++Medo wrote:
Smith will now tell us that the increase of the fuel supply had this effect only because the engine was under load and thus could not turn any faster.++
The Reverend keeps trying, as I predicted:
<<No effect on the carbon monoxide output at all until the engine is maxed-out.>>
Baloney.
<<Here's a more detailed chart for you Roberto that shows the fuel-air ratio (multiplied by 500).>>
Even if multiplied by 1500, the chart would not become any more convincing. It shows nothing other than the various experiments and the exhaust composition in each of them. How that exhaust composition is dependent on the fuel-air ratio is not shown. Neither do we see the fuel input:
Experiment #; Power (load hp); Rpm; Fuel; volume gas; Fuel-Air ratio; CO2%; O2%; CO%; NOx (ppm); H2%:
B13; 00.0hp; 1400rpm; 04.56lbs/hr; 4500cf/hr; 0.013 (77:1); 02.7%; 17.14%; 0.041% (410ppm); 167ppm; 0.0%
B14; 08.8hp; 1410rpm; 06.89lbs/hr; 4460cf/hr; 0.020 (50:1); 04.2%; 15.13%; 0.028% (280ppm); 267ppm; 0.0%
B15; 17.5hp; 1400rpm; 09.56lbs/hr; 4180cf/hr; 0.029 (35:1); 06.2%; 12.20%; 0.024% (240ppm); 378ppm; 0.0%
B16; 24.6hp; 1410rpm; 12.45lbs/hr; 4050cf/hr; 0.039 (26:1); 08.4%; 09.26%; 0.027% (270ppm); 448ppm; 0.0%
B12; 37.8hp; 1400rpm; 18.12lbs/hr; 3950cf/hr; 0.056 (18:1); 12.4%; 03.44%; 0.058% (580ppm); 364ppm; 0.0%
B70; 40.2hp; 1400rpm; 21.29lbs/hr; 3700cf/hr; 0.070 (14:1); 13.8%; 00.80%; 0.700% (07kppm); 346ppm; 0.1%
B72; 41.0hp; 1400rpm; 24.41lbs/hr; 3650cf/hr; 0.084 (12:1); 12.1%; 00.30%; 3.500% (35kppm); 277ppm; 1.3%
B69; 40.6hp; 1400rpm; 29.63lbs/hr; 4050cf/hr; 0.094 (11:1); 10.2%; 00.30%; 6.000% (60kppm); 186ppm; 0.4%
Smith obviously takes our audience for a bunch of gullible idiots who will be impressed by a nice multi-colored chart.
<<With the truck stopped (B-13) and the throttle depressed there is 17% oxygen in the exhaust and negligible CO.>>
The fuel supply in B-13 was 4.56 lbs/hr. What would the oxygen content have been if the fuel supply had been 29.63 lbs/hr as in B69, 6.5 times higher? The engine would have turned faster, for sure, but unless it turned so much faster as to take in 6.5 times more air, which I strongly doubt, the fuel-air ratio would go up and the oxygen content of the exhaust would go down.
<<Now, with the truck struggling up an ever-steeper hill, as shown by the load, lined in black, the CO doesn't increase until the engine power is maxed-out and can't be loaded any more.>>
Sure, that’s why the CO content and oxygen concentration in the experiments between B13 and B12 remain exactly the same, right?
<<Despite increasing the throttle to meet the load the speed stays at about 1400 rpm, the constant for these tests.>>
Certainly so, but that doesn’t tell us anything about what things would be like if the throttle were opened without the engine being under load, does it?
<<The throttle setting does not control the fuel-air ratio, which is also determined by engine speed and load.
While I agree that it is easier to enhance the toxicity of an engine under load than that of an engine not under load by increasing the fuel supply, I see no evidence that the exhaust of an engine could not be made toxic enough by simply opening up the throttle, independently of there being a load. Or by restricting the air intake. Or by doing both. The fuel-air ratio is the decisive factor, according to Holtz & Elliot, and what brought it up in experiments B-70, B-72 and B-69 was the increase of the fuel supply:
Previous studies (2,3,4,5) of the exhaust from internal-combustion engines have shown that the composition of these gases is chiefly a function of air-fuel ratio.
[...]
Although Fig. 2 presents data on exhaust-gas composition at fuel-air ratios on the rich side, such conditions of operation are not normal and were obtained in these tests by changing the adjustment on the stop limiting the travel of the rack on the fuel pump of engine B. After this change the fuel injected at full throttle was increased by approximately 60 per cent. When the engines were operated in their normal range the fuel-air ratio never exceeded 0.042 and 0.058 lb per lb for engines A and B, respectively.
Emphasis is mine.
<<Pretty obvious.>>
The only thing obvious is that Smith is desperately trying to sell an ever more transparent herring.
<<All those laden "murder vans" had to be struggling up perpetual hills for this murder scheme to work, as I have explained many times before. LOL.>>
Assuming that gas vans had diesel engines at all (those at Chelmno extermination camp had gasoline engines, according to the depositions of Walter Burmeister and Walter Piller quoted on pages 114 and 141 of Kogon/Langbein/Rückerl et al,
Nationalsozialistische Massentötungen durch Giftgas, and of the vans used by the
Einsatzgruppen in the Soviet Union only the bigger Saurer vans may have had diesel engines), the stuff about the struggling vans is just plain nonsense. Here’s what a professional colleague once told Berg on the Usenet:
Article 14309 of alt.revisionism: Path: oneb!hakatac!nntp.cs.ubc.ca!newsxfer.itd.umich.edu!uunet!news.delphi.com!usenet From:
[email protected] Newsgroups: alt.revisionism Subject: Re: Diesel A, B, C's and Scott Mullins Date: Mon, 25 Jul 94 23:24:56 -0500 Organization: Delphi (
[email protected] email, 800-695-4005 voice) Lines: 24 Message-ID: References: <2vt3du$
[email protected]> NNTP-Posting-Host: bos1f.delphi.com X-To: Friedrich Berg
Friedrich Berg writes: >engine, Diesel engine and even the automobile. I can't really believe >that Mullins can be that stupid--but, then again, perhaps he is?
I dont believe any useful purpose is served by calling people names. Why cannot you keep this discussion at a professional level? If you are an engineer that should not be too difficult. I also happen to be a mechanical engineer with probably more years experience that many of you have. I see nothing technically wrong in accepting that a diesel engine exhausting into a closed room provided with an exhauster would fill the room with a lethal gas. The percentage of CO is not only a function of load but also of the air/fuel ratio. It is quite possible to run a diesel engine "rich" at part-load as well as at full-load. It won't be efficient but it would produce higher percentages of CO. Apart from all of this people forced into a closed chamber filled with exhaust gases would not only die from CO but would also be asphyxiated. And finally, the argument about gas producers being a better source of CO is technically correct but not practical because gas producers are basically custom-built and certainly not as readily available during the war at a camp near the war zones than diesel engines.
Let's try to cut out the emotions and keep this at a dispassionate technical level.
Source of quote:
http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/people/b/ ... /berg.0794
Another confirmation that I’m right. What did the “Hoaxbuster” say to this? Did he go mute?
<<So, there you have it! The Germans used neither carbon monoxide nor carbon dioxide but bottled chlorine gas. LOL.>>
The contention seems to be based on nothing other than Smith’s assumption that putting a piece of cloth moistened with urine over nose and mouth was “an old WWI trick with chlorine gas, the ammonia in the urine neutralizing the chlorine”. Can Smith demonstrate that this trick didn’t work against carbon monoxide poisoning as well? And even if he can, what will he have shown? That Kotov was not a credible witness, period. Big deal, considering that there are enough perpetrators’ depositions and incriminating documents around to make the True Believer stop laughing. Here are extracts from some of them:
The use of the gas vans was the most horrible thing I have ever seen. I saw people being led into the gas vans and the doors closed. Then the van drove off. I had to drive Blobel to the place where the gas van was unloaded. The back doors of the van were opened, and the bodies that had not fallen out when the doors were opened were unloaded by Jews who were still alive. The bodies were covered with vomit and excrement. It was a terrible sight. Blobel looked, then looked away, and we drove off. On such occasions Blobel always drank schnapps, sometimes even in the car.
Testimony of gas van driver Julius Bauer
Source of quote:
http://www.pgonline.com/electriczen/bauer.html
The gas van was deployed for the first time in Kiev. My job was just to drive the vehicle. The van was loaded by the local staff. About forty people were loaded inside. There were men women and children. I was supposed to tell the people they were going to be put to work. The people were pushed up a short ladder and into the van. The van door was then bolted shut, and the hose was attached. It was already in place - I did that, it was cold at the time. I drove through the town to the antitank ditches. The bodies were thrown into the antitank ditches. I am sure that it was in Kiev; I myself took part in this operation.
Testimony of gas van driver Wilhelm Findeisen
Source of quote:
http://www.pgonline.com/electriczen/findeisen.html
Greater protection is needed for the lighting system. The grill should cover the lamps high enough up to make it impossible to break the bulbs. It seems that these lamps are hardly ever turned on, so the users have suggested that they could be done away with. Experience shows, however, that when the back door is closed and it gets dark inside, the load pushes hard against the door. The reason for this is that when it becomes dark inside the load rushes toward what little light remains. This hampers the locking of the door. It has also been noticed that the noise provoked by the locking of the door is linked to the fear aroused by the darkness. It is therefore expedient to keep the lights on before the operation and during the first few minutes of its duration. Lighting is also useful for night work and for cleaning of the interior of the van.
From Just’s letter to Rauff of 5 June 1942.
Source of quote:
http://www.pgonline.com/electriczen/doc ... auff1.html
<<With the exception of the quote supplied by Dr. Keren, who surely wouldn't lie about a thing like that, and the one from Codoh, which I can vouch for, all your quotes are hearsay coming from Nizkor!>>
Now that’s hilarious. Smith is contending that Nizkor invented statements as Bergian as this one:
From:
[email protected] (Friedrich Berg) Newsgroups: alt.revisionism Subject: Real War Criminals Date: 23 Jun 1994 12:08:33 -0400 Organization: International Internet Association. Lines: 47 Message-ID: <2ucc21$
[email protected]> NNTP-Posting-Host: mary.iia.org Summary: The worst war criminals Keywords: WW2 With all of the bleating about the dearly beloved and lost six million Jews, one may lose sight of the fact that real war crimes occurred during WW2 and that these real war crimes were at least partially inspired by Jewish hatemongers not unlike many of the hatemongers busily at work in this newsgroup. The Jewish Holocaust is a hoax as anyone who examines the subject seriously quickly recognizes, but even if the Jewish Holocaust were true in every fantastic detail, the war crimes committed by the United States were far worse. The US of A turned entire cities into crematory ovens. The bombing of civilian targets was a monstrous crime the likes of which has never occurred in the history of the world. The atrocities of Genghis Khan or Attila or anyone else that one can think of pale by comparison. The vast majority of America's atrocious bombing occurred when there was absolutely no danger to the US at all. In the case of Japan, America's bombing campaign became more atrocious as Japan became ever more willing to surrender. They were unwilling to accept unconditional surrender until the very end but they had been trying to surrender as early as January of 1945--and yet the good old USA began to roast the Japs with its raid on Tokyo in February and continued this policy until the atomic bombs were dropped. If the Nazis had gassed people to death that would have been a crime but that would still have been humane compared to what this country actually did and then watched on television on Sunday nights for years with Walter Cronkite providing commentary in the Twentieth Century and Air Power CBS TV series. No wonder that Silence of the Lambs was such a successful movie--America is a criminally insane society from top to bottom! Some of the participants in this newsgroup seem to be religious. I suggest that you pray real hard that there is no God because if there is a God, and if he is anything like the thing you imagine--that is to say a God who punishes criminals--then this country is in big trouble. America is in trouble anyway; looking at New York and every major city as it becomes another Slumopolis one should wonder if he isn't there helping things along. Take down those crosses and menorahs from your alt ars and put up replicas of atomic bombs insteads because atomic bombs are what has saved this country so far from some of the consequences of its own criminal stupidity and viciousness. Without nuclear weapons you would all be praying for Adolf to come back and save your assess from Communism and the Jews. FPBERG
http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/people/b/ ... /berg.0694
or this one:
From
[email protected] Sun Aug 23 12:34:08 EDT 1998 Article: 199701 of alt.revisionism Path: trends.ca!hub.org!news.maxwell.syr.edu!news-peer.gip.net!news.gsl.net!gip.net!portc01.blue.aol.com!audrey03.news.aol.com!not-for-mail From:
[email protected] (Dieselzykl) Newsgroups: alt.revisionism Subject: Re: My Holocaust Experiences - by Charles V. Ferree Lines: 29 Message-ID: <
[email protected]> NNTP-Posting-Host: ladder03.news.aol.com X-Admin:
[email protected] Date: 22 Aug 1998 19:34:53 GMT Organization: AOL
http://www.aol.com References: <
[email protected]> Xref: trends.ca alt.revisionism:199701 Dear Ferree, I suggest you look at the handiwork of PIGS like you. Take a good look someday at pictures of real holocaust victims from the cities where millions of women and children were murdered, often by being roasted alive, by PIGS like you. And yet PIGS like you have the nerve, chutzpah is the better word, to complain about scenes of victims who died as an indirect result only of PIGS like you. None of those scenes of masses of dead at Dachau or Buchenwald would have occurred if the Nazis could have prevented it. Those scenes did not occur before 1945 and not until PIGS like you strafed everything that moved on the ground. Many of those dead in the train at Dachau were from fifty calibre machine gun fire. That was standard American aircraft ammunition calibre. Dr Larson established that. Those deaths were only from PIGS like you. Go to HELL where PIGS like you truly belong. FPBerg
http://www.nizkor.org/ftp.cgi/people/b/ ... /berg.9808
True Believer imbecility stops at nothing, for sure. I strongly doubt that Smith can provide a shred of evidence that Nizkor falsified Berg’s statements, but he’s welcome to try. These statements are just what I would have expected from a “Revisionist” Minister of Science who exhorts his flock to:
Keep the Faith fellow revisionists. The Nazis and the SS were the good guys--but the anti-Nazis and the anti-revisionists dare not admit it for fear of losing their fabulous, ill gotten gains from the war.
“Hoaxbuster” Friedrich Paul Berg on the Codoh discussion forum.
http://www.codoh.org/dcforum/DCForumID9/143.html#10
Boy, the Reverend sure hates me. Which I can understand, considering how I keep whipping him every time he holds one of his beaten sermons.