Quote from Hermann Göring in 1945.

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dcmatkins
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Quote from Hermann Göring in 1945.

#1

Post by dcmatkins » 16 Jan 2011, 11:12

When asked what was Germanys greatest mistake by Ivone Kirkpaterick . Göring replied "Not invading Spain and North Africa in 1940".
Considering that Göring was to have an high intellegence, does anyone agree or disagree with this statement.

Certainly i think the German Navy saw things in a more strategic light, compared to the Armys lightning war theories.
Hitlers War Directive 30 acknowledged some logical reasoning behind operations in North Africa in 1940.
Did Hitler and his generals lose track of the strategic map. By putting Russia at the top of the agenda to early in the war ?
Last edited by Dieter Zinke on 01 Mar 2012, 15:14, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: The Christian name of Göring is Hermann (not Herman)

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Re: Quote from Hermann Göring in 1945.

#2

Post by murx » 22 Jan 2011, 08:11

To my opinion they didn't have any ambitions or plans in the west. If not pin pricked constantly by the RAF deploying from French airfields"the phony war" would have lastet until today.

In Africa they very soon would have regarded to have fulfilled their duties for the "Duce" and left for home. What should they do in Spain?

Whatever Göring said, non-Germans underestimate the German love for sarcasm. It is contained in every second sentence. When I was late for five minutes, my 5-yerars-old son said: "I 'm waiting here for almost 100 years now". I then replied something like: "I departed yesterday from home, drove through the city with 250 mph but had to wait years in a traffic jam and now I'm just one minute late". If police gets a bank robber and somebody asks him what HIS largest mistake was, he is likey to say something like: "Not to rob the Royal Bank of Scotland (or Fort Knox)". My experience in other countries is to force myself not to say something this way, it is almost always taken for serious. I think Göring was sarcastic.
Last edited by Dieter Zinke on 01 Mar 2012, 15:16, edited 2 times in total.
Reason: Please not Goehring - but Göring !!!!!!!! It is not to believe - and excuse - a shame for our forum.


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Panzerkampfwagen
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Meaning of "Meier"

#3

Post by Panzerkampfwagen » 17 Dec 2011, 09:10

"If an enemy bomb reaches the Ruhr, i shall call myself Meier"

This is one of Göring's famous quotes which eventually back fired on him. As a non German speaking person, i wish to know the meaning/contextual meaning of this word, so that i can appreciate the full value of this quote. Someone please help.

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Re: Quote from Hermann Göring in 1945.

#4

Post by powerglide » 01 Mar 2012, 05:55

Running around fighting countrys that have done nothing to deserve being attacked, in a logical mind, would be to know eventually, all those countrys will get together and stomp your aggression. And that happened to Germany.

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Adam Carr
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Re: Quote from Herman Göring in 1945.

#5

Post by Adam Carr » 01 Mar 2012, 06:56

What Göring said was: "Wenn auch nur ein englischer Bomber die Ruhr erreicht, will ich nicht mehr Hermann Göring, sondern Hermann Meier heißen." This translates literally as "If also only one British bomber reaches the Ruhr, I don't want to be called Hermann Göring any more, but rather Hermann Meier." In German "If X happens, you can call me Meier" is (or at any rate was) a common expression, rather like "If X happens, I'm a Dutchman" or "I'm a monkey's uncle" in English. But it has another layer of meaning, because Meier is commonly seen as a Jewish name in Germany. So this is really saying, "If X happens, I'm a Jew." It is thus an expression of German folk anti-Semitism, and Göring certainly intended his comment to be seen that way.

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Re: Quote from Hermann Göring in 1945.

#6

Post by Jan-Hendrik » 01 Mar 2012, 09:59

But it has another layer of meaning, because Meier is commonly seen as a Jewish name in Germany. So this is really saying, "If X happens, I'm a Jew." It is thus an expression of German folk anti-Semitism,
OMG....what a B*****t :roll:

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Re: Quote from Hermann Göring in 1945.

#7

Post by Michate » 18 Mar 2012, 10:41

But it has another layer of meaning, because Meier is commonly seen as a Jewish name in Germany.
What silly nonsense. Just try and read a telephone book. Meier-Müller-Schulze: the proverbial Mr. Everybody in German.

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Adam Carr
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Re: Quote from Hermann Göring in 1945.

#8

Post by Adam Carr » 18 Mar 2012, 13:10

Just because a name is common in Germany does not mean that it is not seen to be a Jewish name. Other examples are Weiss, Schwarz, Klein, Gross and Gold, because these were names that were commonly assigned to Jews in the 19th century in the German states when they were required to have surnames. These are all common German names, but they have Jewish associations in a way that, for example, Müller and Schmidt do not, because Jews were not millers or smiths. Why did Reinhard Heydrich have a complex about Jews? Because his step-father was called Weiss, and for a time as a boy he was given his step-father's surname. Herr Weiss was not Jewish, but that didn't stop young Reinhard being teased about it at school, and the rumour that he was Jewish followed him, and contributed to him being cashiered from the Navy.

As to Meier, it is a common German name, from the Middle German meier, a steward. But it is also a Germanised spelling of Meyer, from the Hebrew me'ir, "illuminating." Meyer isn't always a Jewish name either - Alfred Meyer was Gauleiter of Westfalen Nord. In fact the two spellings are interchangeable. Most German Meiers were not Jewish, but some were, and this was enough. I don't have any doubt that when Göring made his "call me Meier" joke he was saying "it is just as improbable that the enemy will bomb the Ruhr as it is that I'm a Jew," and that the audience understood him as saying that. It's a highly in-character Göring joke - coarse, slightly self-deprecating and obliquely anti-Semitic.

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Re: Quote from Hermann Göring in 1945.

#9

Post by Boby » 18 Mar 2012, 13:24

BTW, what is the source of the "Meier" quote?

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Re: Quote from Hermann Göring in 1945.

#10

Post by Michate » 18 Mar 2012, 16:27

I don't have any doubt that when Göring made his "call me Meier" joke he was saying "it is just as improbable that the enemy will bomb the Ruhr as it is that I'm a Jew," and that the audience understood him as saying that. It's a highly in-character Göring joke - coarse, slightly self-deprecating and obliquely anti-Semitic.
I see - your only evidence is your own obsession about antisemitic Nazis.

I have never ever heard the name Meier been spoken with any connotation to Jews, while there are many German names, which clearly do have such a connotation, just like e.g. Hirsch, Rosen, or Grün, or any names including words for metals or stones, or names ending on -berg.

Meier is often simply used for Mr. Everybody, like in "Vereinsmeier", referring to persons who like to belong to clubs or associations.

And if the audience was large enough, it most probbaly contained a number of people with th name Meier.


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Re: Quote from Hermann Göring in 1945.

#12

Post by tonyh » 18 Mar 2012, 17:56

I've often wondered how legit this quote is and in addition, it's been bastardised more than any other quote from Der Dicke.

As far as I'm aware, the context of the quote (if real) was about bombs falling on Berlin. It's not about the Ruhr at all and could be construed as Göring saying that if it happened, then I'm not who/what I've claimed to be. Meier or Meyer was a popular name in Germany for Germans, not just Jews. But, it's far from clear whether the quote is supposed to be an anti-semitic one. Perhaps, if he had said Goldstein...

Regarding his supposed 1945 quote, if (again) he indeed actually said it, it was probably a tounge in cheek remark. Germany hadn't even solid plans for invading France, let alone Spain or Africa, until it became absolutely necessary.

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Re: Quote from Hermann Göring in 1945.

#13

Post by Adam Carr » 19 Mar 2012, 00:07

your only evidence is your own obsession about antisemitic Nazis.

Um, I don't think there's much doubt that Nazis in general and Göring in particular were anti-Semites. I don't have an "obsession" about it, I just have clear views based on knowledge.

I've only ever seen the Göring quote in relation to the Ruhr, not Berlin. I don't think it's authenticity is in doubt. The German Wikipedia sources it: Christian Zentner, Friedemann Bedürftig: Das Große Lexikon des Dritten Reiches. Südwest Verlag, München 1985, ISBN 3-517-00834-6,, S. 379 (Stichwort: Meier).

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Re: Quote from Hermann Göring in 1945.

#14

Post by Max Williams » 22 Mar 2012, 13:05

Adam Carr wrote: Why did Reinhard Heydrich have a complex about Jews? Because his step-father was called Weiss, and for a time as a boy he was given his step-father's surname. Herr Weiss was not Jewish, but that didn't stop young Reinhard being teased about it at school, and the rumour that he was Jewish followed him, and contributed to him being cashiered from the Navy.
Sorry, Adam, but you are wrong. Heydrich did not have a step-father. His father, Bruno Heydrich, was a bit of a joker and he found impersonating others provided a great deal of laughing when in company. His impersonations of the archetypal Jew went down particularly well. So much so that a rumour sprang up that this particular impersonation was so good that he had to be Jewish. Completely unfounded, but the Heydrich boys were ribbed by the local kids.
Heydrich's paternal grandmother, Ernestine Heydrich (née Lindner) was widowed and married a second time. Her husband, Gustav Süss, agreed that his new wife could call herself Süss-Heydrich. Süss was not of Jewish origin (he was an Evangelist) and in any case was not blood related to Reinhard Heydrich. However, this did not prevent tittle-tattle that Heydrich had Jewish blood. Heydrich did not have anyone called Weiss in his family.
Heydrich was cashiered from the navy as a result of his attitude at the court of honour. Not for the offence of which he was charged, or any links to anti-Semitism, but purely because he took the stance that he had done nothing wrong and refused to apologise which was viewed as behaviour unbecoming an officer of the Reichsmarine.
Max.

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Re: Quote from Hermann Göring in 1945.

#15

Post by Adam Carr » 22 Mar 2012, 13:42

Yes, you are right, it was his grandmother who remarried, not his father, and the second husband's name was Süss, not Weiss. I should check before telling stories from memory. But it doesn't change the point I was making. Süss is also a fairly common German name which has Jewish associations (most emphatically of course in Jud Süss), and although Herr Süss was not Jewish both Bruno and Reinhard Heydrich suffered from the association. "Despite Bruno's reputation as a nationalist, the rumour about his Jewish origins continued to embarrass the family. It directly affected his sons, who were taunted at school, and probably accounted for the marked inferiority complex displayed by Reinhard Heinrich for the rest of his life." (Callum MacDonald, The Assassination of Reinhard Heydrich, 9. I'm not convinced Heydrich had an inferiority complex, but he certainly had a phobic anti-Semitism and this partly explains it.

Anyway, this is getting rather off-topic.

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