Abdulhakim Ismailov who flew Soviet flag over Reichstag dies

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Abdulhakim Ismailov who flew Soviet flag over Reichstag dies

#1

Post by Marcus » 17 Feb 2010, 21:34

One of the men featured in the iconic picture of a Red Army soldier holding the Soviet flag above Berlin’s Reichstag at the end of World War II has passed away at the age of 94 in the Republic of Dagestan.
Abdulhakim Ismailov, a native of Dagestan, was one of the three soldiers from the famous picture featuring the raising of the red Banner of Victory on one of the Reichstag’s towers.
The iconic snapshot taken by military photographer Evgeny Khaldey became the symbol of the Soviet victory over Fascist Germany.
http://rt.com/Top_News/2010-02-17/veter ... hstag.html


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(source http://forum.skalman.nu/viewtopic.php?f=66&t=37052)

/Marcus

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Re: Abdulhakim Ismailov who flew Soviet flag over Reichstag dies

#2

Post by Kanadon » 19 Feb 2010, 07:27

The five people that put up the first flag were Makov, Zagitov, Bobrov, Lisimenko and Minin. After that there were other flags and Ismailov happened to be photographed with one of them.


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Re: Abdulhakim Ismailov who flew Soviet flag over Reichstag dies

#3

Post by bf109 emil » 19 Feb 2010, 08:49

some re-buffing this photo as being doctored or not real...

soviet account of the photo...

It seems strange that the Russians should have looked upon the Reichstag, (...) now an empty piece of masonry, its windows and doors bricked up, as the symbol of Germany. (...) Mednikov describes this historic action in great detail:

About noon on April 28 [1945], one of our battalions advanced on the Spree. At the same time the commander of the regiment, Col. F.M. Zinchenko, took charge of a red banner (...) expressly set aside for planting on the dome. It was Red Banner No.5 of the [150th Rifle Division] 3rd Shock Army (...) [it was] twenty-three-year-old Capt. Stefan Andreyevich Noystroev (...) men [who eventually] battled their way into the building, fighting for every room and corridor (...) Noystroev ordered a shock detachment commanded by Lt. Berest to escort the two [Zinchenko appointed regimental] standard-bearers (...) [who] took nearly half a day to reach the dome. At 10:50 p.m. on April 30, the banner of victory was unfurled over the Reichstag.


the problem with the soviet version...

From this account it becomes clear that the famous photograph [by Khaldei] of [standard-bearers] Egorov and Kantariya planting the Red Flag on the roof of the Reichstag could not have been taken at that historic moment. For a start, it was dark at 10:50 p.m., while the picture was obviously taken in broad daylight. Moreover, the soldiers in the street appear to be moving about quite fearlessly and openly, which they would not have done had fighting still been going on all around them — as it was at the time the banner was first held aloft. If we look more closely, we see that there is no trace of anything on the vulgar pinnacle of the Reichstag to which a flag pole could have been attached. The soldier is simply holding up the flag in a dramatic pose. In other words, the world-famous photograph must have been taken a day or two after the storming of the Reichstag. fromhttp://www.1uptravel.com/flag/flags/de1945rt.html

another version and why the man hoisting the flag was never recognized, because he was Ukrainian..

The next day the German troops attacked when they saw the Soviet Victory Flag flying above. Only with Soviet enforcements was the Red Army able to beat off the counter-attack. While the Nazi’s didn’t force the Soviets from the building they did manage to bring down the flag. Two days later the Germans trapped in the basement finally surrendered and on the morning of May 2, 1945 they left the building under a white flag.

Finally Khaldei was able scale the now pacified Reichstag to take his picture. The official story was that two soldiers: Georgian Meliton Kantaria (to please Stalin who was also Georgian) and the Russian Mikhail Yegorov had raised the flag on April 30. Further conflicting events made things even more confusing when reports emerged that a group of men led by Sergei E. Sorokin's also planted another flag on the roof.

However, it later emerged that due to political factors the subjects of the photo were changed and the actual man to hoist the flag was Alyosha Kovalyov. Accounts would emerge that Kovalyov, a Ukrainian, was told by the NKVD to keep quiet about his role in the flag raising. The other man supporting Kovalyov was revealed in 1996 to be Abdulkhakim Ismailov. In addition to officially naming him as the man in the photo the Russian government gave him a Hero of Russia medal. Ismailov died on February 16, 2010 in his native village of Chagar-Otar, in the restive southern Russian province of Dagestan.
fromhttp://www.famouspictures.org/mag/index ... _Reichstag

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Re: Abdulhakim Ismailov who flew Soviet flag over Reichstag dies

#4

Post by Kanadon » 19 Feb 2010, 10:51

It all comes down to NKVD conspiracies and pleasing Stalin.

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Re: Abdulhakim Ismailov who flew Soviet flag over Reichstag dies

#5

Post by Art » 19 Feb 2010, 12:05

bf109 emil wrote:The soldier is simply holding up the flag in a dramatic pose. In other words, the world-famous photograph must have been taken a day or two after the storming of the Reichstag.[/b][/i] fromhttp://www.1uptravel.com/flag/flags/de1945rt.html
He-he.
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Re: Abdulhakim Ismailov who flew Soviet flag over Reichstag dies

#6

Post by Art » 19 Feb 2010, 13:21

To be more serious the photo was taken on 2 May 1945, that was openly admitted by Khaldei in his interview:
http://www.epochtimes.ru/content/view/5101/34/
However, it later emerged that due to political factors the subjects of the photo were changed and the actual man to hoist the flag was Alyosha Kovalyov.
Kovalyov and Ismailov (and also Leonid Gorychev) were men posing for the photo taken by Khaldei. As I understand all three belonged to the recon company of the 82nd Guards Rifle Division/ 8th Guards Army, which didn't even took part in the assault on Reichstag, fighting south of the building on 30 April. They just happened to be close when Khaldei climbed to the Reichstag roof to take a photo. On the contrary Yegorov and Kantaria actually particiapted in the assualt, whether they were the men who raised the flag over the building first is another and more complicated question. As you can see, the story is simple and doesn't need any frightful conspirological theories about the NKVD.

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Re: Abdulhakim Ismailov who flew Soviet flag over Reichstag dies

#7

Post by Kanadon » 19 Feb 2010, 13:41

By the way, Aleksey Berest, who was oficially said to have mounted the first flag with Egorov and Kantariya, was Ukrainian.
On the contrary Yegorov and Kantaria actually particiapted in the assualt, whether they were the men who raised the over the building first is another and more complicated question
What's complicated about it?

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Re: Abdulhakim Ismailov who flew Soviet flag over Reichstag dies

#8

Post by Art » 19 Feb 2010, 13:44


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Re: Abdulhakim Ismailov who flew Soviet flag over Reichstag dies

#9

Post by TISO » 19 Feb 2010, 14:03

Kanadon wrote:The five people that put up the first flag were Makov, Zagitov, Bobrov, Lisimenko and Minin. After that there were other flags and Ismailov happened to be photographed with one of them.
Just a couple of days ago there was a documentary on history channel dated 2005 with interviews of Minin (who acctually raised the flag), some other soviet officers and german defenders.

Minin told that his 5 man unit (who volunteered even before the official call for volunteers was given) got into the building raming a log trough the baricaded door and there was virtually no fighting inside (except few shots fired to scare anyone who was possibly inside). According to him the flag was tied to a metal pipe and stuck into the crown of Germania statue. he ralated that his unit goal was not storming and/or capturing reichstag but just to raise the flag on it.
Docu ended with Minin going back to Berlin and meeting one of reichstag defenders. Minin also related that his crew felt cheated by the history. The only depiction of this unit raising a flag is a painting in Voronezh museum.

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Re: Abdulhakim Ismailov who flew Soviet flag over Reichstag dies

#10

Post by TISO » 19 Feb 2010, 14:07

Art wrote:
bf109 emil wrote:The soldier is simply holding up the flag in a dramatic pose. In other words, the world-famous photograph must have been taken a day or two after the storming of the Reichstag.[/b][/i] fromhttp://www.1uptravel.com/flag/flags/de1945rt.html
He-he.
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Quite similar with Iwo Jima flag raising the famous picture being made when replacement flag was raised a day or so after the first flag raising.

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Re: Abdulhakim Ismailov who flew Soviet flag over Reichstag dies

#11

Post by Art » 19 Feb 2010, 14:25

I think it's clear that taking photos in combat situation was an extremly risky affair. Very few of war-time "battle" photos were not actually staged.

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Re: Abdulhakim Ismailov who flew Soviet flag over Reichstag dies

#12

Post by John Hilly » 19 Feb 2010, 22:56

Listen to what I have read and even seen the original!
The original picture had to be manipulated, because the leutenant in the picture had several watches in his wrist.
Booty, booty, Uhr, Uhr!
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Re: Abdulhakim Ismailov who flew Soviet flag over Reichstag dies

#13

Post by Marcus » 21 Feb 2010, 00:08

The discussion on the Polish victory flag in Berlin has been moved to a separate thread.

/Marcus

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Re: Abdulhakim Ismailov who flew Soviet flag over Reichstag dies

#14

Post by TISO » 13 Mar 2010, 13:21

TISO wrote:
Kanadon wrote:The five people that put up the first flag were Makov, Zagitov, Bobrov, Lisimenko and Minin. After that there were other flags and Ismailov happened to be photographed with one of them.
Just a couple of days ago there was a documentary on history channel dated 2005 with interviews of Minin (who acctually raised the flag), some other soviet officers and german defenders.

Minin told that his 5 man unit (who volunteered even before the official call for volunteers was given) got into the building raming a log trough the baricaded door and there was virtually no fighting inside (except few shots fired to scare anyone who was possibly inside). According to him the flag was tied to a metal pipe and stuck into the crown of Germania statue. he ralated that his unit goal was not storming and/or capturing reichstag but just to raise the flag on it.
Docu ended with Minin going back to Berlin and meeting one of reichstag defenders. Minin also related that his crew felt cheated by the history. The only depiction of this unit raising a flag is a painting in Voronezh museum.
Found it on Youtube:
Interesting part about reichstag starts in part 5/6
The End In Berlin - 5/6:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rFvtZWqEMdA&NR=1

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