Carabieneri

[K.Kocjancic]

What was a Italian name for Carabieneri Legion?

In Trst was such V. Legion of carabieneri?

Regards,
Kocjo

[Lupo Solitario]

"Legione Carabinieri". It's a police territorial command

[Klint]

In Italy the carabinieri are better known for the jokes that like soldiers. During WWII they remained loyal to the RSI for the wage, they prefered to not go to the partisans for fear, to the end (august 1944) they were sent to Germany like Flak Helpers or workers. Naturally I mean the majority not all!

[Lupo Solitario]

In Italy the carabinieri are better known for the jokes that like soldiers. During WWII they remained loyal to the RSI for the wage, they prefered to not go to the partisans for fear, to the end (august 1944) they were sent to Germany like Flak Helpers or workers. Naturally I mean the majority not all!

In my opinion, a really insulting post

At September 8th, commander of Carabinieri, general Cerica, ordered to 80000 servicemen of CCRR to "stay at their place".

10000 carabinieri are captured by germans in successive days (incidentally I remember a certain Salvo d'Acquisto in same days). At birth of RSI, they are taken by fascists as "unaffordable", many left service. At november 20, it is formed the GNR absorbing Carabinieri.
At march 1st, are given 44000 carabinieri still in service.
Reports indicate frequent contacts between carabinieri and resistance.
In June it is decided to send 10000 carabinieri in germany. This causes about 3000 immediate disertions. Another block will be sent in german in august. September 1st 1944, all remnants carabinieri were removed by service
(source L'esercito di Salò by G. Pansa)

That's without speaking of all carabinieri serving in southern italy and all that joined the resistance or joined RSI for convinction...They substantially did their duty. Carabinieri had shown their skills from Palestro to day, there are many jokes about them (as I imagine there are about the largest part of police forces in the world) but it's the other face of respect and consideration they have between italians.

[Kenshiro]

But was the carabinieri not loyal to the king? Why they (some) did join the RSI then???

Yes there is many jokes on carabinieri, but actually they are the elite in the Italian army, they are capable from doing simple police duty to war missions.

[DrG]

But was the carabinieri not loyal to the king? Why they (some) did join the RSI then?

All Italian soldiers had sworn to the King, but after the Armistice many felt that joining the RSI was the best way to fight for the honor of Italy (if not to save it from the invasion of the Allies). Moreover, Carabinieri had the duty of police: if they had left their place there would have been only chaos. They were more loyal to the King than other armed forces (for the example, the usually pro-Fascist Air Force), but of course there were a lot of exceptions, as for the reasons that I've explained briefly.

[K.Kocjancic]

Thanks for the info!

Regards,
Kocjo

[SM79Sparviero]

At September 8th, commander of Carabinieri, general Cerica, ordered to 80000 servicemen of CCRR to "stay at their place".

This is a milestone for Carabinieri:"stay at their place".In silence
"usi obbedir tacendo e tacendo morir"="in silence we obey and in silence we die"

"in silence", it doesn't mean "don't speak" but "don't express a clear preference".
Carabinieri are elite forces ( es Tuscania airborne bataillon)but in the same time they have a militar an civilian police role.
They have to take care for justice for any person indepently from his political ideal, religion, colour, still in 2004 in small italian country villages.
You can do it without an arrogant behaviour only if you get respect from all people , and they all respect you only if they realize that that you are OVER any political idea.And if you "stay at your place" at any price.

Brigadiere Salvo D' Acquisto "stayed at his place" and he was OVER SS and Third Reich and OVER Partisans,he gave his life for the life of people that he would have arrested if necessary in the previous day.

Jokes usually come from people who have a reason to fear Carabinieri.

[K.Kocjancic]

What about ranks? Can anyone post their rank system, according to Wehrmacht/W-SS rank system?

TIA;
Kocjo

[Lupo Solitario]

the same as for italian army but calling "brigadiere" the sargents and "carabiniere" corporals

bye
Lupo

[K.Kocjancic]

So something like this?

BTW: Who was the highest ranking Carabiniere in WWII?


Primo Maresciallo dell'Impero
Maresciallo d'Italia
Generale d'Armata
Generale designato d'armata
Generale di Corpo d'Armata
Generale di Divisione
Generale di Brigata
Colonnello
Tenente Colonnello
Maggiore
Primo Capitano
Capitano
Primo Tenente
Tenete
Sottotenente
Aiutante di Battaglia
Maresciallo Maggiore
Maresciallo Capo
Maresciallo ordinario
Brigadiere Maggiore
Brigadiere
Carabiniere Maggiore
Carabiniere
Soldato

Regards,
Kocjo

[Klint]

At that time I suppose it was a Generale d'Armata but he must not be a Carabinieri he had to come from the Army, it seems now the commander af the Carabinieri is a General of the Carabinieri and now it's the forth italian army like navy, air force and army, before they were under the order of the chef of staff of the Army. Jokes or not jokes carabinieri were the members of the firing squad that during WW1 had to "decimate" (one every ten soldiers were killed) when some old monarchist general declared the unit had been demonstrated vile of forehead to the enemy, carabinieri were the killers of the Gold Medal Ettore Muti, carabinieri now seem to be involved in bloody terroristic actions during the seventies against the left moviment of youths and workers asking better life conditions etc., etc.
Salvo d'Acquisto:, are we sure that the history has been brought back correctly ?

[Lupo Solitario]

Carabinieri had been full part of italian army until 2000 when obtained an indipendent status

carabinieri were the members of the firing squad that during WW1 had to "decimate" (one every ten soldiers were killed) when some old monarchist general declared the unit had been demonstrated vile of forehead to the enemy

as any other military police during WWI

carabinieri were the killers of the Gold Medal Ettore Muti,
carabinieri now seem to be involved in bloody terroristic actions during the seventies against the left moviment of youths and workers asking better life conditions etc., etc.

do you mean the Red Brigades I suppose?

Salvo d'Acquisto:, are we sure that the history has been brought back correctly ?

as much as possible, I've never heard a voice against

A curiosity: why a Swissman has so much hate against italian carabinieri?

[DrG]

At that time I suppose [cut] correctly ?

Just to summarize: first you tell that Carabinieri are guilty of the murder of Muti (by the way it's still unclear how he died and the killer was almost certainly an unidentified man in kaki uniform, not a carabiniere), but then you're ready to tell that the well documented heroic death of Salvo d'Acquisto may be a lie (given the abundance of Italian and German witnesses, plus the fact that I've never seen somebody, Fascist or Anti-Fascist, who denied that fact, I'd like to know why you tell it... except because of your hate and despise for Carabinieri) and even that they were involved in anti-communist terrorism. :roll: All the conspirationist theories about the terrorism of the 1970's are pretty baseless, moreover even among those gibberish theories usually the "evil forces" are Police and the Intelligence Service (not only Italian,but of course also the CIA, Mossad, etc.), not Carabinieri. But for you nothing is too gibberish when you have to attack Carabinieri. :roll:

[AJK]

Hi,

Below is a list of the commanders of the Carabinieri between 1900 - 1945.

16 July 1897 – 15 February 1900: Tenente Generale Bruto Bruti
16 February 1900 – 15 April 1904: Tenente Generale Felice Sismondo
16 April 1904 – 24 July 1905: Tenente Generale Federigo Pizzuti
5 August 1905 – 15 February 1908: Tenente Generale Giuseppe Bellati
16 February 1908 – 30 April 1909: Tenente Generale Paolo Spingardi
1 August 1909 – 13 September 1914: Tenente Generale Giuseppe Del Rosso
14 September 1914 – 3 January 1918: Tenente Generale Gaetano Zoppi (later Generale d’Armata)
4 January 1918 – 24 August 1919: Tenente Generale Luigi Cauvin
25 August 1919 – 29 October 1921: Tenente Generale Carlo Petitti di Roreto (later Generale d’Armata)
23 November 1921 – 4 January 1925: Generale di Corpo d’Armata Giacomo Ponzio
5 January 1925 – 27 November 1935: Generale di Corpo d’Armata Enrico Asinari di San Marzano Enrico
30 November 1935 – 24 August 1940: Generale di Corpo d’Armata Riccardo Moizo
27 August 1940 – 22 February 1943: Generale di Corpo d’Armata Remo Gambelli
23 February 1943 – 19 July 1943: Generale di Corpo d’Armata Azolino Hazon
23 July 1943 – 11 September 1943: Generale di Corpo d’Armata Angelo Cerica
19 November 1943 – 20 July 1944: Generale di Divisione Giuseppe Pieche
21 July 1944 – 6 March 1945: Generale di Corpo d’Armata Taddeo Orlando
7 March 1945 – 5 April 1947: Generale di Divisione Brunetto Brunetti

AJK