Pauline Kohler...did she exist????

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gersdorff
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Pauline Kohler...did she exist????

#1

Post by gersdorff » 23 Apr 2009, 23:03

perhaps one of you experts in the field could answer this.....
"i was Hitler's maid " by pauline kohler, will be familiar to some.
Did she exist?
Did she really write the book?
Is it to be believed ??
your comments appreciated
thanks

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Heimatschuss
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Re: Pauline Kohler...did she exist????

#2

Post by Heimatschuss » 23 Apr 2009, 23:52

Hi,

according to these old threads

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic. ... ine+kohler
http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic. ... r#p1318330

it's all fantasy.

Best regards
Torsten


J. Duncan
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Re: Pauline Kohler...did she exist????

#3

Post by J. Duncan » 24 Apr 2009, 00:14

Kohler's book can be classified into the category of "spurious sources". Another character that did not exist is Dr. (?) Kruger who wrote the book "I Was Hitler's Doctor". This book is nothing but nonsense consisting of imaginary "conversations" with his patient Hitler on all sorts of topics from animals to homosexuality.
Rauschning's "Hitler Speaks" is also spurious but he actually existed.

topseed66
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Re: Pauline Kohler...did she exist????

#4

Post by topseed66 » 15 Jun 2009, 14:12

Ok, just my 2 cents. Who is to say that she did exist? Any time political officials do not want something to be known by the public, they always find ways to hide it. I was not around then so I do not know for sure, but really, in this day and age, no one does. All you can do is read what someone else thinks and then make your own decision.

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Re: Pauline Kohler...did she exist????

#5

Post by Lesley-ann » 01 Feb 2011, 15:09

Posted on behalf of K Collier:

It is quite wrong to assume that the Book “I was Hitler’s Maid” was a fictional account of Hitler’s life. On the contrary, a great deal of time was put in to doing the research which is why for many years after the war it remained the main source of information on the Furher himself, who was known to be reclusive. Shedding light onto his personal and private life had never been done, out of fear.

The self same thing happened with McCarthy in the United States. People feared him and even journalists would say “we don’t speak about our senators – the walls have ears”. This is also why it became such a sensation when it first came out. The authors were on Hitler’s black list and had to be sent out of the country for theirs and their families’ protection.

Some people may assume that Pauline Kohler was a fictional character but whether she was or not is irrelevant to the light the book shone on the terror and private debauchery of the Nazi Elite and their terrifying Regime and it did much to convince people they needed to be defeated. It was a book of courage written at a time of despair and it’s theme did much to convince me that when you face these kinds of distorted or disturbed power crazy people, one of the sure ways to begin to bring them down is to expose them to public ridicule.

That is what my father believed above all as one of the authors of it. Today it’s language is from the past and the days of terror are gone for us; but they do still continue in many other parts of the world. Sometimes the story behind a book can be as powerful and interesting as the book itself.

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Re: Pauline Kohler...did she exist????

#6

Post by Geoff Walden » 02 Feb 2011, 21:58

Whoever wrote that book, and whenever it was written, there are too many details in it that are simply not true or inaccurate, too many names that no-one has ever heard of, and too many anecdotes about Nazi leaders and life at the Berghof that simply sound like invented fiction to make a sensational account. I really cannot take anything in this book seriously.

My copy is an original published in London by John Long Limited. It has no publication date in it, but it is of the "Twenty-seventh Thousand" printing. The notes below are keyed to page numbers in this edition. For the entries that mention names of supposed Berghof/Hitler staff members, has anyone else ever heard of any of these? I have not.

The book is filled with lurid descriptions of sexual molestation, rape, torture, and murder of half-naked women, sexual affairs, "dirty" movies. It is written in the sensationalist style of a 1950s men's magazine (a la "Police Gazette"). Aside from these, the following are just a few details that I noted, that are demonstrably wrong.

P. 32 – On this page, and those following, the author describes many details at Hitler's home on the Obersalzberg that have never been mentioned in any other writing about the subject, and that do not appear in period photos, maps, or architectural plans, such as: machine-gun crews on either side of the Berghof driveway, elaborate steel barricades every fifty yards, (p. 33) lifts (elevators – there was no elevator in the Berghof), (p. 34) the main dining room, 60 by 40 feet, with no visible lighting (not true), (p. 35) each guest bedroom with a private bath (not true), walls and ceilings of bedrooms decorated with paintings from Greek mythology – naked fauns and nymphs, (p. 36) examples of "degenerate art" on the walls, a "Star Chamber" in a penthouse on the roof, for Hitler and his astrologer Ossietz, (p.37) approaches to the house are heavily mined, every door in the house fitted with an "electric eye," (p. 38 ) this eye in Hitler's study can detect steel and iron, Hitler's private suite had a lift that went down 300 feet to six subterranean rooms, the Berghof had a small private cinema, and a map room with a gigantic bronze map of Germany over the fireplace, (p. 39) telephone switchboard in the Berghof (the switchboard was actually next door in the Türken).

32 – Otto Schlieben – head of Hitler's household staff.

37 – Hitler's astrologer Karl Ossietz brews Hitler's favorite drink – a pink liquid in thin glass flasks, which Hitler drinks three times a day.

44 – Fräulein Oberstet – housekeeper – a middle-aged spinster.

45 – description of the "Eagle's Nest" – walls of glass and steel, only two rooms, main room has walls all of glass.

47 – Head chef at the Berghof was Rudi Vanyor, a Hungarian.

52 – Hitler "loves speed" in his big black Mercedes – 60 to 100 mph. [Actually, Hitler often told his drivers to slow down, and he had them keep the speed to about 30mph.]

56 – Hitler's doctors – Prof. Sauerbruch, Professor Knoll, Prof. Henry Steinmetz; Hitler's valet – Franz Wrabel; assistant housekeeper – Elsa Holzfahn.

63 – Himmler's representative at the Berghof – Gregor Hausmann.

76 – Hitler hates being touched – he only shakes hands on ceremonious occasions.

81-82 – The "Führer's Chain" – only five men have this – Göring, Goebbels, Himmler, Hess, Streicher – a small gold chain of five links, each stamped with a swastika, ending in a tiny gold medal with Hitler's profile on one side and an eagle and swastika on the other.

87 – Hitler cast longing eyes on a Bavarian woman named Eva Braun, who sent a love message to Hitler, which angered Hitler.

91 – Geli Raubal committed suicide in 1921 by turning on the gas in her room.

104-105 – Eva Braun is dark, and wears her long brown hair in plaited coils over her ears. She is plump with a well-developed figure. She first met Hitler in the Berlin Chancellery. Goebbels declared that Eva was a Jew.

114 – Frederick Einzig – one of Hitler's secretaries.

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Annelie
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Re: Pauline Kohler...did she exist????

#7

Post by Annelie » 03 Feb 2011, 00:43

Lesley_ann wrote
Some people may assume that Pauline Kohler was a fictional character but whether she was or not is irrelevant to the light the book shone on the terror and private debauchery of the Nazi Elite and their terrifying Regime and it did much to convince people they needed to be defeated.
Whether or not she was a fictional character is irrelevant? According to your thinking then everything in the
book should be considered with suspicion or probably fictional!

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Re: Pauline Kohler...did she exist????

#8

Post by Lesley-ann » 05 Feb 2011, 06:06

The truth is that you had to be living at the time to grasp what this book meant to a public at war! you can't sit back now at this distance from it all and pass a verdict that it was fictional nonsense. Not when you now know the debauchery and torment the nazis inflicted on millions and millions of people for their own pleasure. They were similar to the North Koreans today. The authors were not setting out to write a history book. They set out to put in front of readers the kind of regime they were fighting against and at the same time doing it in a way that mocked them. That is what satire is! They had access to all the information you could get on the regime because they were investagative journalists. The names don't matter. There were hundreds of nazis raping and torturing women everyday for goodness sake!! K. Collier

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Re: Pauline Kohler...did she exist????

#9

Post by J. Duncan » 05 Feb 2011, 12:46

So, you are an advocate of the "Big Lie"? "Kohler's" book is nothing but kitsch, propaganda at it's worst. It is nothing but psycho-sexual fantasy and one would have to conclude it speaks more about the authors than about Hitler or the Nazis. A whole team of British propaganda experts concocted an entire series of books that titlated the lower instincts of the masses..most of these productions were concerned with the realm of Hitler's questionable sexuality (Hitler was a "perverted homosexual"..."threw himself down in a rage and chewed the edge of the carpet" etc...). There was a documentary film about this very thing titled "Sex and the Swastika". Serious searchers should ignore this book completely.

Documentary link (unfortunately, it's in Spanish but originally came out in English on the Discovery channel)...Walter C. Langer ("The Mind of Adolf Hitler", "The Hitler Source BooK") is mentioned and I think so is Pauline Kohler.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DuXSasOJl2k&feature=fvst

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Re: Pauline Kohler...did she exist????

#10

Post by Annelie » 05 Feb 2011, 14:41



There were hundreds of nazis raping and torturing women everyday for goodness sake!! K. Collier
When you come out with your personal opinions as above, I couldn't take anything you say seriously.

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Takao
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Re: Pauline Kohler...did she exist????

#11

Post by Takao » 05 Feb 2011, 17:40

Sounds like the book is just more British "Black" propaganda to me, and Lesley-ann's comments confirm that belief.

Yes, Lesley-ann, names do matter. Have you ever read "Iron Coffins: A Personal Account Of The German U-boat Battles Of World War II" by Herbert Werner, much of the events described in his book have been proven false, yet some still take the book as Gospel.

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Re: Pauline Kohler...did she exist????

#12

Post by Lesley-ann » 05 Feb 2011, 19:47

All previous postings by Lesley-ann are on behalf of Karilyn Collier who is the deceased co-author's daughter with correct information, reflecting his views for interest, not intending historical facts.L-a

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Re: Pauline Kohler...did she exist????

#13

Post by Geoff Walden » 06 Feb 2011, 02:46

There is one thing in this book that leaves me perplexed ... how did the author(s) know about Eva Braun? As we all know, EB as Hitler's mistress was a "state secret" unknown to the public until 1945. Even though the author(s)' description of EB on pages 104-105 shows that they could never have seen either EB or a photo of her, still, she is mentioned twice in the book. If the book was written before the end of the war, where did this information on EB come from?

EB was mentioned as one of Hitler's companions (although not as his mistress) in a Czech publication of around 1938 (I don't have that reference in front of me and I can't locate it now - does anyone else have it handy?). Could that have been the source used in the "Kohler" book?

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Re: Pauline Kohler...did she exist????

#14

Post by Lesley-ann » 06 Feb 2011, 03:10

As already stated it was not meant to be a history book, but a SATIRE. However the Maid WAS REAL. She escaped from Burchesgarden. That is the last I am going to say on the subject because it was a long long time ago and I've found it strange to see such antagonism coming out towards the authors from modern readers. They certainly didn't get that kind of reaction at the time. Nor did Chaplin when he released the Great Dictator which was inspired by the book. K.Collier

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Re: Pauline Kohler...did she exist????

#15

Post by Takao » 06 Feb 2011, 04:42

Lesley-ann wrote:As already stated it was not meant to be a history book, but a SATIRE. However the Maid WAS REAL. She escaped from Burchesgarden. That is the last I am going to say on the subject because it was a long long time ago and I've found it strange to see such antagonism coming out towards the authors from modern readers.
If there is any truth to the book, the I don't see why you are "stonewalling", however, if the book is nothing more than British "black" propaganda, well than, I can see why...
Lesley-ann wrote:Nor did Chaplin when he released the Great Dictator which was inspired by the book. K.Collier
Care to back that up with a source? From what I remember, production of "The Great Dictator" was begun in 1937, the earliest release date I have seen for the book is 1940. Konrad Bercovici filed a lawsuit against Charlie Chaplin in 1942, with Mr. Bercovici claiming that the story was his and he produced his script as evidence, Mr. Chaplin countered with several newspaper articles, dating back to 1936, that compared Chaplin to Hitler. The lawsuit was eventually settled for $95,000 plus $5,000 for court costs.

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