This is an apolitical forum for discussions on the Axis nations, as well as the First and Second World Wars in general hosted by Marcus Wendel's Axis History Factbook in cooperation with Michael Miller's Axis Biographical Research and Christoph Awender's WW2 day by day.
I am saying that human reosrcs prior to mid 1943 were about equal –utilizing them were totally different matter thoughChristian Ankerstjerne wrote:So, you are saying there were no more soldiers in the Soviet army, than in the Axis?
General Patton wrote:Easy...
Hitler's decision to move Guderian's panzergruppe 800km to the south to kiev to be the outer jaws of an encirclement there and Hoth's panzergruppe to the north to Leningrad. They had moscow in mid august, but hitler sent the slow infantry to take the town, while the tanks were busy elsewhere. When they resumed their attack on Moscow, it was the end of September. DEspite a brilliant manuver by Guderian away from Kiev and to Moscow, time had given the Soviets the chance to built up thier forces, including siberian troops and Defensive lines around moscow. The T-34 had more time to come into production, same with the KV-1, both superior tanks. The factories had been moved to the Urals, and production was commencing. Winter was setting in. Had Hitler taken moscow earlier, in August or at the least early September, he would have won. He would have drove on to the Ural factories and destoryed them. Tankograd which produced tens of thousnads of tanks, would not have been able to support the red army. THAT WAS THE TURING POINT!
Attack towards Moscow in August most likely would end in German catastrophe on Stalingrad scale. AG if attacking would be going into the battle without any reserves, with exposed flanks, open rear, and with only limited logistic possibilities (only through damaged Minsk-Smolensk-Viazma-Moscow railroad or by motor transport and horses). Form the north this logistic line would be exposed to the attack by the Soviet North-Western Front (roughly half million soldiers several hundred tanks) ; from the South from the area of Konotop, Briansk, it would be exposed to the attack by Brainsk Front and South-Western Front – more than 1000000 million soldiers and 1000 tanks and about 5000 guns. German supply columns would be decimated and Guderian’s tank would stop, far short of Moscow for the simple lack of gas and spare parts. (the funny thing is they actually would attack Moscow in august and lost, I am sure that German Generals would be writing in their memories “we told him to go to Kiev!!!”)General Patton wrote:Hitler wanted to capture men at kiev, and he did. Why would he march his men 800km if they were to rest after smolensk. Becuase you are in love with the t34, smolensk is big for you. But it still was agerman victory. Hitler wanted to fight the body, not take off the head like guderian wanted
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