Vehicles used by Sipo/SD

Discussions on the vehicles used by the Axis forces. Hosted by Christian Ankerstjerne
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Heini
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#16

Post by Heini » 27 Jun 2006, 11:16

Hello!

I've attached another picture of police vehicles during the great raids in 1933.

It shows Adler Standard L6 phaetons (Kripo) and NAG Streifenwagen (Schupo - later called Orpo).

Short summary:
* SiPo cars for lower grades were MB W136/170 V (1936+) and rests of Hanomag 4/23-OTP* (1932+).
* SiPo cars for higher grades ("Polizei-Führungswagen") were Hanomag Sturm-OTP* (1939+) and Adler Diplomat (1938+).
(*OTP means "Offener Tourenwagen Polizei"/"Open Touring car Police")
* The only "special vehicles" I know were used by the homicide squads of the Kripo and were called "Mordautos" or "Tatortwagen"/crime scene units (see my first reply).

* Police vans or "Mannschaftswagen" were issued to the Schutzpolizei or later Ordnungspolizei like Opel Blitz trucks.
* "Streifenwagen" were used by the "Überfallkommandos" or "flying squads" like the NAG truck on the photo I've attached.
* Small patrol cars were the MB 170 V/W 136 "Kübelsitzwagen" or also motorcycles (made by Victoria and BMW). [Also radio cars were used (in Berlin 1936 Adler Diplomat sedans and in Hamburg 1938 Adler Diplomat sedans).]

* Other special vehicles I know are the armoured cars made by Daimler-Benz (I've attached two pictures of them).

By the way: Another notable unit was the "motorized constabulary" or "motorisierte Gendarmerie" which patroulled the "Reichsautobahnen" in Wanderer W35 OTP's and W40 OTP's.

Hope this helps!
Heini
Attachments
Berliner_Polizei_1933.jpg
Berliner Polizei (1933)
Berliner_Polizei_1933.jpg (93.58 KiB) Viewed 2028 times
Panzerkraftwagen der Polizei.jpg
Armoured car (1)
Panzerkraftwagen der Polizei.jpg (34.63 KiB) Viewed 2028 times
Panzerwagen der Polizei hinter dem Konzerthaus.jpg
Armoured car (2)
Panzerwagen der Polizei hinter dem Konzerthaus.jpg (31.32 KiB) Viewed 2028 times

Bill 13
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#17

Post by Bill 13 » 29 Jun 2006, 11:04

Day
Scan from German Mountain Troops in WW II Schiffer
Seems to be a fire truck in Police service. Don't know if it's regular Police or Fire Police.
Bill
:roll:


Thomas_P
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#18

Post by Thomas_P » 30 Jun 2006, 07:36

Hi Bill,

it´s a Mercedes-Benz L1500S, Leichtes Löschgruppenfahrzeug LLG (later LF8), small pumper.
It belonged to units of the Feuerlöschpolizei. Since 1938 the municipal fire brigades were
associated with the police. Feuerlöschregimenter (fire police regiments) were often send to
occupied countries.

Greetings
Thomas

Bill 13
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#19

Post by Bill 13 » 03 Jul 2006, 06:50

Thanks Thomas
Never to old to learn new stuff. Did not know about the fire service being sent to occupied countries, but then it sort of makes sense. Can not always trust the effiency of the local
Bill
:roll:

Bill 13
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#20

Post by Bill 13 » 09 Jul 2006, 08:12

Day All
Nother Photo.e-bay .

{{Pic Withdrawn}}

Bill
:roll:
Last edited by Bill 13 on 14 Jul 2006, 08:41, edited 1 time in total.

Bill Murray
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#21

Post by Bill Murray » 09 Jul 2006, 10:28

Hi Bill:
Nice shot of an Opel Kapitaen.
bill

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Doggowitz
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#22

Post by Doggowitz » 09 Jul 2006, 11:28

Great Pic indeed... A question though: Is there a Police Eagle on the side of the car? Since the Man next to it is in civil clothes, wouldn't it make more sense to have a civilian marked car too?

Bill Murray
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#23

Post by Bill Murray » 09 Jul 2006, 13:23

Maybe he was just getting a lift to the local Donut shop with the uniform guys. :wink:
Bill

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Sander D
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#24

Post by Sander D » 09 Jul 2006, 18:16

Here are other pictures of the Feuerlöschpolizei also showing a Mannschaftswagen.

http://img125.imageshack.us/img125/1769 ... re15hs.jpg

Picture come from an expired E-bay sale .

Regards

Sander

Thomas_P
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#25

Post by Thomas_P » 11 Jul 2006, 17:34

Hi Sander,

on the left (above) we have a Ford V8 3t with front pump as a kind of Kraftfahrspritze.
Without the rear body to be seen, it´s difficult to say more precisely, what it is.
Left below is a Ford BB with a Opel Blitz 3t behind.
On the right in both pics there is Magirus M30S as KS15 (Kraftfahrspritze 15) with (for fire
protection use) uncommon one-axle-trailer.

Very nice find!

Greetings
Thomas

JoeW
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Re:

#26

Post by JoeW » 19 Aug 2014, 16:33

Heini wrote:Hello Doggowitz:

It's rather difficult to answer this because the Kripo units for example used special vehicles especially equipped with crime fighting tools ("Kriminaltechnik"/"Spurensicherungsmaterial") for crime scene investigation. Like the "Mordautos" ("homicide cars"). These were big black Maybach sedans of the 27/120-W-5 series and later (from 1928) W-5-SG series. I've attached a picture of the Maybach "Mordauto" used by the Kriminalpolizei-Leitstelle Berlin.

Sipo detectives of higher service grades (Kriminalkommissar/SS-Obersturmführer and higher) are driven normally Adler "Standard L6" sedans ("L6" = the Longer version of the "Standard 6A" sedan). They were built from 1928 - 30. After that point no new cars were purchased for a while.

The first new police cars were purchased in 1936. The new vehicles of Sipo detectives of the higher service grades (see above) were 1938 model Adler "Diplomat" sedans. (They replaced the Adler Standard L6 sedans.)

The "Mordautos" as well as the officer's cars were driven by (plain clothes) chauffeurs.

Sipo members of lower pay grades often driven "normal" cars (by themselves without chauffeurs) like the Mercedes-Benz 170 V sedan. Police cars for Sipo detectives were rare in the Reich, because most of them were sent to the front lines.

It's proven that Gestapo members sometimes used their own private cars just for camouflage.

Sipo verhicles had NO insignia - they were completely unmarked. Like Sipo detectives had NO uniforms per se.

The license plate were civilian ones - like "IA" for Berlin or "IIA" for Munich etc. (camouflage!).

If there are still any questions I'll try to answer them!

Best wishes!
Heini
I am a bit late in joining this discussion. Police, Fire and Security Police vehicles had specific license plate numeration indication branch and location. In addition, command flags were used by general grade, staff and field grade officers and their formations from 1937 for the Order Police, from 1941 for the Feuerwehr and from 1942 for the Security Police. In 2002 I wrote an article on this subject published in the magazine "The Military Advisor". I include several original photos of police vehicles with command flags shown.

A bit late, I find that there was an error in the editing of the section on security police. I am preparing an addendum to my article and wonder if any forum members have photos of vehicles of the security police showing these command flags on the front fenders. I would appreciate any assistance.

In addition, a photo in Andrew Mollo's book on the Security Police shows a roll call of security police in Poland, with a vehicle shown bearing the national police insignia on the car door.

kerryboo
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Re: Vehicles used by Sipo/SD

#27

Post by kerryboo » 19 Aug 2014, 16:50

I think that these fine-looking charabancs may fall within the scope of this thread.
Kerry.
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img521_new.jpg

kerryboo
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Re: Vehicles used by Sipo/SD

#28

Post by kerryboo » 20 Aug 2014, 10:26

Hello Max and all,
First, sorry for posting in the wrong thread, I have no knowledge in this area and assumed the photo was relevant.
Max, I have tried a bit of enhancement on the original and, whilst still a little fuzzy, I did manage to isolate the furthest number as IA 1645, the nearer one was also, in my opinion IA, but the numbers are indistinct.
I hope that this is of some help, perhaps it will pinpoint the location at least.
Thanks again,
Kery.

kerryboo
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Re: Vehicles used by Sipo/SD

#29

Post by kerryboo » 20 Aug 2014, 10:32

Hello again,
This is most bizarre, I just replied to a reply from Maxschnauzer, but it has disappeared whilst I was typing. He had said that he thought, in light of the Reichswehr number plate the photo was not proper to this thread, but he was interested in the registrations on the other vehicles.
Also, further to my reply, I see above that IA was the code for Berlin.
Sorry for my obvious confusion,
Kerry.

SIS 5
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Re: Vehicles used by Sipo/SD

#30

Post by SIS 5 » 20 Aug 2014, 11:52

Hi Kerry,

Your "fine-looking charabancs" are police vehicles I think, maybe police vans (Polizei-Mannschaftswagen) or vans of so called flying squadrons (Überfallkommando). They could be NAG vehicles, the type D 6, D 7 or NAG-Protos type 201 or 204. Here a pic of such a vehicle from from Holger´s site (his ID: NAG-Protos).

Regards

Bert
Attachments
NAG-Protos.png
NAG-Protos.png (189.44 KiB) Viewed 505 times

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