Why the Holocaust happend Functionalist vs Intentionalist

[David1819]

The debate is interesting and I guess it all depends on ones judgment.

Compared to Stalin and Saddam Hussein, Hitler does not seem to have the same personality the Third Reich is truly unique.

Unlike most dictators who are only interested in power wealth like Stalin and Hussein they are effectively Gangsters running a nation. Hitler on the other hand seems to be driven by an Ideology that borders into religion or mythology. Himmler who is without a doubt the architect of the genocide along with his SS followed some strange neo-pagan religion.

I still cannot decide what the factor was that resulted in the Holocaust and to what extent Hitler was aware of it. Once you read about Himmler mysticism and occult practices it makes sense that such an irrational ideology can commit atrocities.

If it was Intentional what was the motive?

1. Mysticism/Norse Pagan mythology
2. Pseudo Scientific Darwinism
3. Economic/ forced Labour manufacturing needs for war effort

But what is the Functionalist argument? That the German people assumed Hitler wanted it so slowly bureaucratic organisations slowly carried it all out?

[little grey rabbit]

Its a fairly old debate now. There are various strands of Functionalist interpretations.

But I think they all share as a core concept that the original plans to resettle Jews out of Europe into first Madagascar and later in Russia were genuine, but that these plans were foiled by English control of the seas and the defeat before Moscow in December 1941.
At this point it varies between people who think genocide emerged spontaneously as a series of ad-hoc decisions taken at the periphery and those who think it was more centrally directed.

[Paul Lantos]

The Madagascar plan and the Nisko plan were both essentially exterminatory. At least after 1939 it was mainly the time scale that evolved, not so much the overall intent.

[uberjude]

More to the point, though, is that through the 1930's, Nazi policy was emigration. The intentionalist arguments seem to mostly hinge on a few statements made by Hitler and the fact that the Nazis ultimately did exterminate the Jews, but in terms of actual policy, the evidence is pretty compelling that until the war, the goal was emigration, then it became expulsion, and then only in 1941 or very early 1942 did it move to extermination.

[Eddy Marz]

As little grey rabbit says, it's a fairly old debate. Raul Hilberg suggested that the line separating intentionalism from functionalism was in fact quite porous, and probably a mixture of the two. Fact remains that radical points of views emerged quite early on in certain circles; I remain convinced that Hitler considered such measures since the late 20's although they were probably vague and unpractical

[Michael Kenny]

Hitler on the other hand seems to be driven by an Ideology that borders into religion or mythology.

Or was insane?

[David Thompson]

An off-topic post from fuser was removed by the moderator - DT.

[Peter]

and then only in 1941 or very early 1942 did it move to extermination.

It was certainly extermination by May 1941 when Heydrich verbally passed on the order to kill the Soviet Jews to the Einsatzgruppen leadership at Pretzsch, where they prepared for Operation Barbarossa.

Heydrich had been negotiating the co-operation his Einsatzgruppen would need to accomplish this with the Army QMG Eduard Wagner in March 1941, this was finalized in April 1941.

[Peter]

post duplicated, please remove this