Found these in a box, is it real?

Discussions on other First and Second World War militaria and collecting in general. Hosted by John G & William Kramer.
Heie.Lee
Member
Posts: 4
Joined: 30 Aug 2019 18:49
Location: Norway

Found these in a box, is it real?

Post by Heie.Lee » 30 Aug 2019 18:55

So I was over at my fathers place and found these items in a box. I curious if its fake or not:

Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Found out that my dad painted this in the 80's while he was drunk. Gonna clean it up with some liquid; TEC7 REMOVE ALL
Image


Some kind of letters in German describing what it is:
Image
Image

User avatar
John G.
Host - Militaria sections
Posts: 5750
Joined: 25 Apr 2006 18:56
Location: USA

Re: Found these in a box, is it real?

Post by John G. » 30 Aug 2019 22:32

Hele.Lee,
Need pictures of the reverses of the badges, but the General Assault, 39 Iron Cross 2nd, the Wound badge, Winter in Russia 41/42, and Close Combat Clasp appear o.k. (Still need reverse photos)..... The clean knights cross looks good too but need much better pictures, especially if any markings (usually on the upper frame of the ring where the oak leaves are attached...... Then on the back of the oak leaves themself.) The gold painted cross appears to be a crude reproduction.... But still clean it and give. Is a better look.

I won't get either of us too excited until I see the better pictures.... But looks promising.....
John G. :thumbsu
PS. The 2nd. Knights Cross without a ribbon unpainted also looks like a fake. Just for informational purposes, the swords should be down, not up.... On the oak leaves.

Heie.Lee
Member
Posts: 4
Joined: 30 Aug 2019 18:49
Location: Norway

Re: Found these in a box, is it real?

Post by Heie.Lee » 31 Aug 2019 00:07

John G. wrote:
30 Aug 2019 22:32
Hele.Lee,
Need pictures of the reverses of the badges, but the General Assault, 39 Iron Cross 2nd, the Wound badge, Winter in Russia 41/42, and Close Combat Clasp appear o.k. (Still need reverse photos)..... The clean knights cross looks good too but need much better pictures, especially if any markings (usually on the upper frame of the ring where the oak leaves are attached...... Then on the back of the oak leaves themself.) The gold painted cross appears to be a crude reproduction.... But still clean it and give. Is a better look.

I won't get either of us too excited until I see the better pictures.... But looks promising.....
John G. :thumbsu
PS. The 2nd. Knights Cross without a ribbon unpainted also looks like a fake. Just for informational purposes, the swords should be down, not up.... On the oak leaves.
Hey great thanks for your answer. I gonna clean that drunken rampage gold thing tomorrow and get a better camera and post some better picture also from the back. Thanks again I really hope some of them are real and has some value.

User avatar
rlimike
Financial supporter
Posts: 537
Joined: 30 Oct 2007 02:19
Location: Harrare

Re: Found these in a box, is it real?

Post by rlimike » 31 Aug 2019 03:02

If the K.C. turns out good.... you will have a several K payday.
.

Heie.Lee
Member
Posts: 4
Joined: 30 Aug 2019 18:49
Location: Norway

Re: Found these in a box, is it real?

Post by Heie.Lee » 31 Aug 2019 10:48

Here is a picture of me and my friend from the early 80's wearing the same stuff. I'm now pretty sure the Iron Cross and Oak Leaves With Swords in photo seven and the gold painted iron cross are fake. They are not in this photo. I will post better pictures hopefully within some days:
Image

Anybody that can identify the round thing in the photo. That was not in the box, maybe it is just part of the shirt?
Image

User avatar
John G.
Host - Militaria sections
Posts: 5750
Joined: 25 Apr 2006 18:56
Location: USA

Re: Found these in a box, is it real?

Post by John G. » 31 Aug 2019 13:05

Looks like it might be a "Golden Party badge"..... Would be worth looking for!
John G.

User avatar
von thoma
Member
Posts: 4433
Joined: 10 Jul 2010 03:40
Location: Spain

Re: Found these in a box, is it real?

Post by von thoma » 02 Sep 2019 01:59

Ritterkreuz E/S could be a jewelers copy of the time, most likely it was not granted to any combatant
As an original copy the price decreases. I am interested in seeing better photos of the oak leaves brooch
" The right to believe is the right of those who don't know "

Heie.Lee
Member
Posts: 4
Joined: 30 Aug 2019 18:49
Location: Norway

Re: Found these in a box, is it real?

Post by Heie.Lee » 04 Sep 2019 11:05

John G. wrote:
31 Aug 2019 13:05
Looks like it might be a "Golden Party badge"..... Would be worth looking for!
John G.
I will try looking for it. Thanks for you help. Here are some new pictures, hope those are good enough:
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image

Probably nothing but I also found these:
Image

User avatar
John G.
Host - Militaria sections
Posts: 5750
Joined: 25 Apr 2006 18:56
Location: USA

Re: Found these in a box, is it real?

Post by John G. » 04 Sep 2019 21:29

Hele.Lee,
Much better pictures of everything except the Knights Cross w/oak leaves & swords... Which I'll comment on after I do the rest.

General Assault badge. Real but missing the pin and catch. Little collector value ($30./50. US)

Iron Cross 1939 2nd. Cl.. Real (90./120. US)

1939 Wound Badge. Might be gold (200. US +/-) or Silver (100. US +/-) hard to tell from the photos.

Knights Cross with oak leaves & swords..... See after ....

Winter in Russia 1941/42 Medal. Original (45./65. US)

Wehrmacht Gold Close Combat Clasp- R.S. Marked, looks good to me. (1000./1800. US +/-). Rare!

Really bad one sided knights Cross.... Worthless.

Skull pennant. German mine marked pennant. (25./40. US)

Pair of German Schutzpolizei Meister (NCOs) Shoulder boards. (45./65. US)

Schutzpolizei sleeve eagle (65./90. US)

Pair of British or Norwegen Sgts. Chevron (??) but very little.

Back to the nice looking Knights Cross. Pictures are still bad. You need to completely remove the ribbon, take close-up clear pictures of the top of the cross, including the small ring in the center. Also take pictures of the front and back of the oak leaves and swords.... Use the best magnifier you have and see if you can see any markings.... The oak leaves should be marked, as should be the Knights Cross itself. When you very carefully reassemble it, turn the oak leaves so the swords are on the bottom.... Not hard to do, just be patient and careful. No estimate on this one yet.

Knights Crosses are a minefield....many excellent fakes out there.
John G.

User avatar
eindhoven
Member
Posts: 560
Joined: 15 Apr 2004 17:54

Re: Found these in a box, is it real?

Post by eindhoven » 21 Sep 2019 15:58

The oakleaves with swords are bad. On original examples the swords never touch the Oakleaves. The only exception to this is Oakleaves with diamonds and swords. Cast pieces like yours will due to the low quality of repros back then. As stated they are displayed incorrectly upside down. They should be oriented in the manner below.
MVC-009F-600x450.jpg
Look at the seam between the two parts of the knights cross. If it is smooth, with no black line, the cross itself might be good but I have doubts. Real ones were silver soldered and were of the same high quality silver as the cross. Fakes are lead soldered which over time leaves a black line between the frames and yours shows oxidation typical of fakes. The toning to the frame: Real knights crosses were higher silver content frames and loop, typically 800 silver and 200 other, same as coin silver for strength. Some were even 900 content with 1000 being pure silver. The toning that is typical of this silver is absent. Another key detail is the appearance of what looks like bubbles on the lower part of the frame. This occurs in casting due to unequal heat and then cooling in the mold or if an uncleaned mold is used.

I agree your other awards are original. It is common in collections to find a mix of good and bad.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

User avatar
matthew4108
Member
Posts: 131
Joined: 18 Jul 2013 17:27

Re: Found these in a box, is it real?

Post by matthew4108 » 21 Sep 2019 21:12

Heie.Lee wrote:
31 Aug 2019 10:48
Anybody that can identify the round thing in the photo. That was not in the box, maybe it is just part of the shirt?Image
Judging by what looks like its hanger on top, it might be an early paper tinnie, similar to the one below.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

Return to “Other WW1 & WW2 Militaria”