'Arbeit Macht Frei' inscription was stolen from Auschwitz

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ToKu
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'Arbeit Macht Frei' inscription was stolen from Auschwitz

#1

Post by ToKu » 18 Dec 2009, 10:10

It was reported today, early morning.

Some people have no respect whatsoever... :?

P.S. Dear moderator please move this topic to WW Today section if You feel it belongs there.

jola
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Re: 'Arbeit Macht Frei' inscription was stolen from Auschwitz

#2

Post by jola » 18 Dec 2009, 16:14

Stolen last night and already this morning:
Information and Diaspora Minister Yuli Edelstein said in response that "this is one the Polish police's biggest failures," adding that" anti-Semitic events in the world are multiplying, and there is a valid fear for the safety of the Jews in the Diaspora."
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1136084.html


ChristopherPerrien
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Re: 'Arbeit Macht Frei' inscription was stolen from Auschwitz

#3

Post by ChristopherPerrien » 18 Dec 2009, 18:57

jola wrote:Stolen last night and already this morning:
Information and Diaspora Minister Yuli Edelstein said in response that "this is one the Polish police's biggest failures," adding that" anti-Semitic events in the world are multiplying, and there is a valid fear for the safety of the Jews in the Diaspora."
http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1136084.html

I am disappointed there was an immediate accusation of "anti-semitism" by an Israllie gov. official . I suppose he has forgotten about the million Polish people who died there.

Such a theft is akin to "grave-roobbing" and I'm sure Polish police will do their job as to finding the perpetrators, no mater what ignorant hatred is directed at them.

Chris

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Re: 'Arbeit Macht Frei' inscription was stolen from Auschwitz

#4

Post by Karl » 18 Dec 2009, 20:59

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Last edited by Karl on 22 Dec 2009, 23:14, edited 1 time in total.

uberjude
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Re: 'Arbeit Macht Frei' inscription was stolen from Auschwitz

#5

Post by uberjude » 18 Dec 2009, 21:47

Without in any way belittling the considerable suffering of the Polish people during the war, there were nowhere near a million Poles murdered in Auschwitz. Here are some reasonable estimates:

http://www.nizkor.org/faqs/auschwitz/au ... aq-09.html

http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/camps/aus ... on-variant

It's accepted now that no more than about 1.5 million were killed/died in Auschwitz (and that's a high figure), of which about 1.1 million were definitely Jews. Since the figure for Jews is not in dispute, no more than 400,000 non-Jews died in Auschwitz, of whom not all were Poles (and again, even that number is a high estimate).

Not meaning to be pedantic, but given the way that numbers are used by Holocaust deniers, it's important to be precise in one's language and one's figures.

That being said, and reasonable as it may be to conclude that there was an antisemitic motive, it's not terribly helpful to make accusations before any facts are in. And we should keep perspective--while it is vandalism of a historically significant artifact, that, ultimately, is all that it is. Indeed, presuming it is motivated by antisemitism, I'd be very happy if the antisemites of the world would restrict themselves to acts of sign thievery--certainly preferable to many of the alternatives the world has seen.

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Re: 'Arbeit Macht Frei' inscription was stolen from Auschwitz

#6

Post by jola » 18 Dec 2009, 22:27

Not meaning to be pedantic, but given the way that numbers are used by Holocaust deniers, it's important to be precise in one's language and one's figures.
I agree. That's why people should think what they are saying publicly as it feeds the deniers. Consider the quote below:
Yossi Levy, the Foreign Ministry's spokesman for the Hebrew press said earlier Friday, "It's hard to imagine what kind twisted (person) would want to steal this terrible symbol at the entrance to the death camp. The same shuddering combination, 'work sets you free;, which millions of Jews saw moments and hours before their death."
http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340 ... 14,00.html

Hardly precise or even accurate.
Mainly Poles saw this sign as they went in and out of Auschwitz I for labor details. Jews went to their death at Auschwitz II - Birkenau, a separate camp, a mile away from this gate. There was no sign at Auschwitz II.

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Re: 'Arbeit Macht Frei' inscription was stolen from Auschwitz

#7

Post by uberjude » 18 Dec 2009, 22:33

Every time I see something like that Levy quote, I think "this will appear on Stormfront as evidence the Holocaust didn't happen." Something along the lines of "Israelis now claim that millions of gassings took place in Auschwitz I"

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Re: 'Arbeit Macht Frei' inscription was stolen from Auschwitz

#8

Post by jola » 18 Dec 2009, 23:07

The police say now that this was well organized so they exclude vandalism. The thieves knew of the guards' routine, avoided security cameras, and picked a snowy and very cold night. We shall see if they manage to solve this one.

Out of interest about the sign. The Polish prisoners, who were ordered to make the sign above the camp gate, welded the letter "B" upside down in a small effort of defiance. This seems like an insignificant thing but it was small sabotage, as it is called.

Image

The discussions on Stormfront appeal to few people. Certainly, in Poland, they would be laughed at. Within living memory, most everyone knows what was the fate of the Jewish population.

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Re: 'Arbeit Macht Frei' inscription was stolen from Auschwitz

#9

Post by michael mills » 19 Dec 2009, 03:08

Out of interest about the sign. The Polish prisoners, who were ordered to make the sign above the camp gate, welded the letter "B" upside down in a small effort of defiance. This seems like an insignificant thing but it was small sabotage, as it is called.
Or maybe just typical incompetent tradesmen?
Within living memory, most everyone knows what was the fate of the Jewish population.
But do they care?

ChristopherPerrien
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Re: 'Arbeit Macht Frei' inscription was stolen from Auschwitz

#10

Post by ChristopherPerrien » 19 Dec 2009, 03:16

jola wrote: Out of interest about the sign. The Polish prisoners, who were ordered to make the sign above the camp gate, welded the letter "B" upside down in a small effort of defiance. This seems like an insignificant thing but it was small sabotage, as it is called.

.
I did not know that, although I have wondered about it. Moreso , "Why didn't they fix it??"
However such small details only add to the "historical/novelty"value of the sign. Which only adds to the idea that this theft was not some "drunk skin-heads" but some real theives stealing an art/historical object of great value for someone who can pay for it. That sign may never be seen again.

I only have to wonder, because I often consider opposites for context, if say "The Blood-Banner" was on display somewhere and it was stolen , What would be said ?

As to my comment about about a million Poles dying to be inaccurate, surely it was, but it was more of a generalization rather than a statement of specific fact, How many Poles/Jews/ and others that died at the Aushwhitz complex is not something that should or can be numerically defined. Neither should it be, because I think it cheapens each person who died there. "Life" is not a number. Holocaust deniers/promoters , historians, and others often all do this, even though their reasons may be different .

Chris

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Re: 'Arbeit Macht Frei' inscription was stolen from Auschwitz

#11

Post by ChristopherPerrien » 19 Dec 2009, 03:27

michael mills wrote:
Out of interest about the sign. The Polish prisoners, who were ordered to make the sign above the camp gate, welded the letter "B" upside down in a small effort of defiance. This seems like an insignificant thing but it was small sabotage, as it is called.
Or maybe just typical incompetent tradesmen?

What about them incompetent Nazis that didn't order the sign be corrected forthwith? :P :P :P
If I were a higher ranking Nazi, :roll: , showed up there and saw that insult to a highly valued Nazi slogan, I would commence to "rolling heads", and those heads wouldn't be the "incompetent" Pollock tradesmens that did it. :lol: :lol: :lol:

Chris

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Re: 'Arbeit Macht Frei' inscription was stolen from Auschwitz

#12

Post by Ewigland » 19 Dec 2009, 03:29

A terrible act. Just hoping for the sign to be retrieved.

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Re: 'Arbeit Macht Frei' inscription was stolen from Auschwitz

#13

Post by Slavomir » 19 Dec 2009, 15:55

michael mills wrote:
Within living memory, most everyone knows what was the fate of the Jewish population.
But do they care?
Do you? or just find it amusing in offending people?

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Re: 'Arbeit Macht Frei' inscription was stolen from Auschwitz

#14

Post by Carnaro » 19 Dec 2009, 23:00

Don't worry, folks
It's nothing but an innocent joke.
Now someone will laugh, amused.

For example, that sort of Court of Miracles, of whores, fools, clowns, dwarfs and dancers, who make up the great circus of the revisionists, deniers and reductionists.

Ladies and Gentlemen please welcome,
to the Fletcher Memorial
home for those overgrown infants.
They amuse themselves
playing games for a while
with their favourite toys.
They'll be good girls and boys,
wasters of life and limb.

Is everyone in?
Are you having a nice time?

Now, and for you
the final solution can be applied

Max

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Re: 'Arbeit Macht Frei' inscription was stolen from Auschwitz

#15

Post by MAJ T » 19 Dec 2009, 23:05

While not rushing to defend Mr. Mills, I myself often harbor similar thoughts after reading his post. It is a valid, even if poised in a seemingly provocative manner.

There are far, unfortunately, to many individuals who don't care about the fate of those who were consigned to the tender mercies of the German Masters of Auschwitz. There are also "Collectors" that would rob any antiquity to posess historical objects that no other can have. Even more disturbing are the ones who are sorry that they didn't get to help deliver the victims to their fates.

Whichever ilk was involved I hope all involved are quickly apprehended and receive what they so richly deserve, and hopefully think about how fortunate they ate that the original owner of Auschwitz aren't around to be their custodians.

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