Propaganda about Slavs

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sarahgoodson
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Propaganda about Slavs

#1

Post by sarahgoodson » 19 Mar 2016, 15:32

Did the Nazis publish any anti-Slavic propaganda with posters, books or speeches?

I remember reading in Evans trilogy of the Third Reich that the Nazis used extensive propaganda describing the Slavs as inferior sub-humans, racially inferior, etc, yet I've researched this and can't find any such thing. I've found such things like describing the war with the Soviet Union as the old battle against the Germanic people and Slavic people and in Mein Kampf Hitler describing Russia existing only because of the German element there and not of the Slavs as they are an inferior race.

During the 1920s and 1930s before the war, did the Nazis publish any anti-Slavic material?

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Re: Propaganda about Slavs

#2

Post by wm » 14 Apr 2016, 00:18

I don't think so. It would hurt them politically - in a big way.
It seems Hitler got mad at Poland in 1939 and then it started. But still it was quite selective propaganda because some Slavic countries were his allies (like for example Slovakia, Bulgaria).


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Re: Propaganda about Slavs

#3

Post by sarahgoodson » 15 Apr 2016, 17:13

wm wrote:I don't think so. It would hurt them politically - in a big way.
It seems Hitler got mad at Poland in 1939 and then it started. But still it was quite selective propaganda because some Slavic countries were his allies (like for example Slovakia, Bulgaria).
Here is a piece of Nazi propaganda from the 1930s warning about the growth of the Slavs.

viewtopic.php?f=44&t=221535#p2009255

The Nazi Primer, a Hitler Youth book also published anti-Slavism.

Hitler's anti-Slavism can be traced back to his days in Vienna.

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Re: Propaganda about Slavs

#4

Post by wm » 17 Apr 2016, 00:38

Although the claim that the Slavs were better at making children wasn't really propaganda. It may have been true or false, and the resulting danger may have been real or not. The question is what they proposed as the solution of this problem in that book.

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Re: Propaganda about Slavs

#5

Post by sarahgoodson » 24 Apr 2016, 16:16

wm wrote:Although the claim that the Slavs were better at making children wasn't really propaganda. It may have been true or false, and the resulting danger may have been real or not. The question is what they proposed as the solution of this problem in that book.
This was used in various Nazi propaganda pamphlets, the illustration is quite clear in what it means, the Nazis were against the fertility of the Slavs, hence the title being "growth of the Slavs".

Not to mention Mein Kampf which was easily available and openly anti-Slavic and was the 'bible' of Nazi Germany.

During the 1930s the Nazis also published a lot of literature about the Nordic race. One in particular was "The struggle of the Nordic race soul against South and East" (Der Kampf der nordischen Rassenseele gegen Süden und Osten) by Bernhard Kummer.

The Nazis believed that Slavs were originally Nordic but had lost their Nordic blood by mixing with non-Nordics, only some Slavs were considered to be of racial value.

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Re: Propaganda about Slavs

#6

Post by michael mills » 07 May 2016, 00:54

Hitler's anti-Slavism can be traced back to his days in Vienna.
It would be more correct to say that his hostility toward Czechs can be traced back to his days in Vienna, when there was an intense ethnic conflict between Germans and Czechs raging. There was even a fear on the part of Austro-Germans that the Czechs would eventually take over Vienna, such was the magnitude of the Czech migration to that city.

By contrast, there was no ethnic conflict between Germans and Poles in the Habsburg Empire, the Poles having de-facto autonomy in the province of Galicia, and that is probably the reason why Hitler was initially not hostile toward Poles and the Polish State.

Hitler was also hostile toward Serbs, due to the role of Serbia in the First World War, but not violently so, since there had been no ethnic conflict between Germans and Serbs in the Habsburg Empire, only a political one.

Hitler was not hostile toward certain Slavic peoples, eg the Slovaks, Bulgarians, Croats.

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Re: Propaganda about Slavs

#7

Post by sarahgoodson » 09 May 2016, 17:53

Hi Michael,

Here are a couple of excepts from Mein Kampf:
I was repelled by the conglomeration of races which the capital showed me, repelled by this whole mixture of Czechs, Poles, Hungarians, Ruthenians, Serbs, and Croats, and everywhere, the eternal mushroom of humanity - Jews and more Jews.
ot only in Austria, but in Germany as well, so-called national circles were moved by similar false ideas. The Polish policy, demanded by so many, involving a Germanization of the East, was unfortunately based on the same false inference. Here again it was thought that a Germanization of the Polish element could be brought about by a purely linguistic integration with the German element. Here again the result would have been catastrophic; a people of alien race expressing its alien ideas in the German language, compromising the lofty dignity of our own nationality by their own inferiority.
As clearly shown, Hitler detested the idea of any Slavs and non-Germans in general living in a German state.

The Nazis made some exceptiobs who were considered to be more Germanic than Slavic, etc, e.g Croats.

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Re: Propaganda about Slavs

#8

Post by WW2Researcher » 03 Jun 2016, 06:52

The German propaganda about the "Aryan race" was constantly being changed by the Ministry of Propaganda, depending on the nation's foreign policy and alliances.

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Re: Propaganda about Slavs

#9

Post by sarahgoodson » 03 Jun 2016, 21:55

WW2Researcher wrote:The German propaganda about the "Aryan race" was constantly being changed by the Ministry of Propaganda, depending on the nation's foreign policy and alliances.
Even though the Slavs were considered to be racially inferior, they were still considered to be part of the Aryan race.

John Connelly's Nazis and Slavs: From Racial Theory to Racist Practice is a good insight into the complications and contradictions the Nazis had on the Slavs.

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Re: Propaganda about Slavs

#10

Post by Piotr Kapuscinski » 06 Jun 2016, 21:33

sarahgoodson wrote:The Nazis made some exceptiobs who were considered to be more Germanic than Slavic, etc, e.g Croats.
Funnily enough the Nazis were wrong as always, since Croats are closely related to Poles, and have not much to do with populations such as modern Germans. This is shown by both craniological (skull shape) and genetic similarities between Croats and Poles:
Our results showed marked craniometrical similarities between early medieval Croat and medieval Polish series. Among all of the 39 analyzed European sites, the two exhibiting the greatest similarities were Nin, a site representing the nucleus of the early medieval Croat state (72), and Cedynia, a Polish site located approximately 75 km south of the Baltic Sea. Conversely, the 5 analyzed Iranian sites exhibited no similarity with the early medieval Croat sites and were all located in the diametrically opposite part of the scatter plot. These results suggest that early medieval Croats were of Slavic ancestry, and that early medieval Croats and Poles at one time shared a common homeland. Recent genetic analyses of the nonrecombining Y chromosome from 25 extant European and Middle Eastern populations support the Slavic affiliation of the Croats, and also indicate significant genetic similarities between modern Croats and Poles (1).
Source: "Origin of Medieval Croats. Craniometric Relationships among Medieval Central European Populations: Implications for Croat Migration and Expansion", Croatian Medical Journal, 2004 (link): https://ariets.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/15311416.pdf

This seems to confirm the idea that White Croatia indeed existed, and that it was located in Southern Poland.

The story says that White Croatia was the original homeland of Croats, from which they came to the Balkans.

====================

Nin was the first capital city of Medieval Croatia, and Cedynia was a Polish Piast dynasty border stronghold:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Cedynia
There are words which carry the presage of defeat. Defence is such a word. What is the result of an even victorious defence? The next attempt of imposing it to that weaker, defender. The attacker, despite temporary setback, feels the master of situation.

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Re: Propaganda about Slavs

#11

Post by michael mills » 07 Jun 2016, 03:29

Political ideology rarely has any relationship to objective reality.

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Re: Propaganda about Slavs

#12

Post by michael mills » 07 Jun 2016, 04:27

The story says that White Croatia was the original homeland of Croats, from which they came to the Balkans.
Greek-language inscriptions found on the Black Sea coastal area mention a people called the Khoroates who lived in the Pontic Steppes to the north of the Greek coastal settlements. It is generally thought that the Khoroates were a nomadic people of Iranian stock, related to the Sarmatians.

The name "Khoroates" is most probably the origin of the word "Hrvat", the Croat ethnonym. One theory is that the Iranian Khoroates migrated from the Pontic Steppes to the area just north of the Carpathain Mountains, where they established their rule over the local Slavic peoples, and gave their name to them and to the area, in much the same way as the Bulgars gave their name to the Slavic peoples they ruled over.

The Croats who migrated from White Croatia to the eastern shore of the Adriatic Sea would therefore have been a mixed group, consisting of descendants of the Khoroates and local Slavic peoples, with the Slavic element dominating genetically.

It is apparent that the article quoted has the ideological aim of refuting the claim of an Iranian origin of the people who first bore the ethnonym "Croat".

It needs to be borne in mind that the Croats were not the first Slavic people to settle in the region that is now Croatia. According to Byzantine sources, the whole of the Roman province of Illyricum was overrun by Slavic peoples who lived in a state of anarchy, and the Croats were brought in as allies of the Byzantine emperors for the purpose of establishing control over the area. The inhabitants of the Early Medieval Croatian state would therefore have been an amalgam of the first Slavic settlers with the Croats who arrived later; that could account for the genetic resemblance between modern Croats and Poles.

Of course, the modern Poles themselves may well have some genetic inheritance from Iranian peoples. The medieval Polish nobility always claimed to be descended from the Ancient Sarmatians, an Iranian people.

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Re: Propaganda about Slavs

#13

Post by Piotr Kapuscinski » 07 Jun 2016, 10:15

Michael Mills,

Recent genetic research shows that Proto-Indo-Iranians were an offshoot of the Eastern European Corded Ware culture (most likely from the Fatyanovo-Balanovo -> Abashevo branch of CWC) who migrated east into Central Asia, and later conquered the Middle East and India.

Here is an excerpt from a 2015 study by Allentoft et al., titled "Population genomics of Bronze Age Eurasia":

"(...) The close affinity we observe between peoples of Corded Ware and Sintashta cultures [...] suggests similar genetic sources of the two, which contrasts with previous hypotheses placing the origin of Sintashta in Asia or the Middle East. Although we cannot formally test whether the Sintashta derives directly from an eastward migration of Corded Ware peoples or if they share common ancestry with an earlier steppe population, the presence of European Neolithic farmer ancestry in both the Corded Ware and the Sintashta, combined with the absence of Neolithic farmer ancestry in the earlier Yamnaya, would suggest the former being more probable. (...)"

It can be noted that Slavs and Balts are also descended from Corded Ware people, but from those of them who stayed in Eastern Europe. Whereas Proto-Indo-Iranians originated from that part of the Corded Ware population, who emigrated out of Europe.

So Balto-Slavs and Indo-Iranians (also known as Aryans) share recent common ancestry (recent, since dating back to the Bronze Age).

We also have ancient DNA from Iron Age Scythians - an Iranic-speaking group living in the Eurasian Steppe - and those people most closely resembled modern Pamiri Tajiks (inhabitants of a mountainous Pamir region in Tajikistan), as well as modern ethnic Slavic Russians. Whereas Bronze Age Proto-Indo-Iranian populations also resembled modern Lithuanians and other North-East Europeans very much.

Modern Persians or Kurds, are mostly descended from Pre-Indo-European populations of the Middle East (such as the Elamites). They do have large amounts of Proto-Indo-Iranian ancestry as well, but the majority of their ancestry is from conquered populations.

It can be also noted that - both racially and genetically and in terms of pigmentation (light hair, light eyes, light skin) - modern Slavs and Balts resemble Proto-Indo-Iranians far more than any of modern Iranic-speaking populations, with the exception of Pamiri Tajiks.

So racially Slavs and Balts are the "most Aryan" of all peoples, together with Pamiri Tajiks and Indo-Aryan Brahmin castes.

I suppose that Hitler also realized that, when he shot himself in the head, having lost against the true Aryan race.
Last edited by Piotr Kapuscinski on 07 Jun 2016, 10:44, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Propaganda about Slavs

#14

Post by Piotr Kapuscinski » 07 Jun 2016, 10:29

The name "Khoroates" is most probably the origin of the word "Hrvat"
Considering that Slavs and Iranics share common ancestors from the Bronze Age, we should expect a lot of cognates (words of common origin) in both Slavic and Iranic languages. So deriving Slavic "Hrvats" from Iranic "Khoroates" is likely wrong - it is probable that both of these words originate from a common Balto-Slavo-Indo-Iranic root, that was common to ancestors of all of these groups during the Bronze Age.

And considering that - practically speaking - Indo-Iranians are descended from Slavs (since they originated from Eastern Europe), maybe it was even the other way around - and the Iranian ethnonym "Khoroates" is of Slavic. We don't know what were Slavs doing in 500 BC.

Who knows maybe in 500 BC some Slavic group was busy living as a ruling class of some Iranic-speaking group.

============================

As for Indo-Aryan Brahmins, they are closer related to North-Eastern Europeans (Balto-Slavs) than other caste groups:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC311057/

The highest castes of India (such as Brahmins and Kshatriya) genetically closely resemble Northern Slavic populations.

That's why Brahmins, Pamiri Tajiks, etc. often have phenotypes that can't be distinguished from Eastern European ones.

In terms of intelligence quotient (IQ) Brahmins also more closely resemble the Slavic mean of ~99 than the Dravidian of ~85.
There are words which carry the presage of defeat. Defence is such a word. What is the result of an even victorious defence? The next attempt of imposing it to that weaker, defender. The attacker, despite temporary setback, feels the master of situation.

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Re: Propaganda about Slavs

#15

Post by Piotr Kapuscinski » 07 Jun 2016, 11:09

Claudius Ptolemy in his "Geography" divided Northern Europe into several regions. From the Atlantic coast to the Rhine he had Gallia. East of the Rhine he had Germania. East of Germania - Sarmatia (sub-divided into two parts, western and eastern). East of Sarmatia - Scythia.

Polish nobility called themselves Sarmatians because they read Ptolemy's works, and noticed that ancient western Sarmatia was located in exactly the same part of Europe as the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth in their own times. I don't think that it was related to any ethnic issues, rather only to geographical ones.
There are words which carry the presage of defeat. Defence is such a word. What is the result of an even victorious defence? The next attempt of imposing it to that weaker, defender. The attacker, despite temporary setback, feels the master of situation.

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