Warcrime picture - WARNING\GRAPHIC!

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Hecht
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Warcrime picture - WARNING\GRAPHIC!

#1

Post by Hecht » 19 Oct 2013, 13:51

Dear members,

In order to preserve this picture, which I've found on ebay many years ago, I'll post it here.
I've found it unusual because very rarely I've incountered pictures of slaughtered civilians captioned as "Im kampf erschossene juden".
Usually they refer to them as "partisans" or "banditen", so militiamen; here seems like we are dealing about proper civilians, even of course I cannot say if they were actually militiamen\armed "civilians" or simply civilians killed for various reasons, one of them seem to be a bit old to be partisan anyway so I tend to belive they are not partisans.

Seems to me the guy holding the rifle has a strange uniform, maybe Ustashe?
I also can read "Mitrovitza Oktober 41" that may refer to Kosovksa Mitrovica in Kossovo or Srmska Mitrovica in Serbia: this may actually point to Ustashe members.
Seems also to me I can also read the word "Tschetnizi" that may well be a germanized form of "Cetnici\Chetniks": I also see a date, 26.08.1941, which may help in order to ID the event.
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Balsi
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Re: Warcrime picture - WARNING\GRAPHIC!

#2

Post by Balsi » 19 Oct 2013, 18:40

Hi,

It seems like the 5th mountain division regarding the sign on the car.

Greetings Balsi


history1
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Re: Warcrime picture - WARNING\GRAPHIC!

#3

Post by history1 » 19 Oct 2013, 19:18

Hecht wrote:[...] one of them seem to be a bit old to be partisan anyway so I tend to belive they are not partisans.[...]
Germans didn´t consider from the age if one was a partisan or not. Also people of old age and supporting them with food, housing, etc. have been considered as partisans when Germans knew about it. And they didn´t hesitate to kill them as partisan - supporters.

history1
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Re: Warcrime picture - WARNING\GRAPHIC!

#4

Post by history1 » 19 Oct 2013, 19:36

Captions:
"Tschetnizi, ihr verdientes Schicksal - 26.8.41" = Chetniks, their deserved fate

" Oktober 1941 - Im Kampf zerschossene Juden und Tschetnitz - Mitrowitza 1941 " = October 1941- In the fight to pieces shot jews and chetniks - Mitrowica 1941

"Tschetnizi begraben ihre eigenen Leute - 26.8.41" = Chetniks buring their own people

The german "translation " Tschetnizi cames from the croatian term for chetniks, "Četnici".

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Re: Warcrime picture - WARNING\GRAPHIC!

#5

Post by Ken S. » 06 Nov 2013, 00:22

I think you're generalizing a bit. The Germans would have been well aware that the partisans were often receiving "support" by making threats and using violence themselves.
history1 wrote:
Hecht wrote:[...] one of them seem to be a bit old to be partisan anyway so I tend to belive they are not partisans.[...]
Germans didn´t consider from the age if one was a partisan or not. Also people of old age and supporting them with food, housing, etc. have been considered as partisans when Germans knew about it. And they didn´t hesitate to kill them as partisan - supporters.

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Re: Warcrime picture - WARNING\GRAPHIC!

#6

Post by Davey Boy » 06 Nov 2013, 11:02

Ken S. wrote:I think you're generalizing a bit. The Germans would have been well aware that the partisans were often receiving "support" by making threats and using violence themselves.
Yes, they were probably aware, and then they lined everyone up over a ditch and shot them.

Actually, they burned whole communities in barns in Belarus when they got a whiff of partisan activity in the area.

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Re: Warcrime picture - WARNING\GRAPHIC!

#7

Post by history1 » 06 Nov 2013, 14:23

Ken S. why do you quote my comment when you´re referring to Hecht´s statement? Or is your post regarded to me?

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Re: Warcrime picture - WARNING\GRAPHIC!

#8

Post by Ken S. » 07 Nov 2013, 04:44

It was in response to your comment.
history1 wrote:Ken S. why do you quote my comment when you´re referring to Hecht´s statement? Or is your post regarded to me?

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Re: Warcrime picture - WARNING\GRAPHIC!

#9

Post by Ken S. » 07 Nov 2013, 05:14

Yes, I think it's been fairly well established for some time that the Nazis carried out reprisals against partisans and their supporters. That's nothing new to war in general. But if we want to have a rational, fact-based discussion on a subject, no matter how horrific it may be, it serves no purpose to make hollow generalizations.
Davey Boy wrote:Yes, they were probably aware, and then they lined everyone up over a ditch and shot them.

Actually, they burned whole communities in barns in Belarus when they got a whiff of partisan activity in the area.

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Hecht
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Re: Warcrime picture - WARNING\GRAPHIC!

#10

Post by Hecht » 13 Feb 2014, 22:47


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wm
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Re: Warcrime picture - WARNING\GRAPHIC!

#11

Post by wm » 13 Feb 2014, 23:10

Davey Boy wrote:Yes, they were probably aware, and then they lined everyone up over a ditch and shot them.
It's a little harsh.
In fact the Germans frequently accepted as valid partisan requisition certificates, or even verbal statements of victims and reduced taxes in goods and/or money accordingly.

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Re: Warcrime picture - WARNING\GRAPHIC!

#12

Post by Halle » 14 Feb 2014, 10:06

Apologies , but looking at these pictures - I'm interested in how the symbol on the rear of the automobile ( as stated , the Gamsbok of Fifth GJ division ) is related to the pictures ? The pictures also seem to be dated 1941 ( Fifth formed ' 40 , served Greece/Crete/Norway '41 ) , so could it be the invasion of Yugoslavia on the way to the Metaxas line ? They didn't receive their " Gams " nickname till later than this ...

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Re: Warcrime picture - WARNING\GRAPHIC!

#13

Post by PF » 14 Feb 2014, 18:09


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