Muolaanjarvi ( Kannas) 24-28.08.1941

[olia]

I need help. I would like to know exactly what type of artillery meaning in the diary Kev.JR4.
" Varsinkin vih:n suorasuuntausaeet tekivat (?) jalkea ( ?)- samoinkuin (?) hv.tykit(?) Vih.nimittain kaytteli (?)hv:jaan(?)
Yksi vih:n (?) hv:ista (?) ammuttiin tuleen. Todettiin,etta vih:lla oli (?) laksi (?) tyk.ptria ja yksi it.tykki suorasuuntausasemissa."
I ll be grateful for the answer.

[Vaeltaja]

I need help. I would like to know exactly what type of artillery meaning in the diary Kev.JR4.
" Varsinkin vih:n suorasuuntausaeet tekivat (?) jalkea ( ?)- samoinkuin (?) hv.tykit(?) Vih.nimittain kaytteli (?)hv:jaan(?)
Yksi vih:n (?) hv:ista (?) ammuttiin tuleen. Todettiin,etta vih:lla oli (?) laksi (?) tyk.ptria ja yksi it.tykki suorasuuntausasemissa."
I ll be grateful for the answer.

It would be helpful if you included the link to the war diary to your post.

EDIT: Never mind, i found the entry ( http://digi.narc.fi/digi/view.ka?kuid=4888501 ):

Varsinkin vih:n suorasuuntausaseet tekivät pahaa jälkeä - samoinkuin hv.tykit. Vih. nimittäin käytteli hv:jaan.
Especially the enemy direct fire guns (as in artillery used in direct fire, or point-blank, role) did severe damage - just like the tank guns. As enemy used their tanks.

Yksi vih:n hv:ista ammuttiin tuleen. Todettiin, että vih:lla oli kaksi tyk.patteria ja yksi it.tykki suorasuuntausasemissa.
One enemy tank was shot and started to burn. It was noticed that the enemy had two artillery batteries and one anti-aircraft gun in direct fire positions (or in positions to shoot at point-blank range).

[John Hilly]

Also 45 mm AT-guns were included under the term "Suorasuuntausaseet" - point-blank weapons.
The Gun Batteries here must have been Field Artillery, that is from 76mm -> 152mm though.

With best,
J-P

[olia]

Thank you very much!

[Panssari Salama]

Suorasuuntaus

Being an ex-artillery grunt I am used to terms direct fire, when using the gun sights to fire directly upon target, and indirect fire, when firing via a trajectory to pre-determined targets.

Therefore, suorasuuntausase could be perhaps translated as direct fire artillery / guns, or, artillery / guns using direct fire methods?

Point-blank is something used with hand guns?

[Vaeltaja]

Yeah, i also would translate 'suorasuuntaus' as 'direct fire' since the meaning of 'point-blank' is a tad different. For example AT/AA gun was quite often called (in literature) as 'suorasuuntaustykki' or 'direct fire gun'. Essentially noting that weapon was not intended for the traditional indirect fire role of the artillery. Other guns could be used for direct fire role as well and that is when Finnish books/war diaries talk about shooting with 'suorasuuntauksella' ('using direct fire').

AFAIK point-blank either describes a really short range (in common speech) or alternatively the range the weapon is able to reach with bullets/shells/shots still having reasonably flat trajectories so that no adjustment to the aims of the gun is necessary when firing at targets within the said range (in more technical sense).

[olia]

Requires accurate translation from the diary Kev.4JR about the battle in the morning 28.08.1941 in Tassiolamen area - actions of Soviet troops.
http://digi.narc.fi/digi/view.ka?kuid=4888406

[Vaeltaja]

Something like:

Situation became fairly threatening at the road triangle of Tassiolampi at times during the night of 27-28.8. Commander of the Kev.Pr. (Light Brigade) decided to strenghten the forces there by dispatching 2.Er.Pst.K. (2nd Separate Anti-Tank Company ?) led by Captain Utela to the location. Iskala's company was subordinated to 2.Er.Pst.K.

Enemy's only road due south from Ylä-Hotakka was the road running south of Kattilaoja and west of Tassiolampis towards Perkjärvi. Enemy did his utmost to keep the road triangle at Tassiolampi free for traffic because of this. Enemy's road was cut (by JR40) at the NE end of the lake Muolaanjärvi. Because it was uncertain if Captain Utela's force would be able to hold against the severe enemy pressure sent the Commander of the Kev.Pr. at 0640 the 1st Battalion, which had been resting (sleeping) in the ground south of the Kämärä station, to the area (kangas) near Tassiolampi and tasked it with defeating the enemy at the road triangle and cutting the enemy escape route towards Perkjärvi. Enemy used their tanks and shot ferociosly with the machineguns they had mounted on top of the trucks. At this point Lieutenant Iskala died.

1st Battalion started the attack at 0930: 2nd Company (Alfthan) attacked in the direction of p.43 - p.45 - N edge of Suursuo and 1st Company (Johansson) by advancing SE from Metsänvartija hit the enemy's flank at the road triangle of Tassiolampi. By 1400 fighting had ended. Following materiel was captured:
- Over one hundred horses
- 4 tanks
- 6 x 6-inch guns
- 3 x 47 mm AT guns
- 23 trucks (or lorries)
- Guns, among which 4-barreled AA-MG
- Food supplies
- Ammo supplies
- Various material
Enemy casualties 46 men.

[olia]

Thank you very much for the translation. I mean here's a translation of the phrase Enemy used their tanks and shot ferociosly with the machineguns they had mounted on top of the trucks. At this point Lieutenant Iskala died.. Compared with my translation, almost all true, making progress in learning Finnish.
If I understood correctly, in the battle of Tassiolamen Soviet troops did not use guns. Only tanks and machine guns. The Finnish anti-gun company had guns, how much and what caliber?

[John Hilly]

Regimental AT Coy's used 37 mm Bofors guns in 1941, but the Sepatrate (Detached) Companies used Soviet M-32 45 mm K.
There were six guns in a Company, so 2.Er.PstK. had six 45 mm's.

http://www.jaegerplatoon.net/FORMATIONS7.htm
http://www.pkymasehist.fi/piiskatykki.html

With Best,
J-P

[olia]

4JR diary gives accurate Soviet losses, 46 killed, but says nothing about the loss of Finnish , except for the death of Captain Iskela. Where can I find the loss of 4JR in the battle of Tassiolamen?

[Vaeltaja]

On a brief search i didn't find any... It is a tad difficult to trace the reports regarding the losses since the Finnish unit in question (mostly parts of the 4th Infantry Regiment) were until 23 August 1941 still subordinated to 18th Division (of the II Army Corps or II AK) instead of the 8th Division (of the IV Army Corps or IV AK) - and as a additional distraction when they were 'returned' back to II AK parts of the 4th Regiment (namely the '4th Light Infantry Regiment' - Kev. JR4 - and 'Heavy Battalion of 4th Infantry Regiment' - Rask.P./JR4 - which are ~ I/JR4 & II/JR4) were subordinated to 12th Division instead of the 8th Division in which the III/JR4 still was as an organic part of that division. A bit messy... And that is just with JR4 without taking Kev. Os. 9 or the rest into account.

I also found this: http://digi.narc.fi/digi/view.ka?kuid=4954052 which describes the fighting in slightly different manner than earlier.

And then... 'Tassiolammen' is a genitive case of Tassiolampi so it would be 'battle of Tassiolampi'.

[John Hilly]

I also found this: http://digi.narc.fi/digi/view.ka?kuid=4954052 which describes the fighting in slightly different manner than earlier.

Well found! There we have Soviet arty shooting direct fire and Finns trying to get them.
I'll try to translate the artillery part. (Not sure if I manage).

J-P

[John Hilly]

Here's a translation from the war diary of I/Kev. JR 4 (source above):

25.8.1941...
... Also there appared tanks to which frontal AT-shots didn't effect. [J-P: KV-1s?]
As one aspect of the fight it should be mentioned that about 300 meters in front of the 1. Coy, the enemy had a Field Artillery battery, which shot direct fire on 1. Coy's positions. 2. Coy tried to overtake the battery using two strong battle groups, but failed.
The road was however cut, and the enemy supply column currently moving there was distroyed.
While the enemy pressure was still getting stronger from the Ylä-Hotakka direction, II battalion that had arrived behind the I P, sent parts of Company Orispää (CO) to help Company Tattari (CO).
As own casualties were growing, the I Battalion got permission withdraw to forest enclaves 100 m from Kattila-oja village, from where to keep the Ylä-Hotakka - Leipäsuo road cut with fire.

Own casualties: 5 killed and 14 wounded...

With best,
J-P

[olia]

You got me confused, in the Finnish army was a very complex system of names of regiments. I realized in Finland there is no available database of fallen soldiers, like Russian OBD-MEMORIAL?
I found one website with the names:
HÄMEENNIEMI, SEPPO OLAVI maanviljelijä sotamies JR 4/5. 30.8.1921 Miehikkälä 23.8.1941 Kämärä 19
OVASKA, TAUNO AULIS maanviljelijä korpraali JR 4/5. 23.7.1914 Kirvu 24.8.1941 Kämärä 27
PERKKO, RISTO OLAVI koululainen alikersantti JR 4/5. 24.9.1920 Tampere 23.8.1941 Kämärä 20
HJULMAN, HEIKKI FRANS koululainen sotamies JR 4/II 9.12.1921 Rauma 23.8.1941 Kämärä 19
ILMONIEMI, ERKKI KUSTAA opiskelija alikersantti JR 4/II 22.3.1923 Espoo 23.8.1941 Kämärä 18
LAIVUORI, HEIKKI OLAVI talollinen alikersantti JR 4/II 2.5.1920 Vampula 25.8.1941 Kämärä 21
LESKIMAA/LESKENMAA, VEIKKO VILJAMI työmies sotamies JR 4/II 13.6.1921 Kiikoinen 23.8.1941 Kämärä 20
RAKOLAHTI, JAAKKO/VILHO JAAKKO työmies sotamies JR 4/II 29.3.1921 Kauvatsa 23.8.1941 Kämärä 20

here indicates the location of death and also the burial place?