Bernhard Siebken - 9 June 1944

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seaburn
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Re: Bernhard Siebken - 9 June 1944

#31

Post by seaburn » 30 Sep 2014, 21:58

krichter33 wrote: Is there any other evidence to back this up about Siebken, or is there any evidence to support his guilty verdict. He seems such a unique aberration from most of the other high ranking officers in the 12th SS, primarily, Mohnke, Kurt Meyer, and Bremer, that he is truly fascinating. If he truly was such a humane officer in such a horrible place, he should be praised. It also makes one wonder if he continued in this vein for the rest of his career. Finally one last question. If the two medical orderlies, Albers, and Bundschuh, were acquitted for following a superior's orders, why weren't Siebken (if he issued the order) and Schnabel acquitted for following Mohnke's orders?
Hi Krichter33, I've just received 'Hitler's last General' (Ian Sayer and Douglas Botting) from their telling of this event, it would seem that there was compelling evidence from 8 witnesses to believe that Mohnke had issued the orders but that this was not believed by the Court at the time. It appears that this line of defence may have come too late for the prosecution's liking.

Hubert Meyer was one of the witnesses for the defence and tellingly he maintained 40 years later (knowing Mohnke was still alive and free) that he believed Siebken's version of events and stuck by the evidence he had given in support back at the trial. It also seems that the Defences allegation that the Allies were killing German POWs and that these executions were in reprisal went against the defendants too as it only served to outrage the court. In fact the evidence given of the infamous Luxenburger/Clary incident, cut no ice with the Court either, the prosecutor stating that the story 'reminds you of a cinema more than a law court' (p213). The authors put a footnote in backing up this claim and others to indicate that German POWs were being executed at this time too. It seems strange that Kurt Meyer had his sentence commuted for this very reason yet these men were hanged some five years later.

Regarding Albers and Bundschuh the authors state ' Though they had clearly been the trigger men in the First Aid Post Killing, the court felt that as simple soldiers carrying out compelling orders they could not be held truly culpable of the crime. In the Court's view the same could not be said for Siebken and Schnabel. The Court clearly believed that the former had issued the order and that the latter had carried it out....'

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Re: Bernhard Siebken - 9 June 1944

#32

Post by rossmcpharter » 30 Sep 2014, 22:50

Hi Seaburn, I think that if Meyer had been tried by the British military in Germany, and Lord Russell, his sentence would not have been commuted. They were not as conciliatory as the Canadian Court.


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seaburn
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Re: Bernhard Siebken - 9 June 1944

#33

Post by seaburn » 30 Sep 2014, 22:59

rossmcpharter wrote:Hi Seaburn, I think that if Meyer had been tried by the British military in Germany, and Lord Russell, his sentence would not have been commuted. They were not as conciliatory as the Canadian Court.
Its an interesting observation 'RMP', the whole area of trial and retribution post war and comparing the different Allied responses would be worth analysing. Obviously I am familiar with the Canadians commuting KMs sentence and the Americans doing the same with the Malmedy defendants...... is there evidence that the British were harder on their convicted prisoners ?

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Re: Bernhard Siebken - 9 June 1944

#34

Post by krichter33 » 01 Oct 2014, 02:00

Thanks for the information Seaburn! It does seem a real tragedy that Seibken and Schnabel were executed, while Meyer's sentence was commuted...

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Re: Bernhard Siebken - 9 June 1944

#35

Post by seaburn » 08 Oct 2014, 21:58

The following are in relation to evidence given against Siebken for the murders of the POWs. The interrogations of the men mentioned are included in the following documents but they are all in German. If anyone has an interest in this incident and can read German, feel free to PM for copies of the testimony.
WO_311_691_0008[1].jpg
WO_311_691_0009[1].jpg



(both are from WO311/691-pp8/9 Hopefully they are legible, the copy itself is not great)

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Moniroth You-Bell
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Strm. Heinz Sorichta

#36

Post by Moniroth You-Bell » 09 Oct 2014, 04:47

Strm. Heinz Sorichta

B:1.1.25 Rybna,Silesia
KIA 6.8.44 grave:Marigny
Strm. Stb, II./SS-PGR.26 8.44

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seaburn
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Re: Bernhard Siebken - 9 June 1944

#37

Post by seaburn » 04 Feb 2015, 23:11

This is a link to some more evidence on Siebken's for those interested. The last posting deals in some part with the trial.

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic. ... 0&start=90

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seaburn
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Re: Bernhard Siebken - 9 June 1944

#38

Post by seaburn » 05 Feb 2015, 09:48

It has been suggested in the other thread that I have been unfair in my analyses of Mohnke's assumed culpability in relation to POW deaths in Normandy. I'd be interested in hearing if anyone else agrees with that assessment or not. If there is enough evidence to support a debate on this from two sides, it may be worth breaking it off into a thread of its own. I post this here as I know some don't look as often in the other section. Follow the link in my last post .

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