Soviet Unit of Fire (б/к боевой комплект)

[Jeff Leach]

Has this been dicussed Before (Think it has)? Can anyone Point be to a good discussion of it?

[Art]

What exactly? The number of rounds?

[Jeff Leach]

Really, what does it mean? It must mean a certain amount of combat.

Number of rounds would run into problem of specifying a number for each different caliber. Although, some information on the number of rounds used by the different calibers for a certain kind of artillery mission would be interesting.

Here is a sample of the kind of information you see (ЦАМО ф.842 оп.1 д.22т1 лл.198)

35th Rifle Corps

97 AT Bn - 3 b/k
175 AAA Bn - 2.5 b/k
57 Art Rgt: 75 mm - 2 b/k, 122 mm - 1.5 b/k
134 How Rgt: 122 mm - 1.5 b/k, 152 mm - 3 b/k

[Sheldrake]

"Units of Fire" is a term used by the Red Army for planning logistics. It is a standard, arbitrary, quantity of ammunition for each weapon type. Table 6 on Page VII 14 of the Handbook on the USSR VII Logistics has this for each weapon. http://digitalcommons.unl.edu/cgi/viewc ... odmilintel

Its a 100 rounds of 7.62mm per weapon weighing 0.038 short tons up to 40 rounds of 203mm Howitzer ammunition weighing 5.85 short tons. This would help artillery supply staff or manage When no special operations were projected each army artillery depot would maintain a supply of 2-3 units of fire, with daily expenditure around 0.5-0.6 of a unit of fire.

The Soviets used these, in conjunction with their planning norms for suppressing, neutralizing and destroying targets to calculate the ammunition needed for offensive operations. Tables 8 and 9 in the same document show how much ammunition of each type should be stockpiled and the distribution of ammunition between the firing point supply points and dumps.

Not sure how much discussion you want to have but start the debate...

[Art]

Really, what does it mean? It must mean a certain amount of combat.

It was supposed to be an amount of ammo carried with weapons and in unit train up to regiment inclusively. In practice the transport available could be quite different from tables of organization, but anyway the term was still a useful simple measure of ammunition for supply and planning purposes.
From memory the number of rounds in a unit of fire was
37 and 45-mm guns - 200 per gun
76-mm field guns - 140
122-mm howitzers and guns - 80
152-mm - 60
203-mm- 40
82-mm mortars - 120
120-mm mortars - 80
160-mm mortars - 60

If you want to count he absolute number of rounds you've got to multiply a number of units by size of the ammo unit and by a number of guns.

[Der Alte Fritz]

There were changes to the number of rounds in a beokomplet for some weapons between 1941 and the 2nd and 3rd periods of the war.
A full discussion (around 20 pages) of Soviet artillery methods and a comparison with a German example (Kursk I think) and British (Operation Veritable) including the main sources on the subject is given here:

http://www.armchairgeneral.com/forums/s ... p?t=135327

A major Soviet source : Peredelsky, George E., Tokmok, Athanasius Ivanovich Khoroshilov, George Trifonovich The artillery in combat and operations
(The experience of the Great Patriotic War) http://militera.lib.ru/science/peredelsky_ge/index.html

Artillery attack Colonel-General of Artillery Samsonov F. A
http://rkka.ru/analys/art/title.htm

and good background for non gunners (British source)
http://nigelef.tripod.com/wt_of_fire.htm

[G. Trifkovic]

Hi all,

thanks for the info and the links. On page VII-16 of the Handbook on the USSR logistics, there is a table on ammo requirements of an army at the beginning of an offensive operation (see attached); can someone confirm the veracity of these figures?

Best,

G.

[Art]

The table seems to be taken from one of instructions or articles, yet I don't think that in real practice such a strict rule was followed, rather requirements were determined ad hoc. In general several units of fire was a typical level of stockpiles needed for a large operation.

[Der Alte Fritz]

Tm 30-340 is not a terribly accurate document being an Intelligence document. For instance it gives the load of a Soviet Military Train as being 1,200 tonnes (20 tonnes times 60 wagons) when in reality 650 tonnes was more realistic.
Art gave these figures over at the RKKA site: http://www.armchairgeneral.com/forums/s ... 327&page=8
Expenditure of ammunition. In selected operation of 1943 expenditure of ammunition for artillery preparation was as follows:
Bryansk Front, July 1943 – 45-minute preparation
82-mm mortars – 0.93 units
120-mm M – 0.88
76-mm guns – 0.81
122-mm howitzers – 1.05
152-mm howitzers – 0.91
Average – 0.9

South-West Front, August 1943 – 75-minute preparation
82-mm mortars – 0.37 units
120-mm M – 0.22
76-mm guns – 0.54
122-mm howitzers – 0.34
152-mm howitzers – 0.47
Average – 0.35

Central Front, August 1943 – 45-minute preparation
82-mm mortars – 0.7 units
120-mm M – 0.3
76-mm guns – 0.45
122-mm howitzers – 0.6
152-mm howitzers – 0.5
Average – 0.5

Voronezh Front, October 1943 – 40-minute preparation
82-mm mortars – 0.3 units
120-mm M – 0.45
76-mm guns – 0.45
122-mm howitzers – 0.4
152-mm howitzers – 0.5
Average – 0.35

South Front, October 1943 – 38-minute preparation
82-mm mortars – 0.9 units
120-mm M – 1.5
76-mm guns – 0.5
122-mm howitzers – 0.5
152-mm howitzers – 0.3
Average – 0.8

[Der Alte Fritz]

Summer 1944

Artillery Comparison 11th GA Summary.jpg (92.89 KiB) Viewed 4252 times

[G. Trifkovic]

Thank you both!

Best,

G.

[Der Alte Fritz]

I was looking through some 7th Guards Army documents and came across this interesting one that gave the weight and number of rounds in 0.25 boekomplekt for the Army in June 1943:

1) Take the number of rounds and divide by the weight to give the weight per round
2) Times this by the number of rounds in a single weapon b/k or the weight of a single weapon b/k
3) Use the figure in 2 to divide the actual weight of the Army boekomplekt (remembering to times by 4)
4) This gives you the actual number of weapons in the Army

I have a couple of anomalies:
a) how many rounds in a b/k for pistols
b) the number of rounds in a b/k for 76mm DA guns changed from 100? to 140. Any idea when?
c) number of rounds in a Tank 40mm (British) or 45mm equipped tank?

[Paul_Atreides]

I have a couple of anomalies:
a) how many rounds in a b/k for pistols

16.

b) the number of rounds in a b/k for 76mm DA guns changed from 100? to 140. Any idea when?

Why 100?

c) number of rounds in a Tank 40mm (British) or 45mm equipped tank?

It depends on the machine.

[Der Alte Fritz]

However we need to check this to confirm the validity of the table

So 76mm ZIS-3 has a shell weight of 6.2 kg but in the table the 4,170 shells of weight 4,900 kg calculates as only 1.18 kg per shell. 4.9 tonnes would actually only be 790 shells. Or if we want the actual weight of shells 4,170 * 6.2 = 25,854 kg.
Interestingly the weight of a similar number of 76mm Tank shells is given as 56 tonnes which gives an individual shell weight double the reality and three times the same gun in Divisional format

122mm howitzer has a shell weight of 23 kg and in the table it works out to 34 kg

[Der Alte Fritz]

Paul
Tanks are Mark 2 and Mark 3

As regards the b/k for the 76mm gun, this was only a memory so perhaps it was always 140 rounds.