General Alfred Jodl

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GFM2000
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General Alfred Jodl

#1

Post by GFM2000 » 14 Aug 2002, 06:53

I would like to ask some questions to Forum members about General Alfred Jodl, the Chief of Wehrmacht Operational Staff.
The Harper Encyclopedia of Military Biography wrote:.... was found guilty of four counts, [Jodl] was hanged at Nuremberg (October 16, 1946) ; his case was later reviewed by a German denazification court, which found that he had restricted himself only to military operational law ; posthumously exonerated by the court (Febuary 28, 1953).
(1) Can anyone add anything more about the "Denazification courts"? What was its actual purpose? Were any more former German generals similarly exonerated, or further charged with more war crimes?

(2) Did Jodl die for Speer? I recalled reading an article where the Western Allies made a deal with the Russians, agreeing to persecute Jodl to the fullest extent (ie : death), in exchange for leniency on Albert Speer's charges (ie : life imprisonment). How accurate are these rumours? In addition, why would the Western Allies pursue such an exchange policy? Would it be beneficial for Speer to live in a post-war Germany, or detrimental for Jodl to survive?

(3) What's your own personal opinion about Jodl? Despite being fiercely loyal to Hitler, I see Jodl as a brilliant strategist (unlike Keital), was not blinded by German propaganda about German supremancy (unlike Goering), and reported the true situation of the battlefront to his fellow Generals and Gauleiters. He is one who should not have died at Nuremberg.

:)

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Phil V
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#2

Post by Phil V » 17 Aug 2002, 12:18

There is a line from the movie Apocalypse Now that states (words to the effect) :

"Charging a soldier for murder in war is like handing out speeding tickets at the Daytona 500".


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#3

Post by fanatic » 17 Aug 2002, 12:27

(1)Denazification purpose is to eradicate Nazism after the war.In 1946,the Court issued a directive making a clear distinction between punishment of those who had committed war crimes and internment of potentially dangerous persons.Five categories of Nazis were defined:(1)major offenders(to be sentenced to death or life imprisonment);(2)activists,militarists,or profiteers(to be sentenced to a maximum of 10 years in prison);(3)lesser offenders,such as young men who deserved leniency(to be placed on probation for 2 or 3 years);(4)followers who were nominal supporters of the nazi regime(to be placed under police surveillance and obliged to pay a fine);and(5)exonerated individuals,such as former nazis who had resisted the National Socialist government either actively or passively and who had themselves suffered from nazi oppression.
(2)I never heard about this rumors,maybe somebody else can explain it.

(3)General Jodl,in my personal opinion,was an intelligent,shrewd and outstanding staff officer but with limited experience of command in the field.Eventhough his loyalty to Hitler was unshaken,he is willing on occasion to stand up to Hitler,particularly over the Fuhrer inept handling of Soviet campaigns in 1942-43.Without the Jodl diaries,we will never know what exactly happens in German High Command.He is one of my favorite generals and i agreed with you that he should not died in Nuremberg.
-Can you or somebody else give me the exactly date of his promotions,especially with the rank of Oberfahnrich,Oberleutnant,Hauptmann and Major?
-What his assignments in the years of 1919 to 1931?

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Generaloberst Alfred Jodl

#4

Post by Glenn2438 » 17 Aug 2002, 17:50

He did not receive a promotion to Oberfähnrich as that rank did not exist in the Bavarian army or any imperial German state's forces.

Fähnrich: 10 Jul 1910
Leutnant: 28 Oct 1912
Oberleutnant: 14 Jan 1916
Rittmeister/Hauptmann: 28 Sep 1921 with seniority from 18 Oct 1915 (15)
Major: 01 Feb 1931 with seniority from 1 May 1929 (3)
Oberstleutnant: 01 Aug 33 (9)
Oberst: 01 Aug 1935 (10)
Generalmajor: 01 Apr 1939 (10)
Generalleutnant: 19 Jul 1940 with seniority from 1 Jul 1940 (2)
General der Artillerie: 19 Jul 1940 with seniority from 1 Jul 1940 (2)
Generaloberst: 30 Jan 1944 with seniority from 1 Feb 1944

He was initially promoted to cavalry captain (Rittmeister) as he was serving in Fahrabteilung 4 in 1920. He rank designation changed to Hauptmann on being accepted as a general staff officer and on return to the artillery branch. He was simultaneously promoted to Generalleutnant and General der Artillerie on the same day in effect skipping the former rank.

interwar assignments:

01 Feb 19: Battery leader of Volkswehr-Batterie Augsburg
15 Jun 19: Battery leader in light artillery regiment 22
01 Oct 19: Battery officer in artillery regiment 21
01 Mar 20: Deputy Battery chief in artillery regiment 21
15 Oct 20: battery officer in supply battalion 4
03 Jan 21: "Leader Assisant" (general staff) course with 7th Division staff
20 May - 19 Jun 22: attached to motor transport battalion 7
01 Oct 22: Battery Chief in III./artillery regiment 7
01 Oct 23: attached to Berlin university
01 Oct 24: Expert on intelligence staff, 7th Division
01 Oct 27: Battery chief in III./artillery regiment 7
01 Oct 28: Instructor in general staff duties, 7th division staff
01 Jun 32: Attached to defence ministry
01 Oct 32: Group leader in Troop Office, defence ministry
Nov 34 - May 35: Attached to Turkish army
21 May 25: Expert in defence ministry
01 Jul 35: Department head in defence ministry/ Department Landesvertedigung (L)
04 Feb 38: Chief of Wehrmacht operations office/ OKW
20 Nov 38: Artillery Commander 44, Vienna
25 Aug 39: Attached Wehrmacht Operations Office/ OKW, WFSt
27 Aug 39: Chief of Wehrmacht Operations Office/ OKW, WFSt


Regards
Glenn

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#5

Post by fanatic » 23 Aug 2002, 19:46

Thank you and I need some Jodl photos

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#6

Post by Mich » 09 May 2003, 19:36

There is no reason why Jodl should have died for Speer. These two man had control over two very different things and had nothing to do with eachother. Not in Nuremberg and not before Nuremberg.

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#7

Post by David Thompson » 09 May 2003, 20:56

The International Military Tribunal (IMT) found Jodl guilty of conspiracy, crimes against peace, war crimes, and crimes against humanity. Here is its judgment on the man:

"From 1935 to 1938 he was Chief of the National Defense Section in the High Command. After a year in command of troops, in August 1939 he returned to become Chief of the Operations Staff of the High Command of the Armed Forces. Although his immediate superior was Defendant Keitel, he reported directly to Hitler on operational matters. In the strict military sense, Jodl was the actual planner of the war and responsible in large measure for the strategy and conduct of operations.

Jodl defends himself on the ground he was a soldier sworn to obedience, and not a politician; and that his staff and planning work left him no time for other matters. He said that when he signed or initialed orders, memoranda, and letters, he did so for Hitler and often in the absence of Keitel. Though he claims that as a soldier he had to obey Hitler, he says that he often tried to obstruct certain measures by delay, which occasionally proved successful as when he resisted Hitler's demand that a directive be issued to lynch Allied "terror fliers."

Crimes against Peace

Entries in Jodl's diary of 13 and 14 February 1938 show Hitler instructed both him and Keitel to keep up military pressure against Austria, begun at the Schuschnigg conference, by simulating military measures, and that these achieved their purpose. When Hitler decided "not to tolerate" Schuschnigg's plebiscite, Jodl brought to the conference the "old draft," the existing staff plan. His diary for 10 March shows Hitler then ordered the preparation of "Case Otto," and the directive was initialed by Jodl. Jodl issued supplementary instructions on 11 March, and initialed Hitler's order for the invasion on the same date.

In planning the attack on Czechoslovakia, Jodl was very active, according to the Schmundt notes. He initialed Items 14, 17, 24, 36, and 37 in the notes. Jodl admits he agreed with OKH that the "incident" to provide German intervention must occur at the latest by 1400 hours on X-1 Day, the day before the attack, and said it must occur at a fixed time in good flying weather. Jodl conferred with the propaganda experts on "imminent common tasks" such as German violations of international law, exploitation of them by the enemy, and refutations by the Germans, which "task" Jodl considered "particularly important."

After Munich, Jodl wrote: "Czechoslovakia as a power is out.... The genius of the Fuehrer and his determination not to shun even a world war have again won the victory without the use of force. The hope remains that the incredulous, the weak, and the doubtful people have been converted and will remain that way." Shortly after the Sudeten occupation, Jodl went to a post command and did not become Chief of the Operations Staff in OKW until the end of August 1939. Jodl discussed the Norway invasion with Hitler, Keitel, and Raeder on 12 December 1939; his diary is replete with later entries on his activities in preparing this attack. Jodl explains his comment that Hitler was still looking for an "excuse" to move meant that he was waiting for reliable intelligence on the British plans, and defends the invasion as a necessary move to forestall them. His testimony shows that from October 1939 Hitler planned to attack the West through Belgium, but was doubtful about invading Holland until the middle of November. On 8 February 1940, Jodl, his deputy Warlimont, and Jeschonnek, the air forces planner, discussed among themselves the "new idea" of attacking Norway, Denmark, and Holland, but guaranteeing the neutrality of Belgium. Many of the 17 orders postponing the attack in the West for various reasons, including weather conditions, until May 1940, were signed by Jodl. He was active in the planning against Greece and Yugoslavia. The Hitler order of 11 January 1941 to intervene in Albania was initialed by Jodl. On 20 January, 4 months before the attack, Hitler told a conference of German and Italian generals in Jodl's presence that German troop concentrations in Romania were to be used against Greece. Jodl was present on 18 March when Hitler told Raeder all Greece must be occupied before any settlement could be reached. On 27 March, when Hitler told the German High Command that the destruction of Yugoslavia should be accomplished with "unmerciful harshness," and the decision was taken to bomb Belgrade without a declaration of war, Jodl was also there.

Jodl testified that Hitler feared an attack by Russia and so attacked first. This preparation began almost a year before the invasion. Jodl told Warlimont as early as 29 July 1940 to prepare the plans since Hitler had decided to attack; and Hitler later told Warlimont he had planned to attack in August 1940 but postponed it for military reasons. He initialed Hitler's directive of 12 November 1940 that preparations verbally ordered should be continued and also initialed "Case Barbarossa" an 18 December. On 3 February 1941, Hitler, Jodl, and Keitel discussed the invasion, and he was present on 14 June when final reports on "Case Barbarossa" were made.

War Crimes and Crimes against Humanity

On 18 October 1942 Hitler issued the Commando Order, and a day later a supplementary explanation to commanding officers only. The covering memorandum was signed by Jodl. Early drafts of the order were made by Jodl's staff, with his knowledge. Jodl testified he was strongly opposed on moral and legal grounds but could not refuse to pass it on. He insists he tried to mitigate its harshness in practice by not informing Hitler when it was not carried out. He initialed the OKW memorandum of 25 June 1944 reaffirming the order after the Normandy landings.

A plan to eliminate Soviet commissars was in the directive for "Case Barbarossa." The decision whether they should be killed without trial was to be made by an officer. A draft contains Jodl's handwriting suggesting this should be handled as retaliation, and he testified this was his attempt to get around it.

When in 1945 Hitler considered denouncing the Geneva Convention, Jodl argued the disadvantages outweighed the advantages. On 21 February he told Hitler adherence to the Convention would not interfere with the conduct of the war, giving as an example the sinking of a British hospital ship as a reprisal and calling it a mistake. He said he did so because it was the only attitude Hitler would consider, that moral or legal arguments had no effect, and argues he thus prevented Hitler from denouncing the Convention.

There is little evidence that Jodl was actively connected with the slave labor program, and he must have concentrated on his strategic planning function. But in his speech of 7 November 1943 to the Gauleiter he said it was necessary to act "with remorseless vigor and resolution" in Denmark, France, and the Low Countries to compel work on the Atlantic Wall.
By teletype of 28 October 1944, Jodl ordered the evacuation of all persons in northern Norway and the burning of their houses so they could not help the Russians. Jodl says he was against this, but Hitler ordered it and it was not fully carried out. A document of the Norwegian Government says such an evacuation did take place in northern Norway and 30,000 houses were damaged. On 7 October 1941, Jodl signed an order that Hitler would not accept an offer of surrender of Leningrad or Moscow, but on the contrary he insisted that they be completely destroyed. He says this was done because the Germans were afraid those cities would be mined by the Russians as was Kiev. No surrender was ever offered.

His defense, in brief, is the doctrine of "superior orders," prohibited by Article 8 of the Charter as a defense. There is nothing in mitigation. Participation in such crimes as these has never been required of any soldier and he cannot now shield himself behind a mythical requirement of soldierly obedience at all costs as his excuse for commission of these crimes."

(The Avalon Project at the Yale Law School: Nuremberg Trial Proceedings Vol. 22 - Tuesday, 1 October 1946, pps. 567-70; http://www.yale.edu/lawweb/avalon/imt/proc/10-01-46.htm).}

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#8

Post by David Thompson » 09 May 2003, 21:08

In answer to your other questions:

(1) [a] Can anyone add anything more about the "Denazification courts"? What was its actual purpose?

There is an excellent treatment of this subject (in about 10 pages) at pp. 380-90 in chapter 21 of the official history "The US Army in the Occupation of Germany 1944-46," by Earl F. Ziemke, available on-line at:

http://www.army.mil/cmh-pg/books/wwii/O ... h21.htm#b1

The full text is available via the index at http://www.army.mil/cmh-pg/books/wwii/Occ-GY/

Were any more former German generals similarly exonerated, or further charged with more war crimes?

Yes. There were a large number of German general officers -- well over 100 -- charged with war crimes, or charged in denazification proceedings. Some were convicted, and executed or imprisoned. Others were acquitted or exonerated.

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#9

Post by xcalibur » 09 May 2003, 22:26

"The military verdicts discomfited professional soldiers in nations other than Germany who could imagine themselves in Keitel's, Jodl's, Donitz's, or Raeder's shoes. Keitel was foredoomed by his being Chief of Staff of the Wehrmacht. Bu Jodl, had he managed to escape the major war criminals list, would likely not have paid with his life in subsequent trials. In a later High Command case, six officers of equal or higher rank, though none so close to Hitler as Jodl, were convicted of the same offenses that had doomed him. Their sentences ranged from three years to life; and as the Allies began to commute sentences in the fifties, none of these men came close to serving a full term."

"A United Press reporter tracked down (after the verdicts) General Eisenhower at a castle in Ayrshire, Scotland. On the whole he was pleased by the verdicts, Ike said, although 'I was a little astonished they found it so easy to convict military men'.''


Source: Nuremberg, Joseph E. Persico

As to the question of whether or not Jodl's life was traded for Speer's, I have never seen anthing to suggest that. There was considerable debate about Speer's sentence, with Robert Jackson pushing for leniency (meaning acquital) and Francis Biddle and Ion Nikichenko pushing for the death penalty. Sir Geoffrey Lawrence also argued on Speer's behalf arguing that his refusal to allow scorched earth and his evidence of remorse deserved consideration.

This divisiveness is reflected in the wording of Speer's verdict: "Speer had no direct administrative responsibility for the program (slave labor)... he did not obtain administrative control over Sauckel...he was not directly concerned with the cruelty in the administration of the slave labor program... e carried out his opposition to Hitler's scorched earth program at considerable personal risk."

For better or for worse such was the thinking behind the verdict against Speer. Indeed the setencing of Speer to only 2 year is one of the more curious aspects of the trial. It's very interesting that the tribunal was curiously dismissive of some of the more nefarious exploits in his career such as his use of Russian POWs in armaments production which is a clear violation of the Geneva Conventions. Also, they seemed to equivocate on the issue of his use of concentration camp inmates, downplaying it thusly: "Speer attempted to use as few concentration camp workers as possible." Of course many of those thirty thousand were worked or starved to death. Getting back to the point of all this, I really don't see any linkage between the cases of Speer and Jodl apart fom the fact that they both seem to have received the wrong sentence; In Jodl's case too severe, and in Speer's too lenient.

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#10

Post by David Thompson » 09 May 2003, 22:36

xcalibur -- Weirdly enough, the Eisenhower interview Persico quoted from just got posted yesterday on the "Who is more responsible for waging aggressive war" thread at:

http://www.thirdreichforum.com/viewtopi ... 08&start=0

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#11

Post by xcalibur » 09 May 2003, 23:12

David Thompson wrote:xcalibur -- Weirdly enough, the Eisenhower interview Persico quoted from just got posted yesterday on the "Who is more responsible for waging aggressive war" thread at:

http://www.thirdreichforum.com/viewtopi ... 08&start=0
Thanks David. i hadn't read that thread yet. Interesting that the wording is a little different in the NYT article.

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#12

Post by Gareth Collins » 10 May 2003, 00:09

fanatic wrote:Thank you and I need some Jodl photos
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#13

Post by Gareth Collins » 10 May 2003, 00:16

Oh, my opinion, the fact that Jodl got tried and executed for Operational Planning is a disgrace. He should never have been executed. To execute him and leave Timoshenko and the ilk of Soviet military aggression in Finland and the Baltic States, nevermind the Americans in their atomic bomb nemesis brought a complete farce to the whole trial. It was war, ultimate steps were taken on both sides to kill as many of the opposing side with minimal loss of your own, and in all cases that included civilians, and in the Atomic bomb dropping, it included hundreds of thousands of them.

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