The label NAZI- An Ally invention?

Discussions on every day life in the Weimar Republic, pre-anschluss Austria, Third Reich and the occupied territories. Hosted by Vikki.
User avatar
yarmouth1
Member
Posts: 24
Joined: 23 Apr 2014, 06:56
Location: North America

The label NAZI- An Ally invention?

#1

Post by yarmouth1 » 01 Jun 2014, 12:10

Did the National Socialists call themselves "Nazis" or was that an abbreviation used by the Allied propaganda press as a buzz word like they use it today in the same way. I've never heard them called National Socialists in the media. Is that because it doesn't have the automatic bad taste that the term "Nazis" delivers? 8-)
Image

amcl
Member
Posts: 97
Joined: 30 Apr 2011, 04:11

Re: The label NAZI- An Ally invention?

#2

Post by amcl » 02 Jun 2014, 04:24

yarmouth1 wrote:Did the National Socialists call themselves "Nazis" or was that an abbreviation used by the Allied propaganda press as a buzz word like they use it today in the same way.
A qualified no to both of those. See http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=Nazi. One thing that that page misses is that Goebbels put out a book called "Der Nazi-Sozi" in 1926, but that seems to be an unusual (perhaps unique) case of an "official" Nazi work using the word Nazi. As for Allied propaganda, the Congressional Special Committee on Un-American Activities published a report on "Nazi propaganda activities" in 1934 (see http://www.archives.gov/legislative/gui ... ganda.html) which seems rather early for HUAC to be engaged in Allied-anything.

Cheers,

Angus


User avatar
yarmouth1
Member
Posts: 24
Joined: 23 Apr 2014, 06:56
Location: North America

Re: The label NAZI- An Ally invention?

#3

Post by yarmouth1 » 02 Jun 2014, 04:26

Thank you for the very informed and quick answer!

User avatar
Bernaschek
Member
Posts: 129
Joined: 16 Nov 2008, 12:51
Location: New Delhi

Re: The label NAZI- An Ally invention?

#4

Post by Bernaschek » 02 Jun 2014, 06:00

I remember a teacher having read to us an austrian government flyer from about 1936 and I'm sure it used the word "Nazi-Danger"
"nuts"

dshaday
Member
Posts: 628
Joined: 29 Dec 2013, 19:57

Re: The label NAZI- An Ally invention?

#5

Post by dshaday » 02 Jun 2014, 09:22

Hi

My understanding is that the term NAZI was used by some of the early German detractors to the party in Germany. It conveniently rhymed with a local Bavarian slang word Batsi (not sure of spelling) which is a term for a fool. I presume that it caught on with foreign press. After all, it seems like a logical abbreviation for the longer party name NAzional SoZIalist.

Maybe native Germans members from southern Germany can better comment.

I believe that Hitler, Goebles etc referred to themselves as National Socialists, and not NAZIs.

Dennis

OpanaPointer
Financial supporter
Posts: 5644
Joined: 16 May 2010, 15:12
Location: United States of America

Re: The label NAZI- An Ally invention?

#6

Post by OpanaPointer » 02 Jun 2014, 12:19

You'll find use of the word "Nazi" in US newspapers in the 1920s. Rare, but it's there. (This from searching newspaper archives while I was a grad student.)
Come visit our sites:
hyperwarHyperwar
World War II Resources

Bellum se ipsum alet, mostly Doritos.

User avatar
Webdragon2013
Member
Posts: 72
Joined: 24 Apr 2014, 11:37

Re: The label NAZI- An Ally invention?

#7

Post by Webdragon2013 » 02 Jun 2014, 16:10

dshaday wrote:Hi

My understanding is that the term NAZI was used by some of the early German detractors to the party in Germany. It conveniently rhymed with a local Bavarian slang word Batsi (not sure of spelling) which is a term for a fool. I presume that it caught on with foreign press. After all, it seems like a logical abbreviation for the longer party name NAzional SoZIalist.

Maybe native Germans members from southern Germany can better comment.

I believe that Hitler, Goebles etc referred to themselves as National Socialists, and not NAZIs.

Dennis
Absolutely nothing to do with being derogatory.
Germans call their political parties with abbreviations. This is still like this in 2014.
German political parties have usually long names (actually thats common in German language in general), so in slang term you wouldnt say "the national socialists workers of Germany" or "the German social Democrats".

National-Socializten: NAZIS
Radikalen: RADIS
Sozialisten: SOZIS
There were so many political parties in weimar there were just as many epithets.

Of course then the Allies and non Germans during WW2 and before, used the term NAZIs to generally brand any German soldier or any Nationalist German (there were actually many non Nazi Nationalist German political parties...).

For example in almost all footage of WW2 by Allies, you would hear "The Nazi Army", "Nazi POWs", "Nazi boots", etc.
Its common dehumanization tactic. Instead of saying German soldier which makes you think of a human being, you call them NAZIS which is automatically evil (political) and thus killable.

User avatar
Mauser K98k
Member
Posts: 766
Joined: 30 Aug 2003, 04:29
Location: Colorado

Re: The label NAZI- An Ally invention?

#8

Post by Mauser K98k » 02 Jun 2014, 22:39

...Of course then the Allies and non Germans during WW2 and before, used the term NAZIs to generally brand any German soldier or any Nationalist German (there were actually many non Nazi Nationalist German political parties...).

For example in almost all footage of WW2 by Allies, you would hear "The Nazi Army", "Nazi POWs", "Nazi boots", etc.
Its common dehumanization tactic. Instead of saying German soldier which makes you think of a human being, you call them NAZIS which is automatically evil (political) and thus killable.

Dehumanization was kind of a necessity for training Allied (or any) soldiers. If a soldier were to think that his enemy is just "a-nice- family-guy-like-me-fighting-for-his-country-and-doesn't-want-to-be-here-any-more-than-me", he'll probably end up with a bullet in his head. Yes, we called them NAZIs and the Germans called us "filthy Capitalist Jews".
Last edited by Mauser K98k on 03 Jun 2014, 00:59, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Annelie
Member
Posts: 5053
Joined: 12 Mar 2002, 03:45
Location: North America

Re: The label NAZI- An Ally invention?

#9

Post by Annelie » 02 Jun 2014, 23:01

I received today Geoff Walden's book Hitler's Berchtesgaden.

Interestingly enough in the introduction this label of Nazi is addressed by Geoff.
Page 7 (introduction)
Where did the "Nazi" come from?

The popular interpretation of the origin of the name "Nazi" is a contraction of the German
pronunciation of Nationsozialismus, or National Socialism (the Nazi Party's official name in English was the
National Socialist German Workers Party--NSDAP). However, "Nazi" was more likely adopted from a Bavarian/Austrian
nickname for a fool, and was initially applied by the opponents of Hitler's politics. Socialists were popularly called
"Sozis", so the National Socialists became "Nazis". However, Hitler and the members of his party disliked this name, instead calling themselves "National Socialists" or Parteigenossen.
--Party comrades.

An interesting read already.

OpanaPointer
Financial supporter
Posts: 5644
Joined: 16 May 2010, 15:12
Location: United States of America

Re: The label NAZI- An Ally invention?

#10

Post by OpanaPointer » 03 Jun 2014, 00:58

Mauser K98k wrote:Dehumanization was kind of a necessity for training Allied (or any) soldiers. If a soldier were to think that his enemy is just "a-nice- family-guy-like-me-fighting-for-his-country-and-doesn't-want-to-be-here-any-more-than-me", he'll probably end up with a bullet in his head. Yes, we called them NAZIs and the Germans called us "dirty Capitalist Jews".
It's tough to get the kid off the street to act reliably in combat, including killing other people. You have to make him believe they are the enemy, but you also have to keep him aware that they are quite probably just as tough and dedicated as he is, or the kids will not take the enemy threat seriously enough. The US military in WWII were presented with a different breed of propaganda than the civilian population, because the civies didn't have to fight. It's an interesting subfield of study, and one that hasn't been looked at much.
Come visit our sites:
hyperwarHyperwar
World War II Resources

Bellum se ipsum alet, mostly Doritos.

User avatar
Webdragon2013
Member
Posts: 72
Joined: 24 Apr 2014, 11:37

Re: The label NAZI- An Ally invention?

#11

Post by Webdragon2013 » 03 Jun 2014, 12:29

Mauser K98k wrote:
Dehumanization was kind of a necessity for training Allied (or any) soldiers. If a soldier were to think that his enemy is just "a-nice- family-guy-like-me-fighting-for-his-country-and-doesn't-want-to-be-here-any-more-than-me", he'll probably end up with a bullet in his head. Yes, we called them NAZIs and the Germans called us "filthy Capitalist Jews".
I fully agree.
You cannot fight a war with niceties.
Most enlisted men need slogans, they come from the working class and aren't deep thinkers (on both sides).

Though filthy capitalists Jews is a bit extreme :)
More like Capitalists (UK & USA) and Bolsheviks (Russians).

Though I think enlisted men on both sides did not care about this.
From my family and acquaintances, I never heard people politicize it so much.
Americans are "Amies", Russians "Russen" or "Ivans".

I think most Americans called enemies "Krauts" or "Jap". Which I dont know if its derogatory or not...

User avatar
Geoff Walden
Member
Posts: 2616
Joined: 29 Mar 2002, 15:50
Location: South of the Mason-Dixon Line
Contact:

Re: The label NAZI- An Ally invention?

#12

Post by Geoff Walden » 03 Jun 2014, 12:38

There was an article published in 1944 called "Nazi und Sozi" (Franz H. Mautner, in Modern Language Notes, Vol. 59, No. 2 (Feb. 1944), pp. 93-100 ... in spite of this being in an English language magazine, the article was in German).

Basically, the article says that although it is well known that "Nazi" is an abbreviation from "Nationalsozialist," it really probably came from the use of derogatory nicknames for the name Ignatz ("Nazi," "Natzi," "Nazerl"), indicating a foolish person, oaf, dumb farmer, "Schmutzfink," etc. (as stated also in the other sources cited). The author found this derogatory use as early as the 1860s, and that "Nazi" was naturally picked up and used by early opponents of the National Socialist movement in Germany.

bytwerk
Member
Posts: 119
Joined: 29 May 2004, 14:59
Location: USA
Contact:

Re: The label NAZI- An Ally invention?

#13

Post by bytwerk » 28 Jun 2014, 04:09

I’ve got a blog posting on the subject:

http://germanpropaganda.blogspot.com/20 ... -nazi.html

User avatar
Timmy
Banned
Posts: 104
Joined: 26 Jun 2014, 11:11

Re: The label NAZI- An Ally invention?

#14

Post by Timmy » 28 Jun 2014, 20:44

It's not an invention, as already mentioned Goebbels published a pamphlet mentioning the word "Nazi".

But what is true is that the National Socialists or members of the NSDAP rarely considered themselves as "Nazis". People against them labeled them as Nazis though.

YM
Member
Posts: 102
Joined: 16 May 2005, 14:26
Location: Israel

Re: The label NAZI- An Ally invention?

#15

Post by YM » 29 Jun 2014, 04:23

Churchill would pronounce the word something like "Narzi" as a form of ridicule.

Post Reply

Return to “Life in the Third Reich & Weimar Republic”