88mm 88kwk43

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LAH650
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88mm 88kwk43

#1

Post by LAH650 » 17 Jul 2006, 14:01

I found this at a car-boot/flea market in the UK Sat 15th July...

Image

OK 88 kwk 43 , first thought Tiger II.

But that date is '43...

As I understand it there are 2 different case types/shapes....

One for the Pac 43 and one the kwk...

if correct as I understand it again the kwk was mounted in the Elephant but not the Nashorn or JagdPanther...

So therefore a date of '43 makes it a Elephant round...

Or is it one round fits all... but again the date says no the Tiger II...

Ok it may have found its way to a Tiger but when produced they where not..:confused:

8.8 cm PaK 43 Anti-Tank model developed from Krupp's 8.8 cm Gerät 42 . New gun carriage similar to the Sonderanhänger 201. Developed by Krupp's and manufactured in its different versions, including KwK 43, by at least Dortmund Hoerder-Hüttenverein, Henschel, Weserhütte and Fr. Garny. A 71 caliber barrel and a 822 mm cartridge case.
8.8 cm PaK 43/41 Pak 43 mounted on single axle split-trail field gun carriage produced as a stop-gap measure due to scarcity of materials. Weight 4.9 tonnes.
8.8 cm PaK 43/1 Pak 43 as mounted in the 'Nashorn' tank destroyer.
8.8 cm PaK 43/2 Pak 43 as mounted in the 'Ferdinand'/'Elefant' tank destroyer. On occasion referred to as 'StuK 43/1'.
8.8 cm PaK 43/3 and 43/4 Pak 43 as mounted in the 'Jagdpanther' tank destroyer. Falling wedge breech block.
8.8 cm KwK 43 Pak 43 modified as a tank gun. Main gun of the Tiger II heavy tank. Falling wedge breech block.
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Panzermacher
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Re: 88mm 88kwk43

#2

Post by Panzermacher » 17 Jul 2006, 20:47

LAH650 wrote:I found this at a car-boot/flea market in the UK Sat 15th July...


OK 88 kwk 43 , first thought Tiger II.

But that date is '43...

As I understand it there are 2 different case types/shapes....

One for the Pac 43 and one the kwk...

if correct as I understand it again the kwk was mounted in the Elephant but not the Nashorn or JagdPanther...

So therefore a date of '43 makes it a Elephant round...

Or is it one round fits all... but again the date says no the Tiger II...

Ok it may have found its way to a Tiger but when produced they where not..:confused:
you're a little disjointed there, hard to understand.
AFAIK there is only one Shell Type that fits the 88mm PaK 43, 43/1, 43/2, 43/3 & KwK43
there is however the smaller 88mm FlaK18, 36, 37 & KwK36 (L56 for Tiger I)
are you sure you are not confusing the 2 types
there is also the 88mm FlaK 41 a different shell again.
I think the only differences between the 88mm PaK 43, 43/1, 43/2, 43/3 & KwK43 are the types of Gun mounting, Recoil Buffers, Pinnion mounts & Breech Blocks used (Horizontal & Vertical types), this is due in part as to how the Gun is to be fitted inside the Vehicle, as Nashorn (Chassis), Tiger II (Turret face) etc.
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LV
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#3

Post by LV » 18 Jul 2006, 11:58

I find it rather interesting that the shell base is stamped 'KwK 43' and not 'Pak/KwK 43' or something similar, indicating that the round can also be fired by Pak 43. Anybody know what could be the reason(?), since Pak/KwK 43 fired the same rounds.
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woolly
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#4

Post by woolly » 18 Jul 2006, 22:04

If memory serves, the difference between a PAK round and a KWK round ws the primer. With the KWK shell, the gun uses an electric igniter as opposed to the mechanical igniter of the PAK gun.
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von papen
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#5

Post by von papen » 19 Jul 2006, 00:48

he means it could be used in a tiger 2
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LV
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#6

Post by LV » 19 Jul 2006, 09:19

woolly wrote:If memory serves, the difference between a PAK round and a KWK round ws the primer. With the KWK shell, the gun uses an electric igniter as opposed to the mechanical igniter of the PAK gun.
I think that all weapons in the Pak/KwK 43 series were electrically fired.

http://lonesentry.com/manuals/tme30/ch7sec4sub6.html

http://forum.axishistory.com/viewtopic. ... highlight=
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LV
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#7

Post by LV » 31 Jul 2006, 14:11

No one knows, why Pak and KwK 43 shells had different markings? Makes no sense. It's like some 9 mm pistol cartridges having 'P 08' stamped on them and others 'P 38'.
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Zünder
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#8

Post by Zünder » 01 Aug 2006, 10:03

LV wrote:No one knows, why Pak and KwK 43 shells had different markings? Makes no sense. It's like some 9 mm pistol cartridges having 'P 08' stamped on them and others 'P 38'.
8,8 cm Pak 43 and Kw.K. 43 cases had the same markings, all rounds were stamped both "Pak 43 and"Kw.K. 43" on the side in blank ink, "Kw.K. 43" stamped into the bottom of the case.

Zünder,

http://www.wk2ammo.com
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LV
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#9

Post by LV » 01 Aug 2006, 11:49

Great, I guess you're the one to ask when it comes to ammunition. Thanks.
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