Probably most of the guys know the case. Kaminski was a commander of a Russian unit which cooperated with the Germans. They fought Soviet partisants in USSR and later Polish underground. In 1944 I believe Kaminski's unit became a part of SS and Kaminski himself was appointed a general of the SS. In August 1944 Kaminski was suddenly arrested and after a short and misterious trial sentenced to death by hanging.
There is a lot of a mystery around that person. Official statements say that Kaminski was executed for the atrocities committted by his men in Warsaw. But there is also a stark different version. I've heard some time ago that the Germans dicovered that Kaminski was a Soviet agent and this was the real reason. Well, a general being a Soviet agent would be a hell of a shame for the SS.
I believe that the case of Kaminski's unit is the only example of the Soviet citizens organising themselves in order to fight Stalin. Wlasow's army and Hilfwilliges is a diffirent case I think (those were usually manned by POWs who were counting on better treatment; Kaminski's unit was a sort of very well equiped, volountary militia). Anyway I think that nothing of that sort happened in the other parts of Russia. So maybe it was some NKWD operation? Kaminski cooperated with the Polish intelligence before the war and was caught by the Soviets. He had some experience in working for the intelligence so he was a proper man to participate in this sort of operation (bearing in mind that he woudn't betray Soviets once again).
Several years ago it was revealed that Vladimir Putin's father might have been an officer in the Kaminski's unit. I saw two pictures of that man (the guy suspected to be Putin's father). He looked nearly the same. It can hardly be a coincidence (I can't find those pictures at the moment but perhaps somebody else has it). For whole I know Putin's father worked for the Soviet intelligence during the war. Maybe he was doing it within the ranks of Kaminski's unit?
I'll write it: I believe that Kaminski's unit was created by NKWD, manned by NKWD agents and equipped by NKWD. This is my theory.
Brigadeführer Kaminski and his SS unit.
My mistake: he was a Brigadeführer.
Kaminski is second from the right I think.
The following is the famous picture from Warsaw 1944. The guy on the left is said to be Putin's father. The caption on the picture was suggesting that according to the researcher (Wiktor Suworow if I'm correct).
This is said to be Kaminski's men in Warsaw August 1944.
Kaminski is second from the right I think.
The following is the famous picture from Warsaw 1944. The guy on the left is said to be Putin's father. The caption on the picture was suggesting that according to the researcher (Wiktor Suworow if I'm correct).
This is said to be Kaminski's men in Warsaw August 1944.
Re: Brigadeführer Kaminski and his SS unit.
Your theory to sew white a thread.Cyprek wrote:Probably most of the guys know the case. Kaminski was a commander of a Russian unit which cooperated with the Germans. They fought Soviet partisants in USSR and later Polish underground. In 1944 I believe Kaminski's unit became a part of SS and Kaminski himself was appointed a general of the SS. In August 1944 Kaminski was suddenly arrested and after a short and misterious trial sentenced to death by hanging.
There is a lot of a mystery around that person. Official statements say that Kaminski was executed for the atrocities committted by his men in Warsaw. But there is also a stark different version. I've heard some time ago that the Germans dicovered that Kaminski was a Soviet agent and this was the real reason. Well, a general being a Soviet agent would be a hell of a shame for the SS.
I believe that the case of Kaminski's unit is the only example of the Soviet citizens organising themselves in order to fight Stalin. Wlasow's army and Hilfwilliges is a diffirent case I think (those were usually manned by POWs who were counting on better treatment; Kaminski's unit was a sort of very well equiped, volountary militia). Anyway I think that nothing of that sort happened in the other parts of Russia. So maybe it was some NKWD operation? Kaminski cooperated with the Polish intelligence before the war and was caught by the Soviets. He had some experience in working for the intelligence so he was a proper man to participate in this sort of operation (bearing in mind that he woudn't betray Soviets once again).
Several years ago it was revealed that Vladimir Putin's father might have been an officer in the Kaminski's unit. I saw two pictures of that man (the guy suspected to be Putin's father). He looked nearly the same. It can hardly be a coincidence (I can't find those pictures at the moment but perhaps somebody else has it). For whole I know Putin's father worked for the Soviet intelligence during the war. Maybe he was doing it within the ranks of Kaminski's unit?
I'll write it: I believe that Kaminski's unit was created by NKWD, manned by NKWD agents and equipped by NKWD. This is my theory.
Actually Kaminsky was the Pole.
He was the illegitimate son of marshal Pilsudsky.
Before death old marshal Pilsudsky has directed the illegitimate son to Russia with especially confidential mission.
Kaminsky should live in Russia silently until to Russia Germans will not come.
After arrival to Russia Germans Kaminsky should enlist on service to Germans of the father of the future president of Russia of V. Putin.
It was necessary Pilsudsky that the member of Axis History Forum Cyprek could cook up such nonsense which we here now read.
udachi / Good luck!
Yuri
What concurrence!Cyprek wrote:Actually I'm not a Pilsudsky fan. He was a socialist (thanks to him Poland had the mos interventionist economy after Soviet Union). He cooperated with the German, Austrian and Japanese intelligence... But he was good at diplomacy.
And I am not the supporter of president Vladimir Putin!
/
udachi / Good luck!
Yuri
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Marc Rikmenspoel
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The NKVD and its successor KGB had its agents everwhere, and in far more places than was suspected at the time. They obviously had an agent (or several) in the OKW and OKH highest levels, who passed along information via the "Lucy" spy ring in Switzerand. And Richard Sorge in the German Embassy in Tokyo was a Soviet agent. Moving away from Germany, Kim Philby and his associates were working for the KGB when they ran British Military Intelligence in the 1950's. In light of these things, it isn't too unreasonable to suppose that Bronislav Kaminski was also working for the NKVD, trying to create anti-German feelings in the Soviet populace through policies carried out while in supposed German service (FWIW, there's a possibility that Gauleiter Erich Koch was also a Soviet agent, who carried out such policies on a larger scale). I don't know the truth of the matter with Kaminski (or Koch), but the cases of the Lucy ring, Sorge and Philby are established, and show how deeply the agents of the USSR penetrated the workings of other nations.
Yep, anti - German feelings in the Russian society - good point. A German historian Jürgen Thorwald asserted that if the Germans had had better attitude to the Soviet citizens they probably would have won the war. I tend to agree with him (suffices to say that in one archival movie I saw Russian clerics blessing German soldiers).The NKVD and its successor KGB had its agents everwhere, and in far more places than was suspected at the time. They obviously had an agent (or several) in the OKW and OKH highest levels, who passed along information via the "Lucy" spy ring in Switzerand. And Richard Sorge in the German Embassy in Tokyo was a Soviet agent. Moving away from Germany, Kim Philby and his associates were working for the KGB when they ran British Military Intelligence in the 1950's. In light of these things, it isn't too unreasonable to suppose that Bronislav Kaminski was also working for the NKVD, trying to create anti-German feelings in the Soviet populace through policies carried out while in supposed German service (FWIW, there's a possibility that Gauleiter Erich Koch was also a Soviet agent, who carried out such policies on a larger scale). I don't know the truth of the matter with Kaminski (or Koch), but the cases of the Lucy ring, Sorge and Philby are established, and show how deeply the agents of the USSR penetrated the workings of other nations.
Not much can be said about the circumstances of Kaminski's death but the known facts are very strange and seem to back the theory about his cooperation with the Soviet intelligence. According to the German archives Kaminski was killed in action in October 1944 (no details mentioned). This wasn't confirmed by high ranking Waffen SS officers. From SS-Obergruppenführer von dem Bach - Zelewski's memoirs one can learn (as I wrote before) that Kaminski was sentenced to death by a courtmartial and executed on 28th August. Von dem Bach - Zelewski confirmed this version of events when he was interrogated by a Polish prosecutor in 1946. Another high ranking Waffen SS officer (I don't remember the name) agrees that Kaminski was executed but he doesn't give a specific date. He asserts that it was between 12th and 20th August.
I can't think of any reasonable couse for which von dem Bach could have been lying. Bearing in mind that he was telling the truth, why is Kaminski mentioned in an official report as a KIA??? For me it looks like they wanted to conceal something. Maybe the fact of Kaminski's cooperation with the Soviet intelligence...
One is clear. If Victor Suworow is right and the man in the picture from Warsaw is Putin's father, then it is clear that he was a NKVD agent. For whole I know Liutenant Vladimir Putin worked in NKVD and later KGB after the war. I can't imagine a situation when a traitor who cooperated with the enemy is returned to the service in NKVD (!) and doesn't face any consequences. If the man in the picture is indeed Vladimir Putin's father, then he must have been NKVD's spy within the ranks of Kaminski's brigade. If so the question is: was he the only one...
More shots from Warsaw 1944. The guy with the moustache is said to be Liutenant Michalczewski and the other guy with a cossack cap Major Frolow, RONA's chief of staff.
This tank-trooper is a very mysterious person. In the first picture one can see shield on the left sleeve of tankist's uniform. This kind of shields was used by Wlasow's army (ROA). Kaminski's men used shields signed "POHA" (not "POA" which was reserved for the Wlasow's ROA) with a black cross (similar to the iron cross) on a white background. On the other hand no
ROA units were involved in the fighting in Warsaw. There was one cossack regiment and an independent cossack battalion and some other units manned by the former citizens of the USSR. For whole I know none of those units used ROA shield.
I've learned that in a short time after the breakout of the uprising 4 T-34 and 1 Su-76 were attached to RONA. Was that just a delivery of some vehicles or an attachment of some tank platoon? If so maybe this platoon was manned by ROA? One can be said for sure: Sturmbrigade "Kaminski" was probably the most weirdly uniformed unit in the entire German army.
Anyway the man suspected of being Major Frolow is indeed a Major and the other one suspected of being Liutenant Michalczewski is indeed a Liutenant. My book says that Russian, Ukrainian and Cossack formations used this kind of rank system.
If the guy in the picture is Frolow then in must have been made on 21 August or earlier as Frolow was killed on that day.
But they also may be Cossacks (especially if the information about the pictures' captions is false).
One Polish hobbyst has figured out that the Cossack units fighting in the vicinity of Warsaw and in the city itself were: IV.(Kosaken)/Sicherungs Regiment 57, Kosaken Abteilung 69, Kosaken Schutzmannschafts Btl. 209 and Kosaken Btl. 572.
Below are some photos from Brigadefuhrer Reinefahrt's visit to some Cossack unit (or RONA???). BTW: Reinefahrt is famous for saying "I have more POWs than ammunition to shoot them!". In the pictures one can see that Mr Brigadefuhrer was a good fellow.
Isn't the guy on the left my candidate for Major Frolow (picture above)?
And here is another picture of our panzerace reading some Dostojewski to an assault gun crewman.
One Polish researcher asserts that the Stug belonged to 200. Sturmgeschutz - Ersatz - Abteilung.
This tank-trooper is a very mysterious person. In the first picture one can see shield on the left sleeve of tankist's uniform. This kind of shields was used by Wlasow's army (ROA). Kaminski's men used shields signed "POHA" (not "POA" which was reserved for the Wlasow's ROA) with a black cross (similar to the iron cross) on a white background. On the other hand no
ROA units were involved in the fighting in Warsaw. There was one cossack regiment and an independent cossack battalion and some other units manned by the former citizens of the USSR. For whole I know none of those units used ROA shield.
I've learned that in a short time after the breakout of the uprising 4 T-34 and 1 Su-76 were attached to RONA. Was that just a delivery of some vehicles or an attachment of some tank platoon? If so maybe this platoon was manned by ROA? One can be said for sure: Sturmbrigade "Kaminski" was probably the most weirdly uniformed unit in the entire German army.
Anyway the man suspected of being Major Frolow is indeed a Major and the other one suspected of being Liutenant Michalczewski is indeed a Liutenant. My book says that Russian, Ukrainian and Cossack formations used this kind of rank system.
If the guy in the picture is Frolow then in must have been made on 21 August or earlier as Frolow was killed on that day.
But they also may be Cossacks (especially if the information about the pictures' captions is false).
One Polish hobbyst has figured out that the Cossack units fighting in the vicinity of Warsaw and in the city itself were: IV.(Kosaken)/Sicherungs Regiment 57, Kosaken Abteilung 69, Kosaken Schutzmannschafts Btl. 209 and Kosaken Btl. 572.
Below are some photos from Brigadefuhrer Reinefahrt's visit to some Cossack unit (or RONA???). BTW: Reinefahrt is famous for saying "I have more POWs than ammunition to shoot them!". In the pictures one can see that Mr Brigadefuhrer was a good fellow.
Isn't the guy on the left my candidate for Major Frolow (picture above)?
And here is another picture of our panzerace reading some Dostojewski to an assault gun crewman.
One Polish researcher asserts that the Stug belonged to 200. Sturmgeschutz - Ersatz - Abteilung.
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Musashi
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Re: Brigadeführer Kaminski and his SS unit.
He was a Pole in half. Nothing more nothing less.Yuri wrote: Actually Kaminsky was the Pole.
I hear it for the first time. Your sources are...?Yuri wrote: He was the illegitimate son of marshal Pilsudsky.
He was joking.Yuri wrote:
Actually Kaminsky was the Pole.
He was a Pole in half. Nothing more nothing less.
Yuri wrote:
He was the illegitimate son of marshal Pilsudsky.
I hear it for the first time. Your sources are...?
Kaminski's father was Polish. His mother was German. Von dem Bach said that there was no other nation that he hated as much as Poles.
One Polish mate told me that Mr Suworow denies that he had anything to do with the pictures of that bunch in Warsaw (Mr Suworow personally assured him about that).
To tell the truth not much can be said about where those pictures come from (let alone the captions). At this point I'm 100% sure that they aren't RONA soldiers but Cossacks and I'm 99% sure that the soldier from the pictures has nothing to do with Vladimir Putin's father.
But perhaps there is one clue that will allow identifying the unit. As I wrote before one of the Cossacks (on the first picture from Reiniefahrt's visit) is very similar to the so called "Major Frolow". I'm nearly 100% sure that it is the same officer.
If this is truth then the unit is indentified as the pictures with Reinefahrt were taken in Colonel Bondarenko's 3rd Cossack Regiment.
To tell the truth not much can be said about where those pictures come from (let alone the captions). At this point I'm 100% sure that they aren't RONA soldiers but Cossacks and I'm 99% sure that the soldier from the pictures has nothing to do with Vladimir Putin's father.
But perhaps there is one clue that will allow identifying the unit. As I wrote before one of the Cossacks (on the first picture from Reiniefahrt's visit) is very similar to the so called "Major Frolow". I'm nearly 100% sure that it is the same officer.
If this is truth then the unit is indentified as the pictures with Reinefahrt were taken in Colonel Bondarenko's 3rd Cossack Regiment.
Re
Kaminski was former NKWD agent. In 1930-1935 in my country years everyone the second was the agent NKWD, he was recruted in time his arest. After that he was strong ANTICOMMUNIST.
Cossacs from foto were from one Kos.Rg. from Kazachyi Stan (Rgt. Bondarenko and this oficer prorably he is).
Cossacs from foto were from one Kos.Rg. from Kazachyi Stan (Rgt. Bondarenko and this oficer prorably he is).
Cyprek wrote: The following is the famous picture from Warsaw 1944. The guy on the left is said to be Putin's father. The caption on the picture was suggesting that according to the researcher (Wiktor Suworow if I'm correct).
THIS IS NONSENSE. It prepared by Polish journalist Jozef Szaniawski who sourced by Polish colonel Kuklinski. Szaniawski discovered photo of "gradpa" Mr. Putin at very similar method to Tolkienian Sméagol.
Please facts not false.
Orlov