Help identify artillery bunkers in Lithuania

Discussions on the fortifications, artillery, & rockets used by the Axis forces.
jopaerya
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#16

Post by jopaerya » 02 Aug 2006, 14:53

Hi Torsten

You are 100 % right , I made a typo M.FL.A. 217 and
M.Fl.A. 218 im aufstellung had together 9 batteries , as
you can see in the last lines the M.F.A. 217 had only 4
batteries at 15-01-1945 . Here the list of personnel of the 217 .

A other question as you can see the 7,5 batterie was also on
the Nehrung see v.Harnier and the plan from Bantitaz maybe
Bachmann is also Jachmann also a famous Navy man ?

M.Fl.A. 217 (Memel)
U-Seeko. Schleswig-Holstein / Meckelenburg
Erste aufstellung 23. August 1939 aber 13. Oktober 1939 aufgelöscht. 19. März 1941 wieder aufgestellt aber 31. Dezember 1941 aufgelöscht. Zum dritte mal 21. August 1942 aufgestellt.

1. Aufstellung (23.8.1939 – 13.10.1939)
Kdr.:
23.08.1939 – 13.10.1939 Kptlt. Hans-Erik Pochhammer

2. Aufstellung (19.3.1941 – 31.12.1941)
Kdr.:
19.03.1941 – 31.10.1941 Kptlt (MA)d.R. / K.Kapt.(MA)d.R. Kurt Kosack
31.10.1941 – 31.12.1941 K.Kapt.(MA)d.R. (Dipl.Ing.) Richard Kufner (i.V.)
Kapt. beim Stab:
20.03.1941 – 15.11.1941 Kptlt.(MA)d.R. Ernst Herzberg
Adjutant:
20.03.1941 – 18.09.1941 Lt.(MA)d.R. Gerhard Seewald (gefallen)
13.10.1941 – 15.11.1941 Lt.(MA)d.R. Hermann Böker
Stabsoffizier:
20.03.1941 – 15.11.1941 Kptlt.(MA)d.R. Hans-Hermann Thiele
Abteilungsverwaltungsoffizier:
20.03.1941 – 15.11.1941 Oblt.(V)d.R. Wilhelm Breithaupt
Abteilungsarzt:
20.03.1941 – 15.11.1941 M.Ob.Ass.Arzt d.R. (Dr.med.) Hans Vüllers
Batteriechef:
20.03.1941 – 15.11.1941 Kptlt.(MA)d.R. Richard Kufner
20.03.1941 – 15.11.1941 Kptlt.(MA)d.R. Erwin Philipp
20.03.1941 – 15.11.1941 Oblt.(MA)d.R. (Dr.jur.) Günther Feuerhake
22.03.1941 – 15.11.1941 Oblt.(MA)d.R. Eugen Möhn
20.03.1941 – 15.11.1941 Lt.(MA)d.R. Fritz Halseband
20.03.1941 – 15.11.1941 Lt.(MA)d.R. Heinz Fellermann
Batterieoffizier:
20.03.1941 – 15.11.1941 Oblt.(MA)d.R. Erich Gorges
01.10.1941 – 15.11.1941 Lt.(MA)d.R. Willy Nolte
20.03.1941 – 15.11.1941 Lt.(MA)d.R. Fritz Fischer
25.08.1941 – 15.11.1941 Lt.(MA)d.R. Werner Glinka
28.09.1941 – 15.11.1941 Lt.(MA)d.R. Karl Schostakowski
08.06.1941 – 15.11.1941 Lt.(MA)d.R. Friedrich Kuhlmann

3. Aufstellung (ab 21.8.1942)
Kdr.:
21.08.1942 – 26.01.1945 K.Kapt.(MA)d.R. Konrad Ruthenberg
27.01.1945 – 28.02.1945 Kptlt.(MA)d.R. Bernhard Sperlich
Kapt. beim Stab:
00.00.1943 - 26.01.1945 Oblt.(MA)d.R. Hermann Koelsch
Adjutant:
12.02.1944 - Kptlt.(MA)d.R. Hans Ludwigsen
Verwaltungsoffizier:
17.08.1942 – 16.03.1944 Kptlt.(V)z.V. Felix Bayerl
17.03.1944 - 26.01.1945 Kptlt.(V)d.R. Heinrich Christian
1. Verwaltunsoffizier:
11.09.1944 - 26.01.1945 Lt.(V)d.R. Karl-Heinz Wernicke
Abteilungsarzt:
27.08.1942 – 29.12.1942 M.Ob.St.Arzt d.R. (Dr.med.) Hans Dietel
30.12.1942 – 25.11.1943 M.St.Arzt d.R. (Dr.med.) Heinz Brill
26.11.1943 – 26.01.1945 M.Ob.St.Arzt d.R. (Dr.med.) Max Bauer
1. Abteilungsarzt:
26.01.1945 M.St.Arzt d.R. (Dr.med.) Erwin Kümmel
Stabsoffizieren:
19.09.1943 - 26.01.1945 Lt.(MA)d.R. Karl Lehrer
19.09.1943 - 26.01.1945 Oblt.(MA)d.R. Heinich van Bömmel
Batteriechef:
20.03.1944 - Kptlt.(MA)d.R. (Dr.rer.pol.) Peter Ingenlauf
01.05.1943 – 26.01.1945 Kptlt.(MA)d.R. Bernhard Sperlich
27.04.1944 – 26.01.1945 Kptlt.(MA)(Kr.O.) Arthur Schäfer
17.09.1942 – 26.01.1945 Oblt.(MA)(Kr.O.) Frits Adam
26.01.1945 Oblt.(MA)d.R. Johann Aumund
17.09.1942 – 26.01.1945 Oblt.(MA)d.R. Herbert Weiss
15.10.1942 – 26.01.1945 Oblt.(MA)d.R. Horst Schlutius
07.09.1943 – 26.01.1945 Oblt.(MA)d.R. Werner Brendemühl
15.03.1943 – 26.01.1945 Oblt.(MA)d.R. Hanns-Weddo Fehrenbacher
Batterieoffizier:
30.12.1943 – 26.01.1945 Oblt.(MA)d.R. Herbert Klein
28.09.1942 – 26.01.1945 Oblt.(MA)d.R. Hans Flogaus
30.08.1942 – 26.01.1945 Oblt.(MA)d.R. Heinrich Puls
12.04.1944 – 26.01.1945 Oblt.(MA)d.R. Gerhard Detert
03.04.1944 – 26.01.1945 Oblt.(MA)d.R. Cäsar Sebestaloydolt
11.12.1943 – 26.01.1945 Lt.(MA) Horst-Günther Schrecke
26.10.1944 – 26.01.1945 Lt.(MA)(Kr.O.) Kurt Knebel
25.01.1944 – 26.01.1945 Lt.(MA)d.R. Alfons Knöller
12.04.1944 – 26.01.1945 Lt.(MA)d.R. Werner Orth

Batterien: (Stand: 15.1.1945)
1./217: Stabsbatterie
2./217: Schw.Battr.
3./217: Schw.Battr.
4./217: Schw.Battr.
5./217: Schw.Battr.
6./217: Le.Flak-Battr.
7./217: Scheinwerferbatterie

Regards Jos

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Heimatschuss
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#17

Post by Heimatschuss » 02 Aug 2006, 14:58

Hello Banditaz,
Also, in "Batterie Schweinsrücken" you can see pink dot. It's not marked artillery position (looks like photo '6.jpg'. There are two of these).

So, second question: why it is written, that in "Batterie Schweinsrücken" there are only 4 guns, if there is 5 + 2 (those two different) artillery positions?


Thanks for your patience.

P.S. S_haule, can you find it (I think this is stupid question)?
The guns are not the only equipment of a flak battery that has to be protected against enemy fire in a concrete pit. Each german flak battery had at least one "Kommandogerät" with a large optical range finder (4m or 6m base). A "Kommandogerät" is a kind of big mechanical computer that processes the trajectory of an enemy plane and the guns' positions into the direction and elevation the gun barrels need to hit the plane. If the battery was designed to fight on its own the "Kommandogerät" was located in a concrete pit in the center of the position.
Some flak emplacements also had their own radar sets. The two concrete pits detached from the others could also have contained light flak guns that had the job of protecting the heavy guns against low level attack during air raids.
A good introductory text on german flak sites can be found here:http://www.missing-lynx.com/library/ger ... izsen.html


Regarding your question so S_haule:
Perhaps he is referring to the Kriegsmarine coastal battery at Försterei. See the map Jos provided for an approximate position. Some of your photos that show a bunker on the beach at Giurliai (Försterei) could be from the coastal battery.

Best regards
Torsten
Last edited by Heimatschuss on 02 Aug 2006, 19:35, edited 4 times in total.


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Heimatschuss
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#18

Post by Heimatschuss » 02 Aug 2006, 15:33

Hi Jos,
A other question as you can see the 7,5 batterie was also on
the Nehrung see v.Harnier and the plan from Bantitaz maybe
Bachmann is also Jachmann also a famous Navy man ?
I would say that this really is a possibility. With a flak emplacement in Bachmann the distribution of fire power looks uneven somehow. Planes approaching from the East should already be dealt with by the Löllen battery.
A Google search gave me Eduard (von) Jachmann as one of the founding fathers of Germany's navy so applying his name to a naval battery seems somewhat logical. In particular if the location had no geographical name before.

With this approach your decision to name Banditaz's mysterious ??? emplacement Bachmann/Jachmann appears to be well founded.

Best regards
Torsten

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Heimatschuss
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#19

Post by Heimatschuss » 06 Aug 2006, 16:47

Hello Banditaz,

the bunkers shown on this site http://galerija.voras.lt/Juodoji-tvirtove?page=1 are a naval coastal battery (M.K.B., Marineküstenbatterie) in my opinion. The bunkes are much too big for a flak emplacement.

Note that Jos's map above also shows a coastal battery with 4 15cm guns at Försterei (Giruliai). I'm currently trying to find out what happened to this battery but it's all quite vague so far.

With regards to the other objects in this thread: http://www.antraspasaulinis.net/forum_v ... hp?7.29271

Pic1:
Building made from brick. If it's german at all it must have been built before World War I. Afterwards concrete with steel reinforcements was much prefered.
Pic 2-4:
Building also from bricks, see above. The room does not have a solid floor it seem's. That would be very uncommon for a german building. German cellars almost always have a floor from stone or concrete. Therefore russian in my opinion.
Pic5-19:
Many objects totally derelict, can't tell. The various entrances (to airraid shelters?) may provide a clue but they don't ring a bell with me.
Pic.20-24
Blockhouse from prefabricated concrete slabs chained together. I've never seen something like this in connection with german forces. It's either a local improvisation during the soviet assault in 1944 or a post-war construction. In my eyes the style looks soviet.
Pic.26-34
Koch-Bunker, named after Erich Koch, the gauleiter of East Prussia, who was an advocate of this type.
German
Pic.35-39
Style looks german, but I can't give you a certain bunker type number so far.

Best regards
Torsten

banditaz
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Location: Lithuania

#20

Post by banditaz » 23 Aug 2006, 20:01

Hello all!

So I'm back with a little bit photos. Here they are:
Batterie Schweisbrücken
Batterie Mellneraggen
Batterie Försterei (or Marineküstenbatterie? as in book jopaerya gave me, there is written, that this batterie has 8 (4 new and 4 old?) places for 150 mm guns, so may be it's Marineküstenbatterie? P.S. that building on the top of SK was built by Soviet's army)

Comments in albums are welcome.


And Heimatschuss, thanks for the link about Flak! I was searching something like this.
P.S. In few days I'll take some photos of Batterie Bachmann.

jopaerya
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#21

Post by jopaerya » 23 Aug 2006, 20:22

HI Banditaz

Thanks for the great pictures of the batteries 8O

Regards Jos

jopaerya
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#22

Post by jopaerya » 23 Aug 2006, 20:47

Hello Again

The bettung on this picture is for a 12,8 cm Flak 40 M
http://public.fotki.com/banditaz/fortif ... ai/52.html
Please see this drawing , so mayby later a M.F.B. ???

Regards Jos
Attachments
bettung 12.8 cm Flak 40 M.jpg
bettung 12.8 cm Flak 40 M.jpg (87.72 KiB) Viewed 6518 times

banditaz
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#23

Post by banditaz » 24 Aug 2006, 11:08

http://public.fotki.com/banditaz/fortif ... ai/52.html and http://public.fotki.com/banditaz/fortif ... ai/35.html (total - 4) are similar (only in photo 52 bettung was destroyed by the Soviet's missile). Such big bettung for 12,8 cm?

http://public.fotki.com/banditaz/fortif ... ai/67.html these also for 12,8? Or for 150 mm? It is said, that these are older bettungs.

pavle
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#24

Post by pavle » 25 Aug 2006, 15:02

Hi Banditaz

Do you know of any bunkers artillery on the north side of memel?
there are were supposed to be some cliffs on the beach at the north side of memel can you confirm this?

banditaz
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#25

Post by banditaz » 25 Aug 2006, 16:13

I dont't understand your question well.

As you see in jopaerya map, in North of Memel, near the beach there are two artillery batteries: "Batterie Mellneraggen" and "Batterie Försterei" (or M.K.B...).
"Batterie Försterei" is at north of Försterei (or Giruliai), nor so far to, we can call it, cliffs. Those cliffs are called "Olandu kepure" ("Dutch cap" or sth. like that).)

jopaerya
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#26

Post by jopaerya » 25 Aug 2006, 22:09

Hi Banditaz

On your photo from the bottom part of the 12,8 cm
Flak 40 M you can see a other row of bolts , maybe
this was from a former gun that was replaced in the
Atlantikwall , maybe you can mesure next time the
diameter of the ring of the bolts then we can see what
gun there was used .

Regards Jos

Voland
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Re: Help identify artillery bunkers in Lithuania

#27

Post by Voland » 02 Mar 2008, 11:42

The exernal ring of screws on batterie Forsterei (Giruliai) has diamater 195 cm and 16 screws of 6 cm diameter each.
Image

I guess that it is 15 cm SKC 28 gun.
But speaking about guns on Forsterei battery, i must say that shown emplacement is not a emplacement of Forsterei batterie, it is an extra emplacement near double-gun casemates of batterie.

Tje situation on this battery is rather complex:

Image

1,2 - double-gun casemates for naval gun
3 - control post of batterie
4 - extra emplacement, shown on picture above
5 - emplacement with 20 screws, diameter 210 cm - maybe some soviet guns...
6 - emplacement for soviet naval gun B-13 (it was a soviet naval battery after WW2 till 1950)

As for type of naval guns on double casemates, it is difficult to see screws because amplacement are filled with sand. It is information about 4 x 15 cm S.K.L/45 in M.P.L. gun on some Memel battery in january 1941. As I understand, SKL - is central-axe-mounting. Maybe we could try to clean one basement to see some screws...

jopaerya
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Re: Help identify artillery bunkers in Lithuania

#28

Post by jopaerya » 04 Mar 2008, 15:04

Hello Voland

I checked on the 195 cm diameter but I could only find information on the normal German
naval 15 cm gun that only 200cm diameter measured from center bold to center bold .

Regards Jos

Voland
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Re: Help identify artillery bunkers in Lithuania

#29

Post by Voland » 20 Mar 2008, 20:26

Yes, it is quite strange. Emplacement on Memel-Sud has 200 cm and 5 cm screws. Here we have 195 cm and 6 cm screws on 5-th emplecement, build on the ruins of normal emplacement of demolished double- casemates. It is seems to me that casemates were demolished by soviet bombing on june 22 - 24, 1941. After that german repared battery with extra emplecement, build for some non-standart gun (capturend french, etc). It is version without any facts, of course.

More pictures of Memel-Nord here: http://volandkovna.livejournal.com/9393.html#cutid1

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ualexj
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Re: Help identify artillery bunkers in Lithuania

#30

Post by ualexj » 30 Jan 2009, 09:41

here is a photo of batteries in former Pillau as topicstartes asked, maybe it is the famous battr. "Lehmberg". Does anyone have a possibility to attribute?
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e0231c39ebcb.jpg
e0231c39ebcb.jpg (95.13 KiB) Viewed 5533 times

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