3/654

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jopaerya
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3/654

#1

Post by jopaerya » 05 May 2005, 11:05

Hello All

Can you help me with fotos of the tanknumbers of the
s.Panzerjäger-Abteilung 3/654 in Normandie or in France
in 1944 ?
I have found fotos of the Jagdpanther 302,314,332,334 and
maybe you know the place were the fotos have been taken.

Regards Jos

jopaerya
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Location: middelburg

#2

Post by jopaerya » 07 May 2005, 09:59

Hello

Is there anyone who can help me with pictures
or info on the 3/654.
I got also a extra quistion about the Jagdpanther
on the the first fotos from Mailly-le-Camp the box
for the barrelcleaningset is fitted on the side of the
Jagdpanther , on the fotos from Normandie the box
of the barrelcleaningset is mounted on the end of the
motordeck ?

Regards Jos


tiger1john
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#3

Post by tiger1john » 07 May 2005, 20:02

For information on 654 Can I recommend "The combat History of schwere Panzerjager Abteilung 654" by Karlheinz Munch, published by J J Fedorowitz. Here is the URL http://www.jjfpub.mb.ca/photo_albums.htm#654. It is a huge and comprehensive tome. You will find photos of 321, 322, 323 and 324 as well information on the crews, transcripts of battle diary's, etc.

Hope this helps

jopaerya
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Location: middelburg

#4

Post by jopaerya » 07 May 2005, 21:04

Thanks Tiger1john

I will order the book , thanks for the tip

Regards Jos

uli
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Location: Germany

JP locations

#5

Post by uli » 09 May 2005, 00:43

302: Caudebec near Elbeuf (near Seine river)

311: northwest of St. Pieres du Fresne

314: 500 m southeast of St. Pieres du Fresne, between RN 175 and RN 177 (10 km southwest of Villers-Bocage)

332: Beauvais, north of Seine river

334: vicinity at St. Georges 5km north of Villers-Bocage

from: Combat History of sPzJg-Abt. 654

311, 314, 334 location on map:

Image

jopaerya
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#6

Post by jopaerya » 09 May 2005, 16:22

Hello Uli

Thanks for your info , it helps me a lot

Regards Jos

uli
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Location: Germany

#7

Post by uli » 10 May 2005, 00:18

some corrections of the words:

302: Caudebec near Elbeuf (near Seine river)

311: northwest of St. Pierre du Fresne

314: 500 m southeast of St. Pieres du Fresne, between RN 175 and RN 177 (10 km southwest of Villers-Bocage)

332: Beauvais, north of Seine river

334: vicinity at St. Georges 5km southwest of Villers-Bocage

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Bayerlein spirit
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#8

Post by Bayerlein spirit » 10 May 2005, 23:00

Hi Uli,

How are you?

I have found two others wrecks of sPzJg-Abt. 654 destroyed in the Falaise gap, one near Chambois, and another northern Trun in the " La Massue " by Didier Lodieu about Poles in Mont ormel battle.

If you want pictures, sent to me a mail

Fred

jopaerya
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#9

Post by jopaerya » 11 May 2005, 15:38

Hello Uli and Bayerlein spirit

Maybe you can help me with the following questions
First the 302 is towing a other Jagdpanther in Bourgtheroulde
on the foto from Bundesarchiv Koblenz, a few miles from Caudebac
In Caudebec there is only one Jagdpanther 302? found with 2 holes
in the side of the tank (Archiv du Canada) , were is the other
Jagdpanther ???
The last foto is a unknow Jagdpanther towing the 332 , the foto
is from Coll. F. Watteeuw , in the town of Beauvais.
The 2 survived ( the 332 has only one tanktrack left ) Normandie, Falaisepocket
and the crossing of the river Seine were did there voyage end ?

Regards Jos

Matthias Radu
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Other losses

#10

Post by Matthias Radu » 11 May 2005, 22:22

Uli, as I have the same reference, I'm curious when 302 and 332 had been lost? I can't find them in the loss table for July/August 1944. But then, 302 is pictured while entering the ferry at Elbeuf - if the caption is correct - so one might assume it actually got across the Seine? Did these losses therefore occur early in September?

There are other losses of 3./654 in August previously not mentioned:

17.8.: 322 (300004) and 301 (300018)
18.8.: 323 (300033)
20.8.: 321 (300022)

654 lost 22 Jagdpanthers throughout July/August 1944 in Normandie according to K.-H. Münch

Regards

Matthias

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Bayerlein spirit
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#11

Post by Bayerlein spirit » 12 May 2005, 00:59

Hi,

Find here two wrecks from Falaise Gap

1... Road to Vimoutiers Orbec destroyed the 21 august 44 ( bad picture sorry )
2... Near Trun ( Northern road to Vimoutiers ) abandoned the 20 august 1944


Fred
Attachments
JagdPantherChambois.jpg
JagdPantherChambois.jpg (77.82 KiB) Viewed 5107 times
sPzJgAbt654VimoutiersOrbec 210844.jpeg
sPzJgAbt654VimoutiersOrbec 210844.jpeg (13.98 KiB) Viewed 5108 times

uli
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More info

#12

Post by uli » 12 May 2005, 19:38

Matthias, thanks for your post.

The japanese book "Panzer und Militarfahrzeuge an der Front Bildband" from Dainippon Kaiga (credits ECPA) shows a pic that the JP towed by #302 is #332, from the same pic series of your pic "Jagdpanther 302.JPG", number visible in the book.
Image

The JP towed by #302 is #332 with both tracks. The only number 302 (Chassis Number 300093) was lost on 27th Nov 44 at Oberspechbach, Alsace. The highest chassis number for destroyed 654-JPs in France was 300047.

The fate of number 332 is unknown.

Maybe they renumbered the "old" JPs during the refitting in Germany September 44. 16 JP of sPzAbt 654 crossed the seine river and 654 received 7 new JP on 29th Aug, in France after the seine crossing. The book "schwere Jagdpanzer" by Walter Spielberger counting 23 JP (16 +7) crossed the seine river.

654 withdraw route:

Gournay-en-Bray (22. Aug), Beauvais (27. Aug), Clermont, Compiegne (28. Aug), Noyon, Hom, Guise (29. Aug), La Chapelle, Avesnes, Beaumont (30. Aug), Spa / Belgium (01. Sept), Eupen / Germany, Monschau, Düren (5. Sept), Gummersbach (9. Sept). Most of the JP (all ?) made it to Gummersbach, September 1944.

One of the last JP from 654 was 331, lost in Germany March 1945, a early JP version.

Info from Combat History of sPzJg-Abt. 654 by Karlheinz Münch.

Matthias Radu
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Joined: 21 Apr 2005, 14:35
Location: Hessen

JP Losses

#13

Post by Matthias Radu » 12 May 2005, 20:12

Uli, thanks for additional info - maybe I got you wrong.

I thought your first table would refer to losses of 3./654 in Normandie (including 302 and 332), so I just wanted to check if I missed something. Münch refers to the 302 - which by all probability crossed the Seine at Elbeuf - as chassis number 300093, so it seems that the "wrecker" actually was plessed with a somewhat longer life than a lot of his fellow JPs in Normandie? Maybe 332 got "home" as well? At least he crossed the Seine, too as he is pictured staging through Beauvais.

Fred, thanks for the pics, first one shows chassis number 300045 abandoned on 21.8. on the road from Vimoutiers to Orbec, second one shows 321 chassis number 300022 abandoned 7km east of Livarot.

Cheers

Matthias

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