Viking Conflict with Native Indians of Vinland & Greenla

[Dan Feltmate]

Hello, I have a few questions.

I have been running into some conflicting points with my research on the Vikings.

Encarta Encyclopedia 96
-VIKINGS
- - Extension of Viking Activities
"They discovered uninhabited lands in the Atlantic - first the Faroes, then Iceland, then Greenland. From Greenland they launched ambitious expeditions to settle on the eastern seaboard of North America (Vinland) but these attempts to colonize the New World 500 years before Columbus were soon abondoned in the face of hostility from the Native peoples."

Also in Encarta though, it mentions in Greenland that the Vikings carried out trade with the Eskimo's, whom lived quite far to the north of the Norse settlements.
Furhter sayings of this are in:
The Penguin Historical Atlas of the Vikings
-The Vikings in Greenland, page 96
"Even further North, the Norse traded with the Eskimos."

--------

BUT here is something further:
The Penguin Historical Atlas of the Vikings
- The Vikigns in Greenland, page 96 (Again)
"Soon after 1300 the climate began to deteriorate. Stock-rearing suffered and sea-ice cut the settlers off from the outside world for years at a time. The Eskimo's began to move south and there wre violent clashes with the Greenlanders.

In 1341 The Western Settlement was occupied by the Eskimo's
In 1380 the Middle Settlement was occupied by the Eskimo's
And in the late 15th century the last Norse Settlement dies out.



Here are some of my question:

What drove the Native Americans in Newfoundland (Vinland) to take up hostility towards the Norse settlers? Does anyone have any defined reason? Why did the Eskimo's in Greenland move south and occupy the Norse settlements.....was it simply because of a climatic change that they decided to become violent?
As it mentions,the Norse carried out trade with these people for quite some time. Is there a reasonable explanation anyone can offer why the Eskimo's would do this? Were the Norse settlers really a big threat to the Eskimo's way of life?

Were there any "Natives" on Iceland? I mean of coruse, the Native's similar to Newfoundland....or perhaps were there any Eskimo's on Iceland when the Norse settlers arrived?

Answers anyone?

Thanks in advance
- Dan

[Der Schwarze Ritter]

where there any natives on Iceland? I think the Celts settled there before the Norsemen arrived.

-Daniel-

[Dan Feltmate]

I meant Natives in the meaning of the same "Native Americans" (Indians)

[Dan]

where there any natives on Iceland? I think the Celts settled there before the Norsemen arrived.

-Daniel-

DNA research indicates that Celtic women were brought by Norse men to Iceland.

[Der Schwarze Ritter]

my bad


-Daniel-

[Dan Feltmate]

Back to the subject?

[Lars EP]

Hi Daniel..

It is generally acknowledged that the Norse and Eskimos came into conflict as the worsening climate forces the Eskimos southwards. Furthermore, thse worsening conditions means that where South-Greenland in 1000 AD was margianable farmable, in 1400 it became impossible to farm anymore.

As to America. The only found settlement is on L'anse aux Medaux in New Foundland. It consists of a few houses, and has only been in use for a few years. I have some material about it somewhere, but I think I remember a reference to a Indian arrow-head. If you are interested I'll see what I can find.

However, "Vinland" or "Markland" was probably to far away. The supplylines where to long, and the Indians to many and to strong. So it the idea of establishing a permanent colony was abandoned.

An interesting twist on the story. When I was on Iceland a couple of years back, a guy told me that some Icelandic annal from around 1300 AD, was referring to a ship arriving from Markland with timber. This should indicate that the Icelanders was collecting timber, a commodity that Iceland is desperately poor on, in America. However, I've never been able to confirm this story.

Regards --- Lars EP

[Vance Pollock]

Here is an interesting link:

http://www.pitt.edu/~dash/vinland.html

[Birgitte Heuschkel]

The incredibly few surviving Viking texts from the period seem to indicate that whilst the weather in Greenland grew colder and rendered cattle farming impossible, hunting conditions for the eskimo also deteriorated (until they adapted), leading to conflict over game and quite likely, domestic animals.

Furthermore, and this may be a key factor, the viking culture believed in vendetta; we'll never know who killed the first human being there, but as soon as an eskimo had killed a viking settler, that settler's family would have to take down an eskimo in revenge, and so forth. This was divine law, and no doubt contributed quite a bit to the mysterious disappearance of the two settlements.

The surviving texts curse the blood revenge without going into details, and mourns the fact that "we did not meet them as human beings".

[Lars EP]

The incredibly few surviving Viking texts from the period seem to indicate that whilst the weather in Greenland grew colder and rendered cattle farming impossible, hunting conditions for the eskimo also deteriorated (until they adapted), leading to conflict over game and quite likely, domestic animals.

Furthermore, and this may be a key factor, the viking culture believed in vendetta; we'll never know who killed the first human being there, but as soon as an eskimo had killed a viking settler, that settler's family would have to take down an eskimo in revenge, and so forth. This was divine law, and no doubt contributed quite a bit to the mysterious disappearance of the two settlements.

The surviving texts curse the blood revenge without going into details, and mourns the fact that "we did not meet them as human beings".

Now I am curious... which texts are we talking about here?

Regards --- Lars EP

[vikings269]

http://rutgerspress.rutgers.edu/Author/ ... cerpt.html

[Carl Schwamberger]

I wonder if the Grand Banks fish concentration had been found, would the Norse or other Europeans been able to take advantage of it that early? Were the fishermen of western Europe capable of using the Grand Banks, and would they have needed to?

[LWD]

where there any natives on Iceland? I think the Celts settled there before the Norsemen arrived.

DNA research indicates that Celtic women were brought by Norse men to Iceland.

From what I've read the Norse found Irish monks in Iceland when they arrived.

As for conflicts with the inhabitants of the Americas some of the tribes were quite war like others weren't. Even some of those that weren't may not have appreciated a strange "tribe" moving in and establishing a community on land that they regarded as theirs. There is also some evidence for friendly relations with some of the tribes. This would parrallel later European experiance as well.