Did Martin Bormann survive the war?

[ManfredV]

There were witnesses who saw his dead body in Berlin. His skulls were found in the 1970ies and identified (teeth). They were nearby the place he was seen live and dead for the last time. Later a DNA test was made and he was identified again.
Do we need more? No!

[BillHermann]

Just because two books say he did does not mean its fact, there is much fiction out there that is sold as fact for the gullible masses that want to keep the fire burning.

There is far more evidence that he died escaping in Berlin. Think about it, Berlin in shambles, an older heavy Bormann dodging Soviets, bullets and bombs. Berlin was an apocalyptic mess, read any of the escape stories and it was almost next to impossible.

This constant concept of painting theses fleeing nazi politicians as superhuman solders that could escape a major battle let alone occupied territory is insane.

Bormann was a strange older nazi not a character from Return To Castle Wolfenstine,

some of the theories here are really grasping ....

[Annelie]

Think about it, Berlin in shambles, an older heavy Bormann dodging Soviets, bullets and bombs. Berlin was an apocalyptic mess, read any of the escape stories and it was almost next to impossible.

Didn't realize 45 was considered older? Many Germans survived that battle in Berlin but I don't believe Bormann did
as fact has shown.

[BillHermann]

Of course 45 is not old but it is older than a man in his 20s " context my dear "

I also did not say that all Germans were killed in Berlin, however it was a mess, something that was not very pleasant and there was much death and it was very dangerous. Some neighbourhoods were flattened completely by bombing with little of Berlin being left untouched by the battle.

My post was simply saying that Bormann was not 25 and strolling through the Tiergarten in spring time.

[little grey rabbit]

The whole problem with the "Bormann survived and reburied" theory is that the body found in Berlin was that of a 45 year old man !!

I have had a look through the materials provided in the appendix of The Secretary: Martin Bormann, The Man Who Manipulated Hitler by Jochen von Lang and I haven't found any explicit estimate of age of the skeletal remains.

There is mention of dental work not contained in Blaschke's dental records that might support post war dental work.
page 377

Fundamental discrepancies are to be found in that the crown on upper right 3rd molar and the window-crown bridge from lower right lateral incisor to lower left lateral incisor with central supporting members made of synthetic material are not shown in Dr Blaschke's chart

The biggest issue with the account of Artur Axmann is he was a die-hard Nazi who was involved in post-war SS networks - as such he has a huge motivation to "kill off" Bormann.

Certainly if Bormann did escape, it could only have been under the protection and blessing of West German, American and British intelligence - as such we should expect that there would be considerable resistance to it being uncovered.

[Mark Costa]

Little Grey Rabbit:

You do realize that other tests and documents do exist other than what is in Lang's book? And several other examinations took place long after Lang wrote his book in the late 1970's. So just because Lang does not mention how old the bones were in his book does not mean the age of the person was not determined!

And in regards to Axmann --- he HATED Bormann and there would be no reason for him to cover up for him. Axmann would have killed him himself had he had the chance.

Mark Costa

[obersalzberg51]

Reinhard gehlen said in his book the servicethat bormann was a soviet agent, what made him believe this? Also i rember reading walter schellenbergs memoirs and i know him claimed gestapo müller was a soviet agent but did he also claim bormann had been taken to russia and not perish in berlin?

[obersalzberg51]

were the red specks of clay found on his skull ever explained? red clay is not found in berlin soil but is in south america adding weight to the argument that he died in south america and was burried only to be dug up and re-burried in berlin at a later date to make it appear that he perished in berlin on the 1st/2nd may all along?

[LWD]

Do we have a good source on the "red specks of clay found on his skull"?
Red clay is found in many areas of the world, I suspect in many areas of Europe, this seems to be a stretch even if the clay was indeed found.

[Blackadder2000]

Going to bump this thread up, since there is a lot of speculation going on in the series Hunting Hitler, where they say that Bormann lived in Argentina after the war.

I am interested in these theories, although I don't believe they are true.

[Hchrisc]

Google "Prescott Bush and Richard Nixon". One of images that will be returned is Prescott with Nixon at the 1952 Republican Convention. The Man standing on the fringe of the photo is Martin Bormann.

[Hchrisc]

http://www.theglobalmovement.info/wp/ni ... sh-kennedy

[Wordsworth]

With some of the bunker survivors being captured and some getting away, I don't think it's too fanciful to believe that Bormann was either killed accidentally by the shelling or committed suicide.

Too bad, though, the first book I read that mentioned Bormann was "The Year of the Rat". Loved that book

[Messe62]

Bormann died. Hans Baur Hitlers personal pilot told me the story when I met him. Both he and Bormann as well as a few others did try to escape the Russians by moving beneath the city through the tunnels to the railway station They did not make it. Baur was in front, Bormann behind him. Shelling caused the men to be wounded and to collapse. Bormann went one way Baur and two others the other way. Baur told me Bormann was killed because when he looked back they were lying on the ground probably dead. Baur was taken prisoner and spent 10 years in Soviet captivity. Bauer told me this in 1990 three years before his death. In 1998 Remains uncovered during an excavation near the railroad station were conclusively identified as Bormann's The testing was led by Wolfgang Eisenmenger, Professor of Forensic Science at Ludwig Maximilian University of Munich.Baur was right, Bormann had been dead all those years. I still have Baurs letters. He also told me the fate of Hitler as well.

[Neutrality]

This may have been covered in this thread already.. (I only read two pages) but in the recent hunting Hitler series on history channels they interview witnesses in Argentina who knew and worked for Martin bormann, although known by another alias in those days. They also interviewed bormanns (supposed) step daughter who's still there and she tells of how he fled to child when eichmann was snatched by mosssd. He is said to have died there of stomach cancer and interned after a secret ceremony of special guests. Then his body shows up in Berlin years later with Red clay remnants more synonymous with the ground of south America (and the very graveyard in chile) than downtown Berlin.

I personally think someone as crude, astute and as wealthy as bormann would have had a back up plan and safe passage somewhere paid for by his plundered fortunes. His cushy relationship with peron was well known and the movement of reichsbank funds is all to ominous. No way a man of that character hung about to do a last minute runner through the streets being pounded with red army artillery, he was much to clued in for that