Annaberg 1921

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RCW Mark
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Re: Annaberg 1921

Postby RCW Mark » 24 Jun 2008 05:16

What I'm after, Benoit -- if it exists -- is some indication of the Polish units involved, especially their names, origins and numbers. For those purposes I will be able to figure out a text in Polish. Even maps of positions would be a start.

kiirk
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Re: Annaberg 1921

Postby kiirk » 28 Jul 2008 19:26

hey friend
if You want to, You may translated what I write (i'm from Poland).

P.S. sorry for my english

Co wy wiecie o powstaniu śląskim. było ono niepodległościowym zrywem przeciw wielowiekowej niewoli niemieckiej. Selbstschutz był jednostką która masowo mordowała bestialsko polską ludność cywilną i powstańców. Nie możecie pisać o trzecim powstaniu nie znając go ani trochę, tak samo jak ja nie piszę o powstaniach w egzotycznych mi państwach. Zapraszam do zapoznania się z polskojęzycznymi opracowaniami...

pozdrawiam

Jan-Hendrik
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Re: Annaberg 1921

Postby Jan-Hendrik » 28 Jul 2008 19:55

Selbstschutz był jednostką która masowo mordowała bestialsko polską ludność cywilną i powstańców.


Kłamstwo :wink:

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kiirk
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Re: Annaberg 1921

Postby kiirk » 28 Jul 2008 20:17

nie wiem na jakiej podstawie wyciągasz takie wnioski ale zdumiewa mnie twoja ignorancja. w niemalze każdej wsi są rodziny które straciły kogoś w powstaniu zamordowanego przez tą PARAMILITARNĄ jednostkę. Strzebiniów, Kalinowice itd...
Znasz dokument Ludygi-Laskowskiego przechowywany w MUzeum Czynu powstańczego na Górze św. Anny?

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Marcus Wendel
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Re: Annaberg 1921

Postby Marcus Wendel » 28 Jul 2008 20:58

Please post in English.

/Marcus

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RCW Mark
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Re: Annaberg 1921

Postby RCW Mark » 29 Jul 2008 06:17

Not only write in English, but stick to the topic. Some of us would like to know about who fought at Annaberg, and what happened.

I care not a cent for your political views (or anyone else's) on who was right and who committed the most atrocities. Go somewhere else for that please.

kiirk
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Re: Annaberg 1921

Postby kiirk » 30 Jul 2008 17:17

ok, first i very, very sorry for my english...
what exacly do you want to know about third revolt?

An Allied-supervised plebiscite was finally held in March 1921 to decide the future of Silesia. The residents of north and west Silesia, being mostly German, voted to remain as part of Germany. The German electorate represented about 60% of the population of Silesia. The Poles, although with a smaller overall percentage of the vote, carried the southern and eastern parts of Silesia. Silesia was effectively split by the plebiscite.


this true, but not all. on german side most of voting was emigrants. they came from western germany and they wasnt a silesian people. they was 182 288 persons (19,3% of voting)...

In Museum on St. Anna Mountain are many documents about third revolt. There is a list of civilian who was murdered about Selbstschutz. That a paramilitary forces and i can't be a objective abot this formation, couse many of my and my friend family members was murdered by selbstschutz...

if you have any question i answer you with pleasure:)...

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Re: Annaberg 1921

Postby RCW Mark » 31 Jul 2008 06:03

what exacly do you want to know about third revolt?


The nature of the units of Poles fighting and the number of men in each unit. Most especially during the fighting around Annaberg.

Even a map showing the positions of Polish units would help. (The German stuff is easy to find.)

It is often alleged that regular Polish military took part in the fighting, more or less in disguise. And often alleged otherwise. Were any of the units actually from the Polish army as a whole? (As opposed to individuals who joined militia units.)

kiirk
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Re: Annaberg 1921

Postby kiirk » 31 Jul 2008 21:21

In the third revolt on Polish side were fighting:

East group: 15929 soldiers on command of Karol Grzesik
South group: 10169 soldiers on command of Bronisław Sikorski allias Cietrzew
North group: 9544 soldiers on command of Alojzy Nowak and Jan Wyglenda

Was 22 panzer trains and 6 panzer cars.

The most of commanders were service in Polish army. They were especially from Wielkopolska, Poznań (it's part of Poland on western-north of silesia), but most of soldier was civilian from Silesia and they were fighting for they land. Third revolt was spontain act. polish goverment was help silesian people and Wojciech Korfanty - dictator of revolt.

polish panzer train Korfanty
Image

maybe tomorrow I will scan some of maps and put on this side...

Ok soon more informations:)...

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Benoit Douville
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Re: Annaberg 1921

Postby Benoit Douville » 01 Aug 2008 01:43

Kiirk,

That's good info to had to this thread, maps would be great too. You said that In Museum on St. Anna Mountain they are many documents about third revolt, is there some documents available in english?

Regards

kiirk
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Re: Annaberg 1921

Postby kiirk » 01 Aug 2008 20:48

Image

in the legend of map is:

obszar zajęty powstaniem - space of revolt
linia frontu... - front line
mosty kolejowe... - train bridge which was exploaded in first days of revolt
miasta blokowane przez powstańców - city which ocupated by silesian people

on the map:

grupa północ - north group
grupa wschód - east group
grupa południe - south group
Góra św. Anny - St. Anna Mountain (Annaberg[ger.])

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Re: Annaberg 1921

Postby RCW Mark » 01 Aug 2008 21:18

That's super stuff Kiirk! Thanks a lot. :D Such small forces involved.

Do you have any maps that show the fighting around Góra św. Anny (Annaberg) closer up?

kiirk
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Re: Annaberg 1921

Postby kiirk » 01 Aug 2008 22:12

Yes i think so... I must look after it. Maybe tomorrow I put something

Jan-Hendrik
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Re: Annaberg 1921

Postby Jan-Hendrik » 04 Aug 2008 06:03

this true, but not all. on german side most of voting was emigrants. they came from western germany and they wasnt a silesian people. they was 182 288 persons (19,3% of voting)...


Interestingly you forgot to mention how many Poles where "imported" into Silesia to support the polish will to annex Silesia (as the Poles were already 200% supported by the French )...

Jan-Hendrik

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Re: Annaberg 1921

Postby Tullius » 04 Aug 2008 20:14

> this true, but not all. on german side most of voting was emigrants. they came from western germany and they wasnt a silesian people. they was 182 288 persons (19,3% of voting)...

Sorry Kiirk, but that's not quite true the way you wrote it. The persons you are talking about had been born within the plebicite area but that weren't living in it a the time of the plebicite. So the were indeed Silesians. Actually another 10.120 of this category voted for Poland.


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