Overview of proposed operations from sea lion?

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phylo_roadking
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Re: Overview of proposed operations from sea lion?

#76

Post by phylo_roadking » 28 Apr 2014, 20:40

If you want a to read the British point of view, read Brian Lavery's well written and fully referenced "We Shall Fight them on the Beaches". It includes lots of background information and has no assumed knowledge. Peter Schenk's book is the best to get information about the German forces.
Lavery is excellent - but it IS "comparative history" - he's comparing the 1940 threat and preparations with the 1803-5 threat and prepaprations. So for the purpose of being a history of the "invasion period" and the defence of Britain its great....but there's only half a book devoted to it :( There is sadly no "British Schenk" yet - but you CAN put Lavery together with Fleming (both versions, "Invasion 1940" AND "Operation Sealion", it turns out there are significant revisions and additions between the two versions of the same book), Macksey and others and come up with a relatively decent view of the British side of things
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sitalkes
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Re: Overview of proposed operations from sea lion?

#77

Post by sitalkes » 29 Apr 2014, 02:46

Nearest to a British Schenk would be Newbold though you have to add in Hewitt + Lavery to get the naval side of things. Lavery's book is only half Sealion but it's a big book and fully referenced. Fleming's book is not referenced at all, though it's easy to see that it is based on the "Notes on German preparations for Invasion of the United Kingdom". Reading that, it is interesting to see what has been left out. I wrote proposals for Osprey and Pen & Sword Books but they were rejected (even though they have published my books before) so it won't be me that gets to write the book (unless it's an e-book).


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phylo_roadking
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Re: Overview of proposed operations from sea lion?

#78

Post by phylo_roadking » 29 Apr 2014, 19:18

Fleming's book is not referenced at all, though it's easy to see that it is based on the "Notes on German preparations for Invasion of the United Kingdom". Reading that, it is interesting to see what has been left out.
You have to remember his own caveat at the start of the book - it was written WELL within the 25-year rule for the majority of the records historians like Lavery have at their disposal now ;)

However...
though it's easy to see that it is based on the "Notes on German preparations for Invasion of the United Kingdom"
....don't forget his OWN knowledge and the part he played; he had already been working up a Military Intelligence-organised "stay behind" organisation for Kent when approached by Colin Gubbins, who had been put in charge of the Aux Units project. Gubbins brought him and his men into the new organisation, and Fleming was an Aux Unit liaison officer. In fact, the idea of the underground "Ops bases" for Aux Unit "patrols" is attributed to Fleming.
Nearest to a British Schenk would be Newbold though you have to add in Hewitt + Lavery to get the naval side of things. Lavery's book is only half Sealion but it's a big book and fully referenced
Newbold is indeed excellent - but slightly limited in that it's the "through" history of Biritsh anti-invasion preparations from the accession ofGen. Kirke to the end of the Sealion threat period; so once again a goodly part of his effort went into aspects we're not really concerned with when it comes to the summer and autumn of 1940 ;) Lavery is ALSO excellent for certain elements of the Air Force preparations - but all the British sources don't pay enough attention to the BANQUET plans, or the gas warfare plans, which would have been important...if of dubious real contribution in the case of BANQUET...elements of the planned defence.
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davidjwest
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Re: Overview of proposed operations from sea lion?

#79

Post by davidjwest » 08 Jun 2014, 13:10

In my opinion Sealion was never meant to happen. Hitler was sure Britain would surrender or come to terms. There's lots of evidence for this if you look around for it.

The BoB was merely designed to intimidate the British into surrendering.

Without landing craft Sealion was merely a paper exercise.

It may have come to a proper invasion later in the war, say by 1945 if the Russians had been overcome.

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