Let's build Panzer-Division "Müncheberg" !

Discussions on all (non-biographical) aspects of the Freikorps, Reichswehr, Austrian Bundesheer, Heer, Waffen-SS, Volkssturm and Fallschirmjäger and the other Luftwaffe ground forces. Hosted by Christoph Awender.
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Andy H
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#151

Post by Andy H » 01 Dec 2002, 00:16

Hi David

How's the Munchenburg thesis coming along?

:D Andy from the Shire

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David C. Clarke
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#152

Post by David C. Clarke » 01 Dec 2002, 04:23

Muncheberg! Ah Andy, it's slower than paint peeling. There's an awful lot of stuff. Also, I really need someone to translate the pertinent parts of Tieke "Das Ende Zwischen Oder und Elbe". I know there's good material in that book. Anyway, you guys keep reminding me and we'll see.....
Very Best Regards, David :)


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Andy H
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#153

Post by Andy H » 01 Dec 2002, 13:09

Like an itch that just won't stop itching :wink:

:D Andy from the Shire

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Daniel L
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#154

Post by Daniel L » 14 Dec 2002, 22:08

Panzer-Brigade 103

Formed 26.7.44 in Wehrkreis XIII, with:

Panzer-Abteilung 2103 (4 coys.) from Panzer-Abteilung Norwegen
Panzer-Grenadier-Bataillon 2103 (3 coys)
In 11.44 the Brigade left East Prussia, the Pz.Gren.Btl. was disbanded and the Pz.Abt. went to Bielefeld, and on 17.12.44 became I./Panzer-Regiment 39 (17. Pz. Div.), this transition was completed 20.1.45.

The Brigade Stab went to 19th Armee (Oberrhein) on 26.11.44, was at Truppenübungsplatz Grafenwöhr on 11.1.45, and on 26.1.45 went to Schlesien for front-line service.On 8.3.45 the Stab became Stab/Pz.Div. Müncheberg

Schematische Kriegsgliederung:

8.44 Reserve 3. Pz. Armee Mitte Lithuania
9.44 - 10.44 Reserve 4. Armee Mitte East Prussia
11.44 Reserve 3. Pz. Armee Mitte East Prussia
2.45 - 3.45 (Stab) LVII 17. Armee Mitte Schlesien

Replacement troops were provided by Panzer-Ersatz-Abteilung 35 in Bamberg

http://www.feldgrau.com/ipb2.html
And for the sake of keeping things in order: http://www.feldgrau.com/heermp.html

best regards/ daniel

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Daniel L
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#155

Post by Daniel L » 07 Jan 2003, 16:18

14 April attack to increase Kustrin bridgehead. On 15 April at 15.30 LVI Panzer Corps took over 9 FJD, 20 Panzergrenadier Division and Müncheberg Panzer Division. 9FJD’s 25th FJ Regt near Letschin, 26th Regiment west of Zechin and 27th Regiment either side of Gusow. On the eve of the great attack, the artillery ammunition reserves were so low that all available trucks were sent back to Müncheberg to fetch more shells, but at the depot there were only 75mm shells, which were useless to most batteries. ‘Six rounds per day per gun’.

...

Colonel Refior, who had been Reymann’s chief of staff, was extremely pleased to find Weidling as his new commander, and he briefed him on the latest situation with the Lagekarte – the situation map. This showed the Red Army advance into Pankow and Tegel, and the Schlesischen Bahnhof and Friedrichshain. Weidling had no illusions that in the face of Soviet strength, resistance could not be maintained for long. Most of his own formations had been severely damaged in the Oder front battle. The 9th Parachute Division, now under a new commander, had not recovered from its mauling. The Müncheberg Panzer Division was reduced to remnants, and although the 20th Panzergrenadier Division was in better shape, its commander, Major General Scholz had committed suicide shortly after entering Berlin. Only the SS ‘Nordland’ Division under SS-Brigadeführer Ziegler and the 18th Panzergrenadier Division remained in a relatively battleworthy condition. Weidling decided to hold back the 18th Panzergrenadier Division in reserve for counter-attack. The others were distributed around the different defence sectors to act as ‘Korsettstangen’ ‘corset-stiffeners’. Refior and Colonel von Dufving, the LVI Panzer Corps chief of staff, immediately went to work allocating units.

http://www.antonybeevor.com/Berlin/berlincutsthree.htm
regards

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Daniel L
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#156

Post by Daniel L » 07 Jan 2003, 16:19

Image
Tiger at the Gate, Berlin 30th April 1945 by David Pentland
A Tiger I and PAK 40 anti tank gun of the "Müncheberg" Division, field a final defence of the capital in front of the Brandenburg Gate under the shattered remains of the famous Linden trees. The under-strength division had just been formed the previous month from a mixture of ad hoc units and various marks of tank. Despite this it put up a spirited fight until its final destruction in early May.

http://www.panzer-prints.com/tiger_tank.htm
regards

Werderwayne
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Tiger from Müncheberg

#157

Post by Werderwayne » 07 Feb 2003, 23:28

Is the number on that Tiger "214"? If so, oops. :D

The Tiger company was the 3rd company.

-WW

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Daniel L
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#158

Post by Daniel L » 08 Feb 2003, 00:34

Hehe. It's called artistic freedom. :D

Best regards/ Daniel

Werderwayne
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#159

Post by Werderwayne » 08 Feb 2003, 00:41

"Two"s look better than "three"s anyway! If I were paying 4400 pounds for the painting, I'd want it to look as good as possible. :D

-WW

Luke
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First Person account

#160

Post by Luke » 20 Feb 2003, 14:26

I have just had a long discussion with my Grandfather, Dietrich Durdis, about his experiences with Division Muncheberg. I will try to relate as much as possible of what he told me.
Opa was about 17 or 18 when he was in Muncheberg. Originally he was in Division “Herman Goering” and had then been a part of a unit (I don’t know which type) called “Gross Deutschland” in which he guarded bunkers in Berlin for a week at a time. When Panzer Division Muncheberg was formed, he volunteered.
He remembers being sent to Trebnitz at one point, but at the end of he war he was stationed at Golzow. He remembers that the Tiger tanks of the division were left behind at another town, while the infantry was sent forward to Golzow. He remembers that he was stationed at a farmhouse near Golzow in trenches with about 10 other men, the rest of the infantry having probably moved into the town.
He was a first machine gunner with the panzer grenadiers, which meant he carried the machine gun itself, while number two carried the frame in which it stood and three and four carried the ammunition. He remembers being ordered to go to the end of the trenches and retrieve the gun’s frame to bring it to a new position in the trenches. The second machine gunner had arthritis, so the frame had been left behind.
The Russian T34 tanks (as he remembers) moved on their position, with Russian infantry behind. The tanks moved past, but the Russian infantry stayed and called for the German soldiers to surrender. They had shot about three German soldiers when Opa turned to the man next him and suggested that they make a run for it. Opa removed his ammunition belts, which were across his shoulders and dropped his gun, keeping only a pistol. Both men headed towards the railway line. When they came to the wooden paling fence that was there to protect the rail line from the build up of snow (?), Opa’s companion decided to stop and hide in a culvert. Opa went through an opening in the fence and crossed the line, heading for Golzow. After a short time, he saw the Russian tanks coming and he lay down on the ground. The Russian tanks and infantry passed him, the machine gunners carrying their big guns, two men to a gun. A tank passed Opa about two and half metres away. The Russians thought he was dead, laying there on the ground.
Once they had passed, Opa stood up to start running again, but he didn’t know that the Russians were still all around him in trenches. As soon as he got up he heard Russian voices calling for him to stop. He kept running and he was shot in the hip. The bullet went through, but he went down. A Russian soldier kicked him in the behind, took his pistol and he was captured.
He was taken to a Milk Factory in Golzow, where at some point a Russian soldier asked him for his watch and took it from him. A Russian officer asked him which unit he was in and what the positions of the other German soldiers were. He replied with only his name (they weren’t interested in his name) and the honest answer that he didn’t know what the other German soldiers were doing or where they were. The officer explained to him that, because Opa had run when he had been told to stop and because he was carrying a pistol, he would have to shoot him. Opa though he was joking! The officer took out his pistol and aimed at Opa’s head. Opa watched the man’s finger slowly drawing back on the trigger. He was frightened, but he watched that trigger. Instinctively, just as he thought the trigger might be almost home, he turned away. The bullet whizzed past his head and he fell to the ground, his hands to his head. The Russian fired at his head again, and hit Opa’s raised left hand. Blood spurted all over his head. To the Russian, it must have looked like the bullet had gone into Opa’s skull. He kicked Opa, stepped over him and walked away. For the second time, a Russian had thought him dead. At no point did Opa lose consciousness. He got up, but was still in an occupied Russian position. He approached an older looking Russian soldier and explained that his hand was “Kaput”. The soldier gave him a bandage and told him to “Go”. Opa returned to the farm house, and found the Russian soldiers there were using longs spikes to find the mead and preserves that the farmers had hidden under manure that had been flattened to look like flat ground. They used the spikes to listen for hollow sounds beneath the ground. The German soldiers had looked earlier but had found nothing. Opa remembers that the Russians at the farmhouse were fairly friendly. There were other wounded German soldiers in the farmhouse and the Russians shared the farmers’ food with them.
Later, they were marched to another town down the rail line. Eight German soldiers, guarded by one Russian. They walked about 7 or eight kilometers along the railway line, but Opa can’t remember to what town. His hip wound was becoming swollen, but as he walked, the swelling went down. At one point, Opa asked to go to the toilet, and he was able to use a sit down toilet somewhere. Because his hip was hurting, he took longer than the soldier expected and the door was pushed in as Opa was about to come out. Other than that, the Russian soldier was fairly blasé. When they got to the town, Opa saw the soldier who had taken his watch. The man pointed to himself and said “Kaput” to indicate that the watch was now gone or broken.
They were taken from one town to another, and eventually ended up in Posen in Poland. Opa’s wounded left hand was badly infected and the Russian doctors discussed amputation. A German doctor who was there said no, and explained that they would cut the wound open and drain the pus by stuffing it with gauze. Opa still has his hand, although it is slightly disfigured, with the little finger and the knuckle of his index finger sticking out at odd angles.
Finally after a long time, Opa and others were taken back into Russian occupied Germany and set free.
Hope this is helpful.
Regards,
Luke Hodgson.

Luke
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The results of this forum

#161

Post by Luke » 20 Feb 2003, 14:44

David, I am unable to follow much of the material on this forum. Knowing nothing about military divisions or units, I feel a bit like a fish out of water.
My Grandafather is coming over this weekend and we will try to put together an oral history on a tape of his experiences. I could arrange for you to get a copy if you wish. Are there any questions that you would like me to ask? He is unable to remember any names of his fellow soldiers. He was hoping that I could find a list of the members of Muncheberg so that he might recognise some names.
I have received some questions from Daniel for him. Is Daniel still a member of this forum?

Also, what will be the end of result of your research? Will you be writing a thesis paper? If so, will you be making copies available? Opa would greatly benefit from being able to read such a record.

Regards,
Luke Hodgson

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Daniel L
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#162

Post by Daniel L » 20 Feb 2003, 15:12

I'm right here Luke! Welcome to the forum and thanks for your mail, I've sent you a reply. David has put me in charge of the Müncheberg project. The idea of the project is first and foremost that it will end up in an article but as it has developed I see the potential of making something bigger of it as well.

Best regards/ Daniel

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Javichu
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Maybe another Münchemberg vehicle?

#163

Post by Javichu » 22 Feb 2003, 21:06

Attachments
234-4Berlín3.jpg
234-4Berlín3.jpg (50.5 KiB) Viewed 3134 times

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Daniel L
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#164

Post by Daniel L » 22 Feb 2003, 22:15

Yes, that is most probable one of the recon batallion's vehicles. I have two other photos of it on my computer. Thanks for sharing!

Best regards/ Daniel

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Javichu
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Could you share these photos with me/us,please?

#165

Post by Javichu » 23 Feb 2003, 16:07

I´m really obsessed with 234 series and particularly 234/4 and any new pic would be a treasure for me...Thanks in advance.
FJCabeza

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