Infanterie-Sturm-Abzeichen doubt

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Ebusitanus
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Infanterie-Sturm-Abzeichen doubt

#1

Post by Ebusitanus » 17 Nov 2016, 12:41

Hello,
I was having a debate with some fellow wanna-be historians about my latest read of Werner Kindler´s book "Obedient unto death".
As some of you might know Kindler was part of the LSSAH division throughout the war and is mostly known through him earning the Close Combast clasp in gold. While part of the outfit from early on, he managed to miss most of the actual fighting till Barbarossa.

He won during that first year his Infantry assault badge.

Would this badge been the silver type or the bronze one.

The question arises as the LSSAH as a unit was considered a Motorized outfit at this time. Would such badges have been handed out based on the broad concept of the unit designation or on a individual basis? Meaning the last, say that while the unit is motorized, he would have still fought as infantry and therefore be considered pure infantry and get the silver type.

This whole debate is quite confusing. I have read up on the general merits one would have to cover in order to merit on type of the other but once you get into detail it is quite foggy.
Silver
The silver class was instituted on 20 December 1939 by the commander of the OKH, Walther von Brauchitsch, and was awarded to infantry soldiers according to one of the following criteria

To have taken part in at least three: infantry assaults (including counter-attacks) or at least three armed reconnaissance operations or engaged in hand-to-hand combat in an assault position or participated on three separate days in the restitution of combat positions.

Bronze
The bronze class was instituted on 1 June 1940. It was awarded to motorized/Mechanized Infantry troops according the same criteria as listed above
As a test to make it even more confusing, say you are part of the 1st company of the Panzergrenadier-Regiment 2 of the LSSAH in June 1944. Which type of medal would you get if you had as a soldier earned it (Three infantry assaults in three different days). Notice that now the unit is a Panzergrenadier-Regiment.

Thanks for any help here

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Ebusitanus
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Re: Infanterie-Sturm-Abzeichen doubt

#2

Post by Ebusitanus » 18 Nov 2016, 13:17

I had the feeling that this was not an easy subject to answer to. Personally, for all the time I had been interested in WW2 and specifically the german side of it, had I been aware of the complications of this badge. Always thought, in my ignorance, that the silver one was an "upgrade" over the bronze type. I have the feeling, after much asking around, that there is generally quite an information gap regarding this medal. Yes, we now all know the general wikipedia type of explanation but it is still a grey area.

I was reading up on this Werner Kindler persona and just found out that this assault badge was apparently the silver type. Being part of a motorized Brigade at the time he got it makes it even more confusing. Motorized troops should get the bronze type one would think acording to the common literature.


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Ebusitanus
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Re: Infanterie-Sturm-Abzeichen doubt

#3

Post by Ebusitanus » 22 Nov 2016, 11:38

Not a single taker? I must say I am quite surprised by this given the usual quality of the place :(

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Simon H
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Re: Infanterie-Sturm-Abzeichen doubt

#4

Post by Simon H » 22 Nov 2016, 12:56

Silver was for infantry, bronze was for motorised troops.
WW2 Battlefield Relics: German Erkennungsmarken Identification.

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Ebusitanus
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Re: Infanterie-Sturm-Abzeichen doubt

#5

Post by Ebusitanus » 22 Nov 2016, 15:26

Simon H wrote:Silver was for infantry, bronze was for motorised troops.
As said
I was reading up on this Werner Kindler persona and just found out that his assault badge was apparently the silver type. Being part of a motorized Brigade at the time he got it makes it even more confusing. Motorized troops should get the bronze type one would think acording to the common literature.
I do not think this common appropach is as correct as we asume.

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stewy
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Re: Infanterie-Sturm-Abzeichen doubt

#6

Post by stewy » 22 Nov 2016, 17:42

All the bronze ISA docs I've seen or own are to Pz. Grenadier regiments. Stewy

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