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Hitler and Sex

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Postby 1812 on 10 Jan 2004 07:19

I remember reading a biography about Hitler. When asked why he did not have children of his own he said that he did not want any and that they would be held to the same expectations as their 'genious' father.

I think that some suspected that Hitler had syphillis (sp?) a sexually transmitted disease. So I would be willing to bet that Hitler did not die a virgin.
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Re: This should settle it.

Postby 1812 on 10 Jan 2004 07:22

R.M. Schultz wrote:Last year I was paid to research and review “The Hidden Hitler” by Lothar Machtan for a public forum sponsored by the Chicago Public Library. My findings were largely as follows:

1] Machtan’s thesis was that Hitler was gay and that explains a lot. This is just a lot of nonsense cooked up to sell some books.

2] Hitler only had one ball.

• Hitler’s army record, now lost, says that during venereal inspections it was discovered that he only had one testicle.

• Henrietta von Schirach says that Professor Kielleuthner, a Münich urologist, had told her that Hitler had come to him for treatment of monochism (having only one testicle) but that it was too late to help him.

• Soviet autopsy confirms that Hitler’s left testicle was missing.

• Hanfstaengle claims that Army comrades, who had seen him in the wash house, had commented to him about how Hitler’s genitals were “freakishly underdeveloped.”

3] Was Hitler a “normal” Heterosexual? Hard to say …

• Mein Kampf is loaded with sexual imagery, virtually all of it negative, dwelling at length upon syphilis, rape, prostitution, and “the most disgusting” sexual practices.

• Hitler loved pornography, read Der Stürmer with great interest, had a collection of blue movies.

• Hanfstaengle, Otto Strasser, and Hermann Rauschning claim that he fairly groveled before women he found attractive, “in a most disgusting manner.”

• In front of many witnesses, at a social gathering, the tactless and out-spoken Ernst Röhm blurted out: “He is thinking about the peasant girls. When they stand in the fields and bend down at their work so that you can see their behinds, that’s what he likes, especially when they’ve got big round ones. That’s Hitler’s sex life. What a man.” Hitler, who was present did not stir a muscle, but only stared at Röhm with compressed lips.

4] Hitler apparently did have a perfectly normal sexual relationship with Mimi Reiter in 1927/8. When she and Hitler broke up in 1928 she tried to kill herself. After recovering, she married a hotel-keeper in Seefeld. In 1931 or 32, Hess was sent to fetch the girl. She spent the night at Hitler’s flat, commenting later: “Ich liess alles mit mir geschehen.” (“I let him do whatever he wanted with me.”) He wanted her to be his mistress, but she held out for matrimony. On her own initiative, she visited him again in 1934. Again she spent the night with him, this time in the Chancery, and again he refused to marry her. They never saw each other after that, but Hitler did send her 100 red roses when her second husband, an SS officer, was killed in 1940.

5] Poor Henny Hoffman seems to have been shell-shocked by her affair with Hitler. Otto Strasser claims that Hitler’s first real affair was with Henrietta Hoffman, the daughter of the photographer. Henny was an indiscreet adolescent who “chattered freely” about what she had Hitler did together, so that her father came to Hitler demanding an explanation. The girl had been “ruined” for normal love and so a settlement was in order. A deal was struck, Hoffman was to have exclusive rights to photograph Hitler, a boon that was to make him a wealthy man, and Henny was to be married off to Baldur von Schirach, the paedophile who was to become Reich Youth Leader.

6] Hitler’s affair with Geli Raubal seems to have been pretty twisted.

• In 1929 Hitler wrote a letter to Geli about masochistic and coprophiliac fantasies he had been having about her. This letter fell into the hands of his landlady’s son, Dr. Rudolph. Party treasurer, Francis Xavier Schwarz, engaged Fr. Bernhard Stempfle to get it back.

• Hanfstaengle claims that he saw pornographic drawings of Geli’s genitals that “only a perverted voyeur could have committed to paper.” Drawings like these were also involved in another blackmail incident. After they were bought back by Schwarz, they were not destroyed, but kept in a safe at the Brown House.

• sa Officer Wilhelm Stocker, a frequent guard at Hitler’s flat, claims to have enjoyed Geli’s favors. “She admitted to me that at times Hitler made her do things in the privacy of her room that sickened her but when I asked her why she didn’t refuse to do them she just shrugged and said that she didn’t want to lose him to some woman that would do what he wanted …”

• Henny Hoffman wrote that Geli said she could not bring herself to do “what he wants me to”

• Otto Strasser went with Geli to 1931 carnival. Geli told him: “[Hitler] demanded things from her that were simply disgusting. She had never dreamed that such things could happen. When I asked her to tell me, she described things I had previously encountered in my reading of Krafft-Ebbing’s Psychopathia Sexualis when I was a student.” In a May 1943 interview with OSS agent Dr. Walter Langer in Ottawa Canada, he went into detail: “Hitler made her undress … He would lie on the floor. Then she would have to squat over his face, where he could examine her at close range and this made him very excited. When the excitement reached its peak, he demanded that she urinate on him and this gave him sexual pleasure. Geli said the whole performance was extremely disgusting to her and … it gave her no gratification.” (Same story as Henny Hoffman.)

• Kurt Lüdecke claimed that Geli’s autopsy showed that she was a virgin.

7] In 1943, the OSS interviewed exiled German film director Adolf Zeissler. He said that, while in London in 1936, the film actress Renaté Müller and told him of her affair with Hitler.

• She met Hitler in the autumn of 1932 (this would be about a year after Geli’s death) while she was filming a movie on Kiel Bay. He seemed fascinated with her. She was later invited a party in the Chancery and, after that, to frequent dinners there. One night, after a dinner in his quarters at the Chancery, they had both taken off their clothes and Müller thought they were going to have sex, but Hitler fell to the floor and begged her to hit and kick him. She refused, but he went on heaping abuse and accusations upon himself, insisting that he was unworthy to be in the same room with her, that he was her slave, and so on. At length, she gave in, kicking him, abusing him with foul language, striking him with his whip. He became excited and masturbated to a climax. After this they dressed, had a nightcap, Hitler thanked her for a pleasant evening, and a servant saw her out.

• Sometime after this, in 1936, she took a vacation to London where she was kept under Gestapo surveillance. In London she saw both Zeissler, whom she told her story to, and her ex-lover Frank Deutsch whom she briefly resumed her intimacy with.

• Returning to Germany, she found herself blacklisted and it was rumored that she was to be put on trial for “race defamation,” as her lover Deutsch was Jewish. Under this pressure she became addicted to morphine. To cure this, she entered a sanitarium. After being discharged, she tried to see Hitler, who refused to see her. Back in the sanitarium, she was looking out the window one day in 1937, when she saw a car full of SS officers pull up. Believing that her arrest was immanent, she killed herself by jumping out the window.

8] Contradictory evidence exists about the affair with Eva Braun:

• Eva told her sisters that her sex relations with Hitler were “completely normal.” But she also confided to a schoolgirl friend (the future Fräu Esser): “Als Mann habe ich von ihm überhaupt nichts.” (roughly “As a man, from him I get nothing.”)

• Herbert Döring, chief at Obersaltzberg said: “Their relation ship never went that far (sex), Never! Never!” and “ Let me be completely honest with you. We did some spy work back then — no one knew about that — to see if we could find anything in the beds. And all those years, that never happened. I am sure of that. But that’s all I want to say about this private matter.”

• Albert Speer claims that Eva Braun told him, in the middle of 1943, that “Hitler had told her that he was too busy, too immersed, too tired — he could no longer satisfy her as a man.”

9] Eight women that are thought, possibly, to have been intimate with Hitler, attempted suicide: Mimi Reiter tried to hang herself 1928, Geli Raubal died of a gun-shot 1931, Eva Braun tried suicide in 1932 and 1935 before succeeding in 1945, Frau Inge Ley, Renaté Müller, and Suzi Liptauer were all successful suicides, and Unity Mitford attempted suicide in 1939.

10] “Carpet Chewing” referred not to any sexual practice, but rather to the way Hitler was alleged to throw himself on the ground during his fits of rage and literally chew the carpet with rabid hatred. Propaganda and nothing more.

11] Otto Strasser wrote a book about sexual deviation among Nazi’s, “The Gangsters Around Hitler,” Allen, London, 1942. In it he accused Helmuth Brückner, Otto Dietrich, Hans Frank, Dietrich von Jagow, Hans Frank, Wilhelm Brückner, and Karl Kaufman of being homosexuals.

12] My tally of sexual deviation in the nsdap is as follows:

Rudolf Hess: Transvestite, possibly bisexual or even primarily homosexual.

Ernst Röhm: Dominant homosexual.

Ritter von Epp: A perennial bachelor, alleged by Machtan to be a homosexual, though there is no evidence for this.

Edmund Heines: Homosexual and sadist. Procurer for Röhm.

Gerhard Roßbach: Bisexual, initiated Röhm into homoeroticism.

Ernst Hanfstaengel: Bisexual inclinations.

Walter Funk: Alleged by Hjalmar Schacht to be a “harmless homosexual and alcoholic.”

Baldur von Schirach: Bisexual and probably a pederast.

Julius Streicher: Sadist and pornographer. Accused of pederasty.

Albert Forester: Homosexual.

Reinhard Heydrich: Rapist, sadist, and alleged homosexual.

Kurt Lüdecke: Homosexual (possibly bisexual) blackmailer.

Graf von Helldorf: Notorious homosexual.

13] A short bibliography of reliable books on the subject would include:
• Walter C. Langer, “The Mind of Adolf Hitler: the Secret Wartime Report,” Basic Books, N.Y.C. & London, 1972. Not only a valuable book itself, but the only readily available source for the OSS interviews of Otto Strasser and Hermann Rauschning.

• Otto Strasser, “Hitler and I,” translated from the French by Gwenda David and Erich Mosbacher, Johnathan Cape, London, 1940. A vivid and accessible portrait by an important political rival of Hitter.

• Ronald Hayman, “Hitler & Geli,” Bloomsbury, N.Y.C., 1998. A generally reliable popular history on a fascinating mystery.

• Glenn B. Infield, “Eva and Adolf,” Grosset & Dunlap, N.Y.C., 1974. A popular work sometimes citing dubious sources. Eva proves less interesting, however, than Geli.

• Robert G.L.Waite, “The Psychopathic God Adolf Hitler,” Basic Books, N.Y.C., 1977. Probably the best book on Hitler as a person.

• Hans Peter Bleuel, “Sex and Society in Nazi Germany,” translated by J. Maxwell Brownjohn, J.P. Lipincott Company, Philadelphia and N.Y.C., 1973. A first-rate overview of Nazi family and social policy as well as current sexual mores.[/b]


You seem to know a lot about Hitlers genitals :lol:

If he did only have one testicle as long as it was working I think that he could have reproduced.
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Postby R.M. Schultz on 10 Jan 2004 07:38

1812 wrote:I think that some suspected that Hitler had syphillis (sp?) a sexually transmitted disease. So I would be willing to bet that Hitler did not die a virgin.


The accusation that Hitler had syphilis comes from a rather notorious book: I Was Hitler's Doctor, by Kurt Krueger (Biltmore publishing co. inc. , New York, 1943). Krueger was in fact not Hitler's doctor, as is rather conclusively proven by Robert G.L. Waite in an appendix on sources in his The Psychopathic God Adolf Hitler, (Basic Books, N.Y.C., 1977), and so these accusations can safely be dismissed.

As for Hitler having monorchism, no this would pose no physical barrier to procreation, however it would be a sever psychological impediment. I for one, actually believe Hitler's claim that he remained childless because so few great men had even adequate children. Hitler saw himself as unique in all of history and probably thought a son of abilities inferior to his own would only have detracted from his "greatness."
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Postby 1812 on 10 Jan 2004 08:26

R.M. Schultz wrote:
1812 wrote:I think that some suspected that Hitler had syphillis (sp?) a sexually transmitted disease. So I would be willing to bet that Hitler did not die a virgin.


The accusation that Hitler had syphilis comes from a rather notorious book: I Was Hitler's Doctor, by Kurt Krueger (Biltmore publishing co. inc. , New York, 1943). Krueger was in fact not Hitler's doctor, as is rather conclusively proven by Robert G.L. Waite in an appendix on sources in his The Psychopathic God Adolf Hitler, (Basic Books, N.Y.C., 1977), and so these accusations can safely be dismissed.

As for Hitler having monorchism, no this would pose no physical barrier to procreation, however it would be a sever psychological impediment. I for one, actually believe Hitler's claim that he remained childless because so few great men had even adequate children. Hitler saw himself as unique in all of history and probably thought a son of abilities inferior to his own would only have detracted from his "greatness."


Perhaps this monorchism could explain his temper tantrum's. I would be upset too if I only had one.
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Re: This should settle it.

Postby Nagelfar on 10 Jan 2004 10:49

R.M. Schultz wrote:10] “Carpet Chewing” referred not to any sexual practice, but rather to the way Hitler was alleged to throw himself on the ground during his fits of rage and literally chew the carpet with rabid hatred. Propaganda and nothing more.


I believe I've read that this was misunderstood German euphemism for pacing back & forth, as while in thought, or when agitated.
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Postby John W on 10 Jan 2004 20:28

R.M. Schultz wrote:As for Hitler having monorchism, no this would pose no physical barrier to procreation, however it would be a sever psychological impediment.
Hi R M, a Few questions:

a) How so? I mean, with one testicle, wouldn't his resultant sperm production be lower and thus lower his chances for sucessfully impregnating someone?

b) And won't it also be a phisiological impediment, being that the testicles also produce a decent quantity of androgens and other hormones?

R.M. Schultz wrote:I for one, actually believe Hitler's claim that he remained childless because so few great men had even adequate children. Hitler saw himself as unique in all of history and probably thought a son of abilities inferior to his own would only have detracted from his "greatness."
Interesting view. But I believe that he was so "into" this whole concept of his "self greatness" that he wanted to rigidly follow the path of most "great men" before him and thus had no child.

However, I do wish to ask, why would he think that his progeny would be in anyway inferior to him? Was he afraid that he could in some manner produce a handicapped or perhaps retarded child?
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Postby 1812 on 11 Jan 2004 01:56

John W wrote:
R.M. Schultz wrote:As for Hitler having monorchism, no this would pose no physical barrier to procreation, however it would be a sever psychological impediment.
Hi R M, a Few questions:

a) How so? I mean, with one testicle, wouldn't his resultant sperm production be lower and thus lower his chances for sucessfully impregnating someone?

I say that it would decrease his chances of impregnating a woman, but it would not make him infertile. Not sure if that's evena word.
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Postby Tonyny44 on 12 Jan 2004 02:29

Timo Worst wrote:Leni Riefensthal told a reporter in an interview that the glorious Führer came "too close" on one occasion, but that she managed to counter his intentions.


Yeah and if you believe her half the NSDP hit on her. Of course what she said POSTWAR doesn't necessarily jive with ACTUAL events before and during the Third Reich era...
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Postby R.M. Schultz on 12 Jan 2004 22:39

John W wrote: I mean, with one testicle, wouldn't his resultant sperm production be lower and thus lower his chances for sucessfully impregnating someone? … And won't it also be a phisiological impediment, being that the testicles also produce a decent quantity of androgens and other hormones?


Sperm counts vary widely among men with two intact testicles (the normal range varies some 500%) and, even though a man has one testicle, he still has a good chance of fallaing within this normal range. Remember what every girl knows — it only takes one sperm to …

Keep in mind also that the hormones are powerful agents and that the body tries to maintain a certain amount in the blood. Hitler's problem wouldn't necessarily have been a low amount of testosterone as much as a slower refractory time, that is, recovery of his testosterone level after depletion. This could help explain his mood swings, though I would want to have a more informed medical opinion of this before I made up my mind.

John W wrote: … why would he think that his progeny would be in anyway inferior to him?


Would he have picked a fat-bottomed, slow-number like Eva if he were trying to breed a race of Nordic Super-Men?
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Postby Eva on 13 Jan 2004 06:26

THIS THREAD JUST WON'T DIE!

I take issue with something that was just said. I don't know why, but I feel like I need to come to someone's defense here.


Would he have picked a fat-bottomed, slow-number like Eva if he were trying to breed a race of Nordic Super-Men?


Eva was neither fat-bottomed or slow. She was clever and witty and charming, although not at all serious (which is where a lot of the 'she was a dumb blonde' ideas come from), and she wasn't fat by and stretch of the imagination. She had been a little bit chubby in her teens, but began dieting just after graduating from the Simbach convent in 1929 and watched her weight for the rest of her life. Hitler actually used to complain that she had gotten too thin and try to encourage her to eat more.
"When I first met you, you were plump, and now you're as straight as a ramrod. Women always say they want to make themselves beautiful for a man and then do everything that is contrary to this man's tastes. They do their utmost to conquer him, but then become slaves to fashion and think only of making their little friends jealous." Hitler quoted in "Hitler's Mistress" by Nerin Gun p.109 paperback.

Eva


Okay, off the soapbox I come.[/i][/quote]
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Postby R.M. Schultz on 13 Jan 2004 06:41

Eva wrote:I take issue with something that was just said … Eva was neither fat-bottomed or slow.


Hitler’s preference for fat-bottom girls is well documented:

The Mind of Adolf Hitler: the Secret Wartime Report, by Walter C. Langer, Basic Books, N.Y.C. & London, 1972 wrote:In front of many witnesses, at a social gathering, the tactless and out-spoken Ernst Röhm blurted out: “He is thinking about the peasant girls. When they stand in the fields and bend down at their work so that you can see their behinds, that’s what he likes, especially when they’ve got big round ones. That’s Hitler’s sex life. What a man.” Hitler, who was present did not stir a muscle, but only stared at Röhm with compressed lips.
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Postby Karl on 13 Jan 2004 07:02

Mr Schultz, it seems it is a little late in the evening for you. What about: read what E wrote again and sleep on it. When you get up, ponder some more and after that (only if you feel ready...), please come forth and speak your conclusions. I will be most interested to read them.

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Postby Brig on 29 Jan 2004 15:06

Ovidius wrote: 2. All human beings, if able physically, have sex. It's one of the fundamental instincts of any living being able to sexually reproduce, including the human species. If there are no contrary proofs, we can suppose a priori that any human had some sexual experiences.


That's total bull and you know it. Though their may be nothing physically wrong with someone, they may lack the hormonal drive, or may abstain voluntary because of religion, etc. Not everyone runs around screwing like rabbits. I agree it is an instinct, but humans have developed far more complex mentally than other organisms and have the ability to control most of these urges, with a mind over matter theory

I'm slowly sifting through this whole topic, replying when I find something so I don't lose track, so excuse me if it's been rebuttled thus far. It'll be the rest of the day before I finish this topic :?
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Postby Prit on 29 Jan 2004 15:36

What an entertaining (!) thread.

Friends, on the subject of monorchism:

The testes have two functions: sperm production and hormone production.

As pointed out above, the 'normal' sperm count of men varies hugely, and monorchism does not necessarily equate with subfertility or infertility. Many of you will have had, or will know someone who had, undescended testes, requiring surgery. In some cases, the undescended testis cannot be moved to the scrotum, and is therefore removed (if it remains in the body cavity, it is exposed to higher temeratures than in the scrotum, and this is associated with the risk of malignant change). Such people nowadays have a prosthetic 'testis' placed in their scrotum, and are no more likely than other men to have fertility problems.

As for hormone production, a single testis would be quite sufficient to allow 'normal' function. Many hormonal systems in the body rely on a system of feedback - the pituitary gland in the brain releases a 'stimulating' hormone, and the target gland releases its own hormone - the amount of stimulating hormone is controlled by the amount of target hormone. So, as the testes release testosterone, the pituitary releases less FSH/LH to stimulate the testes. A single testis is quite capable of producing sufficient hormone; there would probably not be any problems with a refractory state, as suggested by RM Schultz in his otherwise excellent posts above.

All this, of course, does nothing to further the argument about the number of testes that Hitler possessed, but still.....

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Re: Hitler and Sex

Postby Brig on 29 Jan 2004 15:52

Zapfenstreich wrote:There was even a rumor that he had sired an illigitimate son by a French woman during WWI.
Z


I doubt this, Hitler was one of the few who refused to leave the trenches on Christmas in WWI because he didn't believe in fratrinizing with the enemy
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