Historical place names (1937-1945)

Discussions on all aspects of the Japanese Empire, from the capture of Taiwan until the end of the Second World War.
Joan Pinyol
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Historical place names (1937-1945)

#1

Post by Joan Pinyol » 12 Jul 2015, 23:34

Dear friends,

In attached file you will find a table with equivalences between historical names and modern names (or alternate names that you can find in literature or in primary sources). This is still a work in progress. I will update it when it will be completed.

Kind regards
Attachments
Place name in 1937.pdf
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Wellgunde
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Re: Historical place names (1937-1945)

#2

Post by Wellgunde » 13 Jul 2015, 04:30

This is a very worthy project. Some suggestions:
Pusan and Chinhae Bay are two different places. Chinhae is a city around twenty miles west of Pusan.
Korean—English--Japanese
Jejudo—Chejudo—Saishū (Saisyuu)
Jinhae-gu (formerly Jinhae-si)—Chinhae—Chinkai
Busan (formerly Pusan)—Pusan—Fusan

Tachikawa Airbase was located in the cities of Tachikawa-shi and Akishima-shi, parts of the Tokyo Metropolis (Tōkyō-to)
Tarawa -modern day country of Kiribati
Marcus Island was originally name Sebastian López by the Spanish discoverers and later as Mizutani by the first Japanese colonists. Once Japanese claims were officially acknowledged it was renamed Minami-Tori-Shima although it continued to be called Marcus island on American charts.
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CINCPAC
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Re: Historical place names (1937-1945)

#3

Post by CINCPAC » 13 Jul 2015, 17:38

This is a great resource. Thank you!

Now if there was a pronunciation guide out there!

Rich

Joan Pinyol
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Re: Historical place names (1937-1945)

#4

Post by Joan Pinyol » 13 Jul 2015, 18:24

Thanks a lot,

I will add your suggestions to the list.

Kind regards

Joan Pinyol
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Re: Historical place names (1937-1945)

#5

Post by Joan Pinyol » 13 Jul 2015, 23:57

Update 1. The Taiwanese names are almost completed (main places). As for Manchurian names I've found a postal stamp collectors web page on Manchukuo stamps. It seems that Manchurian stamps 1931-1945 are very rare and valuable. In a web page the collectors have compilled the Manchurian place names (cities with post office) with its equivalence to Chinese modern names and contemporary names given by Japanese (a treasury). I added the suhggestions made by my friend Wellgunde.

By the way, Ken, a forum member, is working on China place names of 1937-1945. He will contribute to complete China section.

Kind regards
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Place names 1937-1945 - Update 1.pdf
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hisashi
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Re: Historical place names (1937-1945)

#6

Post by hisashi » 14 Jul 2015, 05:42

In general, Okinawa Islands is far smaller than 'islands related to the battle of Okinawa'.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Okinawa_Islands


We call far broader area as 'Nansei Shoto=southwest islands'.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/ ... Chikei.gif

Ryukyu Islands is a little vague ward. It roughly refers to 'Islands in Okinawa pref.' but some users inclufe those in Kagoshima prefectures, especially Amami and Tanegashima. I propose to use narrower sense to distinguish prefectures in any reference. Only a few islands are affected.



[Fumagata Tokyo]
unknown.
[Hamaoka Fukuoka Prefecture]
Perhaps in Shizuoka prefecture, now a part of Omaezaki city.
[Hoyo Saganoseki, Ōita Prefecture]
Perhaps it was originally somewhat lyrical expression. Hoyo Strait, often referred as Bungo Suido, is a strait between Oita and Ehime/Kochi prefecture. Saganoseki is a penninsula city in Oita facing this strait. The two should be split to two item.
[Idemura Shizuoka Prefecture]
mura=village. So it can be Ide village or Idemura. I guess it referred to Iride village, Shizuoka Prefecture.
Kamigahara Airfield Gifu Prefecture not Kamigahara but Kagamigahara
[Kaya Kumamoto Prefecture]
There are a few Kaya in Japan but I cannot find any in Kumamoto, and any of them seems unrelated to military.
[Kumatani Tokyo]
Perhaps it7s a mistake of 熊谷, Kumagaya city, Saitama prefecture.
[Matabe Kyōto Prefecture]No location name found in Japan.
[Tama Murayama, Yamagata Prefecture]
Perhaps it is a mistake of Okitama area and Murayama area in Yamagata prefecture.
Tokorozawa Airfield not Gifu Prefecture but Saitama Prefecture
*Perhaps this misspecification came from that Kagamigahara Airfield in Gifu Pref. was the second (to Tokorozawa) army airfield.
Wakamatsu Island, Gotō Islands, Nagasaki Prefecture
Amami Ōshima not Ryukyu Islands but Amami Islands, Kagoshima prefecture
Ishigaki Island not Ryukyu Islands but Yaeyama Islands , Okinawa Prefecture
Miyakojima not Ryukyu Islands but Miyako Islands, Okinawa Prefecture
Naha Okinawa
Nakagusuku Bay Okinawa, Buckner Bay
Okinawa Ryukyu Islands, Okinawa Prefecture /Funauki(船浮 or 舟浮) is a location name in Iriomote Island. Separate Funauki as an item?
Tanegashima Ōsumi Islands(Kagoshima pref.), not Ryukyu Islands
Tokunoshima not Ryukyu Islands but Amami Islands,Kagoshima prefecture
Attu not Chishima (Kuril Islands) but Aleutian Islands (Alaska)
Kiska not Chishima (Kuril Islands) but Aleutian Islands (Alaska)

Eugen Pinak
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Re: Historical place names (1937-1945)

#7

Post by Eugen Pinak » 14 Jul 2015, 14:33

Joan Pinyol wrote:In attached file you will find a table with equivalences between historical names and modern names (or alternate names that you can find in literature or in primary sources). This is still a work in progress. I will update it when it will be completed.
I can only thank you for attempting such a praiseworthy project. Multiple (an sometimes simply incorrect) spellings are really troublesome, when dealing with multiple sources.
Few comments, though:
1) It will be good to standardize the writing of place names - sometimes you are writing them with additions like "island", sometimes not, sometimes you are writing them in the language of local people, sometimes you are writing them in the language of the state, which owns the land.
2) In most cases "Modern names or more ancient names" in your table provide different spellings, not more modern or more ancient names - maybe it should be reflected in the name of the column?
3) When using Chinese or Japanese sources, it will be good to have writing in kanji or kana added to youк table.

And now some corrections and additions.
Baoding - also Paoting
Canton - correct name is Guǎngzhōu, Canton is Europeans' name for the city
Peking - was renamed to Beiping (or Peiping) in 1928 - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beiping
Nanking - also Nankin, old name was Jiangning
Cap Saint-Jacques in French Indo-China - now Vung Tau
Singapore - named Shonan by Japanese
Bandung - Kota Bandung means just "Bandung city", it's not a different spelling, but Dutch Bandoeng - is
Celebes - now Sulawesi
Halmahera - also Jailolo, or Gilolo
Hansa Bay, Lae, Madang, Wewak - have nothing with Dutch East Indies
Makassar - also Macassar, Mangkasara', from 1971 to 1999 named Ujung Pandang,
Munda - was on New Georgia, not New Ireland
Rabaul - was know before as Simpsonhafen, New Prussia was an old name for the island where it stood
Davao - Nueva Guipuzcoa was name of province, not a town, town of Davao was named Nueva Bergara
Wake - named Otori-Shima by Japanese
Wonsan - Genzan
Pyonguang - Heijo
Kunashiri - now Kunashir
Paramushiru - now Paramushir
Kashiwahara - correct is Kashiwa_b_ara, now Severo-Kurilsk
Iwo Jima - Io

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Wellgunde
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Re: Historical place names (1937-1945)

#8

Post by Wellgunde » 14 Jul 2015, 15:37

Iwo Jima
Named originally by the Spanish as Isla de Azufre. Charted by Captain Cook as Sulphur Island, the literal translation of the Spanish. The Japanese named it Iwō-tō, (spelled post war as Iō-tō). The Japanese Navy during the war mistakenly called it Iwo Jima. Tō and Jima are alternate readings for the Japanese kanji for island (shima). Until the return of the island by the United States it was called Iwo Jima in both countries. Recently, the Japanese government changed the pronunciation of the name back to Iō-tō. Regardless of how it has been "spelled" and pronounced in kana and Romaji, the name in kanji has always been the same: 硫黄島.
Rabaul
Rabaul, now abandoned following a 1994 volcanic eruption, was a town located on the island of New Britain, in what is now Papua New Guinea. The town gave its name to a large number of military installations which were collectively known by both the Japanese and the Allies as "Rabaul."
Japanese: ラバウル Rabauru
Pearl Harbor
A U.S. Naval Base in the U.S. Territory of Hawaii (now the U.S. State of Hawaii)
Japanese: 真珠湾 Shinzyuwan
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Re: Historical place names (1937-1945)

#9

Post by Eugen Pinak » 14 Jul 2015, 16:28

Wellgunde wrote:Pearl Harbor
A U.S. Naval Base in the U.S. Territory of Hawaii (now the U.S. State of Hawaii)
Japanese: 真珠湾 Shinzyuwan
Really??? I had no idea, that Japanese gave kanji name to Pearl Harbor. I thought they re-named only those places they conquered.
BTW, Guam was renamed Ōmiya-To or Ōmiya-Jima - which spelling is correct?

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hisashi
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Re: Historical place names (1937-1945)

#10

Post by hisashi » 14 Jul 2015, 17:03

For example, 紐育 meant New York. It was from resembling sound (if any:-)) of kanji and original name.
摩天楼 Matenro have referred to tall constructions, especially in Manhattan. 摩=rub 天=sky 楼=tower was apparently direct translation of skyscraper.
Then 真珠湾. 真珠=Pearl 湾=Bay. So Japanese did not think they named it. Simply translated it.
Similarly, Golden Gate Bridge in San Francisco have been often refeered in Japan as 金門橋 Kinmonkyo. 金=Gold 門=Gate 橋=Bridge and the naming has nothing to do with any attack plan.

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Re: Historical place names (1937-1945)

#11

Post by Joan Pinyol » 14 Jul 2015, 21:07

Dear friends,

I'm overwhelmed by your interest and your attentions. My sincere thanks to all, particularly to my friend Wellgunde (he firstly opened fire), to Ken Q (who has send me a very complete list on China, Taiwan, Korea and Manchuria), to Hisashi and Eugene Pinak. I have attached a new update.

Some comments:
The "standarization" is difficult because we are talking about a lot of giant countries with different languages. In wartimes "official name" is a relative question: At least two sides have often two distinct official names. In countries with shared sovereignty usually are two "official names". I just have tried to put in a list all the alternative names that we can find in as ordered form as possible.

The first column:
China: the postal romanization of the place names most usual in 1937-1945.
Manchuria: the postal romanization of Manchukuo State official names, with the Japanese names (also official) in the thrid column.
Korea and Taiwan: the Japanese names official in that time.
European dominions in South-east Asia: the English, Dutch or French official name in that time.

Eugene, you are right, I must add the original names in Kanji or Kana. This is a work that needs time.
Kind regards
Attachments
Place names in 1937-1945 - Update 2.pdf
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Re: Historical place names (1937-1945)

#12

Post by Stephen_Rynerson » 15 Jul 2015, 05:27

Very nice work, Joan! I had just recently been thinking of putting something similar for China together given not only the number of different spellings of place names under various transliteration systems, but also the fact that outright renaming cities seems to have been more common in Republican-era China (e.g., Hezhou/Hochow renamed to Linxia/Lin-hsia; Ningxia/Ning-hsia City renamed to Yinchuan/Yin-Chu'an/Yinchwan, etc.).

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Re: Historical place names (1937-1945)

#13

Post by Wellgunde » 15 Jul 2015, 08:03

When I first visited Japan around fifty years ago, I asked someone about Pearl Harbor. They didn't know what I was talking about because they only knew it as something completely different. That has probably changed now that several million Japanese tourists have been on Pearl Harbor cruises. Plus the recent international mega flop Pearl Harbor also likely has helped to educate the Japanese public as to the English name of the place.

Geography is a fundamental element of war. Wars are fought over geography, battle sites selected because of geography, and logistical routes influenced by geography. Small wonder then that U.S. Army and Navy military intelligence published numerous gazetteers of places in East Asia and the Pacific. One thing I would suggest is to buy a Japanese-English tourist atlas. You should be able to find several on Amazon.

Another point to consider. For example, Shanghai. Both Chinese and Japanese both use 上海. However, the pronunciation in Japanese and Chinese is different.

Wade-Giles was the system in use during World War II for romanizing Chinese. It differs considerably from Pin Yin which is the generally recognized international method in use today.
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Re: Historical place names (1937-1945)

#14

Post by hisashi » 15 Jul 2015, 17:49

BTW, Guam was renamed Ōmiya-To or Ōmiya-Jima - which spelling is correct?
Without showing source, Japanese Wikipedia read it as Daikyu-to. On the other hand, in a Q&A site an old man replied citizens called it as Omiya-Jima. He also guessed Radio announcers might read 大宮島 as Daikyu-to, associating it with Singapore, Shonan-to.

On JACAR C12070500500, a destination code list of navy post system, 大宮島 appeared in part 'O'. So Daikyu-to was an exceptional reading, if any.

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Re: Historical place names (1937-1945)

#15

Post by Wellgunde » 17 Jul 2015, 03:47

Joan, Stephen, Eugen, and Hisashi. This is an interesting and very enjoyable thread. I hope each of you and perhaps some new people as well will continue to add tidbits to Joan's project. I suggest that perhaps this topic should be "stickied."
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