Information on German High-low pressure guns?

[Lkefct]

Anyone have any more info on the High Low pressure guns that Germany developed late in the war?

I know that the high pressure part refers to the 10.5 cm casing that was used for the propellant, and a spigot held the bomb which was a 8cm mortar bomb of either shaped charge or HEAT, and the charge was detonated in the chamber, and bled through small holes creating a high prssure chamber, but lower pressure in the barrel as the expanded gas propelled the bomb. I was also under the impression that they were designed as infantry guns and intended to siply provide the infantry guns with a useful anti-tank effect. Was looking for something to add to my libary with more detailed info.

Thanks in advance.

[Uninen]

http://users.belgacom.net/artillery/art ... /5389.html

Info and picture of 8.0 cm Panzerabwehrwerfer 600 (High/low pressure gun, a Rheinmetall new ballistic idea, only 260 made)

[Chris Carden]

any stories of how it did in combat?

[Lkefct]

http://users.belgacom.net/artillery/art ... /5389.html
http://www.angelfire.com/art/enchanter/infantrygun.html
http://homepage.tinet.ie/~nightingale/depth_atgun.html
http://www.lexikon-der-wehrmacht.de/Waf ... PAW600.htm (although I can't read enough German to know more then generally what is being said).
http://www.probertencyclopaedia.com/FYN.HTM

These are the sites that I found with some information.

I am looking for how high the gun is (as many of the late war AT guns where hard conciel).?

How heavy, as many of the ltest guns where too heavy to be manhandled let alone moved any distance?

I am a little unsure how the breach would work, since you had to load 2 chambers, and what was the rate of fire like?

Was the carriage an existing one, and could it have carried the 10cm scaled up version?

Where they issued to AT units, or IG units?

How many where issued to a unit (4 6 or 8 gun batteries)? Would they have been used at the Bn level, or replaced the IG Co at regimental level, and if at regimental level, would they have replaced not only the 7.5 cm guns, but he 1.5cm sIG as well?

How effective where they against Allied armour, and did they need to go to a 10cm? Is the penetration based in a Lab setting, or does it get the increase that people noticed that rifled weapons degreade the penetration ability of the HEAT warheads. The PAW 660 (or PWK 8H63 if you prefer), able to do a better job of penetrating then other shaped charges of similar size.

The 10cm does not have a mortar equivilent, so you would actually have to make ammunition rather then just use the 8cm mtr, and take the mtr charge off the bac.

Was the muzzle velocity fast enough to hit a target? I know tht it uses a HEAT warhead, and that it's penetration ability is not based on the muzzle velocity, but high muzzle velocity makes it easier to aim and hit a moving target.

Since the barrel is much lighter, and smooth bore, can it be made much more inexpensively and thus have them produced more quickly?

[Petrus]

Here are two photos of the 8-cm PAW600 and another one of the 10.5-cm version.

Specifications:
8-cm PAW(Panzerabwehrwerfer) 600 aka PWK (Panzerwurfkanone) 8H 63
Weight: 610 kg
Barrel length: 2980 mm
Muzzle velocity: 520 mps
Armour penetration: 145 mm
Wgr.Patr 4462 round length: 620 mm
The round weight: 7 kg
HEAT projectile weight: 2.75 kg

In January 1945 81 pieces of the PAW600 were delivered to front units. By the end of the war the weapons were issued to the 30th and 31st Panzer-Grenadier-Regiments. Both regiments had 105 such guns.

http://www.lexikon-der-wehrmacht.de/Waf ... onen-R.htm

10-cm PWK 10H 64
Weight: 900 kg
Barrel length: 2400 mm
HEAT projectile weight: 6.6 kg
Armour penetration: 200 mm at 1000 m

At an Internet location which I forgot I had found such a description of the PAW600:

No discussion of carriage mounted weapons firing mortar bombs would be complete with mentioning the Wartime German PAW 600, also known as the PWK 8H63. This used a round that was comprised of an 81mm mortar bomb, a casing from the LeFH-18 105mm Howitzer and a perforated steel plate with a spigot. The mortar bomb was fitted to the spigot with a shear pin and the propellant charge was 360gm diglycol. The PAW 600 was one of the first weapons to use the High-Low pressure system now familiar from 40mm Grenade Launchers. This allowed a powerful charge to be used with a light barrel. The entire weapon weighed only 600kg but had a muzzle velocity of 520m/s (1706 fps). This compares very favourably with the 1260 fps muzzle velocity of the L24 75mm gun used for vehicle mounted close support weapon. In the anti-tank role the PAW 600's HEAT round could penetrate 140mm of armour at 750m, while for indirect fire range is given as 6000m. The same bomb fired from the GrW34 mortar only reached 2400m.

Best regards etc.,
Petrus

[Lkefct]

Outstanding, Thanks

[Bob_Mackenzie]

In January 1945 81 pieces of the PAW600 were delivered to front units. By the end of the war the weapons were issued to the 30th and 31st Panzer-Grenadier-Regiments. Both regiments had 105 such guns.

http://www.lexikon-der-wehrmacht.de/Waf ... onen-R.htm

To resurect an old thread

I went back to the link you mentioned and put it through a machine translator. I read it that both regiments had 105 between them not 105 each - would this be correct?

Also Tessin doesn't mention a 31 PzGren regt - is this a typo for 51 which also served in 18 Pz Gren Div?

Cheers

Bob

[Lkefct]

Anyone want to speculate on how they would have been issued within the regiment?

1945 pattern PzGr REg has 2 BN each with 3 rifle co, and 2 hv weapons co
HQ stab
11th CO was infantry gun company with 4 sIG 15 cm,
12th co of pioneers.

As stated earlier, I have never been clear whether they where to be used as an AT gun, inf gun, or hybrid role. They could also convieveably be used as both an inf gun and AT gun in the same units (inf gun and At co in the regular infantry regiments). I have always been curious.

[Sturm78]

Hi all,

I can not find any wartime pictures of 8cm PAW 600 in action with German Army in 1944-45.
Can anyone help me?

Thanks in advance.
Regards Sturm78.