Diference between a cossack and northcaucasian
Diference between a cossack and northcaucasian
Hi,
A question that I have had a long time in the mind. What was a difference between a cossack and a northcaucasian (Bergkaukasien) or caucasian volunteer? AFAK cossacks and georgians were christian faith, meanwhile northcaucasian (chechens, ossets, kabardians etc) were muslims. Cossacks came from Don, Kuban, Terek, Siberia etc. Both wore similar kind of fur cap; cossacks mostly wearing some kind of insignia on it, meanwhile northcaucasians not. To make it more complicated georgian volunteer used very similar dress than cossacks, with cartridges on the chest and the kindjal dagger, but noway they were cossacks. Just looking a photo, without seeing any national shield/insignia, is it possible to see from where the volunteer came from? A cossack, a caucasian or georgian.
Thanks
Arto
Cossacks or not cossacks:
A question that I have had a long time in the mind. What was a difference between a cossack and a northcaucasian (Bergkaukasien) or caucasian volunteer? AFAK cossacks and georgians were christian faith, meanwhile northcaucasian (chechens, ossets, kabardians etc) were muslims. Cossacks came from Don, Kuban, Terek, Siberia etc. Both wore similar kind of fur cap; cossacks mostly wearing some kind of insignia on it, meanwhile northcaucasians not. To make it more complicated georgian volunteer used very similar dress than cossacks, with cartridges on the chest and the kindjal dagger, but noway they were cossacks. Just looking a photo, without seeing any national shield/insignia, is it possible to see from where the volunteer came from? A cossack, a caucasian or georgian.
Thanks
Arto
Cossacks or not cossacks:
Re: Diference between a cossack and northcaucasian
It's always going to be a guess to some extent as you belong to one group or another mostly by birth, not by how you dress.Just looking a photo, without seeing any national shield/insignia, is it possible to see from where the volunteer came from? A cossack, a caucasian or georgian.
You would expect a Cossack to have a cherkesska, beshmet and a fleece hat. But is it always a case? Does it mean the others can't have it? No.
Now your photo. Although it's from Bundesarchiv and they are labelled as Cossacks, I have my doubts.
You probably noticed that too - if what I see on the left banner is a crescent with a large star (or several smaller stars) - odds of them being Cossacks are coming down...
Re: Diference between a cossack and northcaucasian
Both cherkesska and Kuban cap were elements of Caucasian native dress borrowed by Kuban and Terek cossacks. Other cossacks uniform looked completely different:Arto O wrote:Cossacks came from Don, Kuban, Terek, Siberia etc. Both wore similar kind of fur cap; cossacks mostly wearing some kind of insignia on it, meanwhile northcaucasians not.
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Re: Diference between a cossack and northcaucasian
As I understand it, the Cossacks were essentially Slavs, with some other elements added. The North Caucasians were non-Slavs.
Hugh Seaton-Watson wrote an article on their history. If I recall correctly, he reckoned they were in serious decline by WWII and a lot of non-Cossacks with similar life styles were being included under the umbrella term "Cossack".
Certainly the supposed "Cossack" units in Eastern Ukraine have performed poorly in the recent fighting. They seem to be largely uniforms and posturing nowadays.
Cheers,
Sid.
Hugh Seaton-Watson wrote an article on their history. If I recall correctly, he reckoned they were in serious decline by WWII and a lot of non-Cossacks with similar life styles were being included under the umbrella term "Cossack".
Certainly the supposed "Cossack" units in Eastern Ukraine have performed poorly in the recent fighting. They seem to be largely uniforms and posturing nowadays.
Cheers,
Sid.
Re: Diference between a cossack and northcaucasian
Thanks GregSingh, Art and Sid,
for your information. Art wrote:Both cherkesska and Kuban cap were elements of Caucasian native dress borrowed by Kuban and Terek cossacks. Other cossacks uniform looked completely different:
Very interesting. I never thought on that. I started to observe different photos, but it is hard to say nothing as in cherkesska wasn´t worn any national shield. Observing some drawings of Don cossacks during centuries, they seemed to wear more "russian style" uniforms.
Arto
for your information. Art wrote:Both cherkesska and Kuban cap were elements of Caucasian native dress borrowed by Kuban and Terek cossacks. Other cossacks uniform looked completely different:
Very interesting. I never thought on that. I started to observe different photos, but it is hard to say nothing as in cherkesska wasn´t worn any national shield. Observing some drawings of Don cossacks during centuries, they seemed to wear more "russian style" uniforms.
Arto
Re: Diference between a cossack and northcaucasian
sometimes it wears on cherkeska in Cossack division. Parade cherkeska was from colour cloth and wear with colour schoulder boards. In this case national schield wasn't wearsArto O wrote: I started to observe different photos, but it is hard to say nothing as in cherkesska wasn´t worn any national shield.
Arto
Re: Diference between a cossack and northcaucasian
Thanks Semenov,
Did you mean that the colour on shoulder boards indicated the nationality of the cossack, when he was wearing cherkeska? Like red for Kuban, black for Terek etc. Do you maybe know these colours. That would interesting.
with best regards
Arto
Did you mean that the colour on shoulder boards indicated the nationality of the cossack, when he was wearing cherkeska? Like red for Kuban, black for Terek etc. Do you maybe know these colours. That would interesting.
with best regards
Arto
Re: Diference between a cossack and northcaucasian
Yes, it is.Arto O wrote:Thanks Semenov,
Did you mean that the colour on shoulder boards indicated the nationality of the cossack, when he was wearing cherkeska? Like red for Kuban, black for Terek etc. Do you maybe know these colours. That would interesting.
with best regards
Arto
From D. Littlejohn Foreign Legions of the Third Reich. Vol. 4.
Re: Diference between a cossack and northcaucasian
Thanks a lot again Semenov
Arto
Arto