Charlemagne in Berlin

Discussions on the foreigners (volunteers as well as conscripts) fighting in the German Wehrmacht, those collaborating with the Axis and other period Far Right organizations. Hosted by George Lepre.
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sandeepmukherjee196
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Re: Charlemagne in Berlin

#46

Post by sandeepmukherjee196 » 23 Nov 2014, 12:01

images.stadtmitte.jpg
images.stadtmitte.jpg (8.8 KiB) Viewed 1661 times
Ref: www.thephora.net...... I believe this is Stadmitte Station ( after it was all over), the last HQ of Krukenberg and the locale of his last address to the Charlemagne men.

Sid Guttridge
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Re: Charlemagne in Berlin

#47

Post by Sid Guttridge » 23 Nov 2014, 18:02

Hi Guys,

So, still no hard evidence that these supposed awards are genuine, then.

And, even if they were, plenty of evidence that severe medal-inflation took place in Berlin in late April 1945.

Either way, they are severely devalued.

Cheers,

Sid.


Michael Kenny
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Re: Charlemagne in Berlin

#48

Post by Michael Kenny » 23 Nov 2014, 18:27

SS WET DREAM FANTASY.jpg
sandeepmukherjee196 wrote: ref :

The Charlemagne in action against Russian tanks in Berlin..Apocalypse Yesterday ! :)



Where in the Berlin fighting would you see German soldiers carrying back-packs & mess tins?

sandeepmukherjee196
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Re: Charlemagne in Berlin

#49

Post by sandeepmukherjee196 » 23 Nov 2014, 18:46

Michael Kenny wrote:
Where in the Berlin fighting would you see German soldiers carrying mess tins?
In the rubble strewn streets of embattled Berlin apparently? These men had come from their last camp in Neustrelitz and straight joined action in the night of 25th - 26th April...( first deployment near Templehof).

They would have carried their standard gear since Neustrelitz ( departed 25th April). These were the sum total of their earthly possessions at that point in life! No reason for them to jettison anything really !

Ciao
Sandeep

Michael Kenny
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Re: Charlemagne in Berlin

#50

Post by Michael Kenny » 23 Nov 2014, 18:53

I think you had better do some more research.
It is highly revealing that you have just given a very detailed /specific answer which could fool the casual reader into believing you are well referenced when in fact you are simply winging it and making it up as you go along.

The tank shown is not anywhere near Berlin.
Last edited by Michael Kenny on 23 Nov 2014, 19:20, edited 2 times in total.

Sid Guttridge
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Re: Charlemagne in Berlin

#51

Post by Sid Guttridge » 23 Nov 2014, 19:10

I see nothing to indicate this is a photo of ex-Charlemagne men.

What does "Warlord Games" (sic!) give as its primary source?

An inquisitive Sid.

Michael Kenny
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Re: Charlemagne in Berlin

#52

Post by Michael Kenny » 23 Nov 2014, 19:40

https://www.google.com/culturalinstitut ... P1ig?hl=en


and here is the same tank with another in the foreground with its turret blown clean off the hull.

https://www.google.com/culturalinstitut ... 2f0w?hl=en


And again the same tank (on extreme right) showing the rear idler and roadwheels scattered about

https://www.google.com/culturalinstitut ... IFhg?hl=en

Michael Kenny
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Re: Charlemagne in Berlin

#53

Post by Michael Kenny » 23 Nov 2014, 20:05

Jelgava Latvia July-Oct 1944


polo97923_11_2014 17_43_26.jpg
SS WET DREAM FANTASY.jpg
polo98023_11_2014 18_00_10.jpg

sandeepmukherjee196
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Re: Charlemagne in Berlin

#54

Post by sandeepmukherjee196 » 23 Nov 2014, 21:38

Michael Kenny wrote:I think you had better do some more research.
It is highly revealing that you have just given a very detailed /specific answer which could fool the casual reader into believing you are well referenced when in fact you are simply winging it and making it up as you go along.

The tank shown is not anywhere near Berlin.
This kind of baseless accusation / offensive language are sometimes termed as a "flamebait" post by the forum staff of AHF. I wonder if this one qualifies as that !

I didnt give any detailed / specific answers here. I gave a logical/factual answer based on common sense to the effect that the Charlemagne men were likely to be carrying their gear in Berlin (a la your wisecrack that 'where in Berlin would German soldiers be seen to be carrying mess tins' ) . I dont see any rebuttal of that, based on facts/logic from your side..apart from casting aspersions on my integrity.

The pics uploaded by you are of different places and show different tanks, different German troops. The only thing in common are that these are WWII German troops; The streets are the backdrops of European urban battle scenes of WWII. The tanks are of similar make (perhaps)...

BTW I cant vouch for the pic I posted either. I didnt click the pic .. thats obvious? I didnt claim that my close confidantes clicked them either? I have quoted the source here. One may or maynot trust that source for sure..but all that can be done a bit more politely perhaps without casting personal aspersions. Thats a game 2 can play at. But that would go against the purpose and rationale of this Forum..

Sandeep

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Marcus
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Re: Charlemagne in Berlin

#55

Post by Marcus » 23 Nov 2014, 21:47

Everyone, drop the personal remarks and get back on topic.

/Marcus

sandeepmukherjee196
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Re: Charlemagne in Berlin

#56

Post by sandeepmukherjee196 » 23 Nov 2014, 21:50

Thanks Marcus..

Michael Kenny
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Re: Charlemagne in Berlin

#57

Post by Michael Kenny » 23 Nov 2014, 23:24

sandeepmukherjee196 wrote:

I gave a logical/factual answer based on common sense to the effect that the Charlemagne men were likely to be carrying their gear in Berlin (a la your wisecrack that 'where in Berlin would German soldiers be seen to be carrying mess tins' ) . I dont see any rebuttal of that,
My 'experience' told me German Infantry in full battle order just did not ring true for Berlin. A simple search showed that the photo you claimed showed Berlin was not Berlin.

sandeepmukherjee196 wrote:
The pics uploaded by you are of different places and show different tanks, different German troops. The only thing in common are that these are WWII German troops; The streets are the backdrops of European urban battle scenes of WWII. The tanks are of similar make (perhaps)...
The 3 photos are of the same tank. Not the slightest doubt. In the first the buildings either side have not yet being shelled/bombed so no rubble in the street. The next 2 photos are of a German infantry section passing the knocked out IS-2 tank A (right track missing/road wheels blown off) but now with rubble in the street. All 3 photos show the same tank/street with the added bonus (for you) of another IS-2 B with its turret blown off.

The red circle shows the same window in all 3 photos. The green mark shows the same building. The purple mark shows the same arch & and the yellow mark shows the same line.
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Sid Guttridge
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Re: Charlemagne in Berlin

#58

Post by Sid Guttridge » 25 Nov 2014, 12:46

So, we have;

1) An unattributed single photo from a gaming website claiming it is taken in Berlin.

versus

2) Three photos (including the same one) of the same incident from a major international museum claiming they are taken at Jelgava in 1944.

I know where my money would go if forced to bet.

Cheers,

Sid.

Le Page
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Re: Charlemagne in Berlin

#59

Post by Le Page » 25 Nov 2014, 21:17

EDIT:

Michael Kenny
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Re: Charlemagne in Berlin

#60

Post by Michael Kenny » 25 Nov 2014, 22:05

polo00425_11_2014 20_03_35.jpg
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jelgava#me ... elgava.jpg

That is an official Soviet photo dated August 1944.
My opinion is that the top 2 photos (taken by Soviet cameramen) show the building are not as damaged as they are in the bottom 2 photos of German soldiers passing the IS-2. The Soviets were pushed back and German soldiers were then photographed walking down the same street after the building to the far left was more seriously damaged by shellfire.
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