannot help by feel that theory behind Himmler's supposed murder seemed to be similar to that of a US Army general.

The topic in this post seemed to stem from the circumstances of Patton's untimely death in 1945. Again, the supposed motive of the murder was to prevent Patton participation in post war politics. As a staunch anti-communist and his influence in the US Army, Patton would no doubt rackle the top men in the White House, hence the convenient excuse of using the car accident as a cover up. Patton was also known as the first cold war warrior. He actually did send a letter to his wife telling his her not to worry about their son's absence in World War 2, as he will be participating in another war against the Soviet soon. There was no doubt that Patton would have been mentioned in the same breathe as Curtis Le May and MacArthur as hardliners in post war politics if he had survived beyong 1945. The motive was clear, get rid of Patton to prevent an escalation of tension between the US and the Soviets.

Cheers
CW

[Marcus]

Several posts were split off into a new thread entitled "Who the bad guys really were...".

/Marcus