Equipment of the "4. SS-Polizei-Panzergrenadier-Division"?

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Equipment of the "4. SS-Polizei-Panzergrenadier-Division"?

#1

Post by Simperator » 09 Apr 2011, 23:16

Hi everyone!

My question is: we all know the SS-Polizei-Division had second-rate or non-standard equipment, such as Czech weapons, for example. In addition, it was usually used as anti-partisan and occupation force. In my opinion, this doesn't add with the "Panzergrenadier" status. Was this status later reflected in reality, with equipment such as Sd. Kfz. 251's and modern tanks? Has anybody got a equipment list? Thanks in advance!

Simon

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Re: Equipment of the "4. SS-Polizei-Panzergrenadier-Division

#2

Post by Martin Block » 10 Apr 2011, 12:33

Simon,

Although the build-up was slow, the 4. SS-Pol.Pz.Gren.Div. was for the most part equipped with German weaponry from the beginning as German records show.
Only a few Italian and even fewer Czech small arms and light guns were supplied.
By mid June 1944 the division was almost fully equipped and combat ready.
What the division really lacked was formation training above company sized level. This had been nearly impossible due to the many occupation and security tasks it had to perform so far, and that later in actual combat should cost the division dearly .
There also remained a serious shortage of fuel and vehicle spare part supplies.
The almost 14.000 available rifles and submachine guns included just about 200 of foreign, i.e. Czech and Italian, rifles.
The more than 1000 available machine guns and 100 medium mortars included just some 20 mortars of Italian origin.
Both SS-Pz.Gren.Rgt. 7 and 8 were fully motorized on trucks. An armored (SPW) battalion had never been authorized (nor had it been with any other SS-Pz.Gren.Div. after 1943).
SS-Pz.A.A. 4 had 3 companies on VW-Schwimmwagen and a heavy weapos company on trucks. Its armored recce company would never receive its authorized equipment but had accquired 2 or 3 Italian AB 40 for training purposes. In addition there was a battery with 7,5 cm Italian Flak guns, but I still doubt (or at least have no prove) the Italian equipment was taken along to the Eastern Front later.
SS-Pz.Abt. 4 had received 42 StuG IV during April 1944. Before that it had been using a good half dozen Italian L6 tanks and assault guns for trainig purposes. The Abteilung also had received 3 Sd.Kfz. 251/7 and 2 251/8. 3 Pz.Bef.Wg. IV followed during Aug. 1944.
SS-Pz.Jg.Abt. 4 was still to be formed and did not join the division until the early days of Dec 1944. It consisted of 2 companies with Jagdpz. IV and 1 company with towed 7,5 cm Pak 40.
SS-Art.Rgt. 4 was fully motorized and had 10 batteries with German 10 cm cannons, 10,5 cm and 15 cm howitzers.
SS-Flak-Abt. 4 had 3 motorized 8,8 cm and 1 3,7 cm Flak batteries. In addition there was a battery with 9,4 cm British Flak guns but I doubt it was taken along to the Eastern Front later.
SS-Pi.Btl. 4 had 3 motorized companies. SPW were neither authorized nor delivered.
SS-Nachr.Abt. 4 had 2 motorized companies.
SS-Felders.Btl. 4 had 3 companies equipped with a variety of light and heavy weapons for training replacements.
The divisional supply and support troops were all fully motorized.

The division suffered badly during its first months of combat on the Eastern Front and never fully recovered from that.
Replacements in armor consisted of
about 12 StuG III taken over from SS-Pz.Abt. 18 in Jan. 1944
12 new StuG III sent in early Feb 1945
10 new Pz. IV/70(V) sent in late Feb 1945
No armored recce cars, no APCs

Martin Block


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Re: Equipment of the "4. SS-Polizei-Panzergrenadier-Division

#3

Post by Simperator » 10 Apr 2011, 15:45

Thank you, Martin! So the equipment was far better than I expected. Very interesting!

Simon

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Re: Equipment of the "4. SS-Polizei-Panzergrenadier-Division

#4

Post by Charles Trang » 12 Apr 2011, 21:54

I disagree with you concerning the employment of the SS-Polizei-Division : it was a hard fighting division who spent more time on the front than at the rear ! When it was rebuilt as a Panzergrenadier-Division in Debica from the summer of 1943, a large body of the division still fought on the Leningrad front. A regimental combat group stayed in the Oranienbaum area till the end of December. In fact, the division only spent less than one year in Greece fighting partisans. In October 1944, it was sent in Hungary where it was involved in heavy combat against the Soviet forces once again before being transferred on the Pomeranian front. So, the division spent more than 3 years in the front line and about 11 months as an occupation force in Greece.

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Re: Equipment of the "4. SS-Polizei-Panzergrenadier-Division

#5

Post by Simperator » 12 Apr 2011, 22:09

So my question/thesis is answered: it WAS a real Pz Gren Division! Thanks.

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Re: Equipment of the "4. SS-Polizei-Panzergrenadier-Division

#6

Post by killerr » 23 Apr 2014, 12:12

Very informative thread, but leaves one question unanswered :

A lot of websites list as sub-units of this division, SS Pz. Abt. 4, equipped with StuG but also SS-StuG Abt. 4 !

So were there 2 Abt. equipped with StuG in this division ?

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Re: Equipment of the "4. SS-Polizei-Panzergrenadier-Division

#7

Post by Ironmachine » 23 Apr 2014, 14:05

Both abteilungen did not exist simultaneously. See:
Here's a short history of the W-SS StuG Abteilungen from the info that I have collected. Any corrections or additional information is welcome.
[...]
SS-StuG Abteilung 4 - formed late '43, only 1.Bttr. The Bttr. was sent to SS-SturmBrig Walloine, and lost all StuG. The Bttr. returned to the Abteilung which in the meantime became the SS-Pz.Abt.4
http://www.feldgrau.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=4680

Also:
The first armored vehicles used by SS-Pz.Abt. 4 (renamed from SS-Stu.Gesch.Abt. 4 in Feb 1944)[...]
http://www.network54.com/Forum/47207/th ... sion+tanks

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Re: Equipment of the "4. SS-Polizei-Panzergrenadier-Division

#8

Post by killerr » 23 Apr 2014, 23:52

Thanks a lot for the information.

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